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Coffee linked to slower biological ageing among those with severe mental illness
- renewiltord 11mo agoEven the ones born not on Mondays between 0700 and 1100?
- brikym 11mo agoLiking coffee linked to ...
- jagged-chisel 11mo agoIs this a quote? Or your own take?
- brikym 11mo agoMy own take. The point is that the link may be the other way around. The population of people who tend to drink coffee might age slower. Perhaps due to some third variable like wealth or race. Correlation is not causation.
- jama211 11mo agoThese studies are often questionable at best, but usually they make some attempt to control for those things, did you check if they did in the study?
- lowdest 11mo agoDo you like sweets? I noticed as I became an adult sometime in my mid-20s, I stopped liking sweet flavors as much and developed a new appreciation for bitter flavors. Like coffee and some vegetables.
- silisili 11mo agoMy tastes changed a lot over the years. I quit liking sweets in my early 20s, I rarely even have sugar in the house. Sometime in my late 30s I started appreciating more nuanced flavors, including black coffee, but mostly vegetables like green beans, tomatoes, asparagus, peas, carrots. Once that happened, I started realizing how much food is blasted with so much salt that obliterates said flavors. I assume it's mostly normal, as a kid I found my parents tastes bland...ew who could eat vegetables by themselves with no seasoning? Well, me now apparently...
- ssl-3 11mo agoSame. There was a time when my diet was consistently full of very sweet things -- in particular, with beverages: More soda? Another mocha latte swimming in sugar? Another quart of orange juice? Yes, please. But also food: How can a person walk past a selection of fresh donuts without having one? Eventually, for reasons that initially were budgetary more than anything else, I discovered some coffee that I really liked the natural flavor of at a local place. I started getting that -- plain, black -- instead of a latte, mostly because $2.10 is a lot less than $3.75. That coffee was Ethiopian Yirgacheffe. This particular one had its own distinct, subtle sweetness that hit the spot for me and was part of a basically-daily feel-good routine for years until their roaster stopped selling it. But by then, I was a black coffee convert. And I didn't even notice at the time, but I'd also stopped buying soda in bulk -- it became a rare entity in my life instead of a daily fixation. I also stopped buying things like cookies and donuts. I began to skip the pie at gatherings. That all happened in my 30s. Nowadays, motivated only by what I feel like eating or drinking instead of some desire to make healthy choices or something, my intake is good-tasting spring water (the tap water here sometimes tastes of mud), decent black coffee, inexpensive tea, and [of course] beer. My food has taken a turn for the bland, too. I buy carrots and celery at the store to munch on, instead of a bag of cookies. Things like rice and beans and fish have an abundance of flavor that I wasn't able to appreciate before. For gatherings, I make a big relish tray full of fresh vegetables -- and I munch on them more than anyone else does. I seldom buy breakfast cereal now, but I used to eat a lot of it -- and I'd load it up with more sugar. Last year I did buy some store-brand raisin bran but I found that it was too much of a sugar bomb to really enjoy as a meal. I couldn't make myself finish it; most of it wound up in the compost. (I did find some very plain bran flakes that I liked a lot better -- 12-year-old me would not have been impressed.) This is all a bit weird to describe because the only deliberate decision involved was to try to save a bit of money on coffee-house coffee in my 30s. But did that decision actually have anything to do with it? Or is this instead a tale as old as time itself, wherein: Tastes simply change? (But yeah, I do enjoy an occasional sugar bomb. But only literally-occasionally. For instance: A single 12-ounce bottle of Coke is very nice sometimes. I probably drink as many as 2 or 3 of those in a whole year.)
- empressplay 11mo agoWithout any documentation of actual caffeine consumption this study is completely worthless.
- micromacrofoot 11mo agohow could it be worthless when it inspired such a valuable comment
- djaouen 11mo agoAs someone formally diagnosed with one of these mental illnesses, I can confidently say that coffee triggers a beneficial reaction to my illness as well as to other health-adjoint mechanisms in my body. To me, drinking coffee is like breathing air or eating food, and to go without it means symptom flare-ups.
- temp0826 11mo agoSounds more like dependence/addiction to me
- GreekPete 11mo ago100% but people hate to admit it.
- jama211 11mo agoI think what people hate to admit even less is that being judgmental like you are doing gives people a small power trip.
- jama211 11mo agoIt’s not a disorder unless it’s causing problems in your life, definitionally. By that logic people are addicted to any medication they take long term that helps them manage any health condition. Hell, I must be addicted to eye drops because when I don’t use them I get dry eyes more often. Is that addiction/dependence? We must be careful not to find ways to be judgemental whether intentionally or not, especially when something is non-harmful and helpful to their life. It’s not a good behavioural pattern.
- temp0826 11mo agoRelief of existing symptoms is one thing, relief of withdrawal symptoms caused by the lack of the substance is another. Stopping use of your eyedrops is not the root cause of your dry eyes. (Cry me a river :) I wouldn't consider that comment judgmental...definitely not as much as talking about people's "behavioral patterns" after reading a single sentence comment anyways)
- ares623 11mo agoLots of coffee related articles reaching the front page recently.
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- ekjhgkejhgk 11mo agoIf I had severe mental illness I'd be immortal by now.
- indubioprorubik 11mo agoThere can only be one. Or two. Maybe three. Four shoots espresso a day.
- dentemple 11mo agoI have ADHD, and I drink 2-3 cups' worth of coffee every day. I'm basically a vampire now.
- doubled112 11mo agoYesterday I drank a whole pot myself then had another cup or two. Keeps me in the game. Where does that put me? Caffeine poisoning or immortality with no in between?
- lostlogin 11mo ago> Too much coffee reduced this positive effect
- doubled112 11mo agoWell, I guess I have to die of something someday.
- devilsdata 11mo agoI've been self-medicating ADHD with multiple cups of coffee a day since I was 17. I'm in my early 30s now, and after getting on Vyvanse, have reduced then given up coffee. I realised that coffee was the reason for my anxiety which builds up towards the end of the day. I reduced my coffee down to 1 espresso per day two months ago, and quit entirely two weeks ago. I'm still on stimulants, but Vyvanse treats ADHD much better and has fewer side-effects.
- nrhrjrjrjtntbt 11mo agoDue to caffiene or something else?
- aetherspawn 11mo agoI think not the caffeine. The beneficial/healthy parts of coffee tend to be the coffee itself.
- zafka 11mo agoI wonder if what seems like much higher margins in coffee allow for more articles like this. While I want what they are saying to be true, I wish I did not have to pay $15.00 for a 26 ounce can of coffee.
- rottencupcakes 11mo ago$10/lb sounds very reasonable for a grown, hand picked, fermented, washed, dried, shipped, roasted, packaged, and delivered seed.
- stinkbeetle 11mo agoCoffee is not really hand picked. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCOMM84jhZg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCOMM84jhZg The cost of raw coffee has nearly tripled in 18 months, that's what's driven the price increases. That has not been due to the cost of processing and shipping so much as poor coffee growing seasons in major growing areas reducing primary production. Though growing, processing, and transport inputs have all suffered a lot of inflation in the past 5 years too, to be sure.
- rottencupcakes 11mo agoFYI I researched this a bit. Most coffee is hand-picked, with Brazil (featured in the video), being the exception. Brazil is generally known for mass production low quality coffee grown at a lower altitude, which might be what you find in a can like grandparent said, but is less popular in the more premium scenes.
- orphea 11mo agoThis is not expensive. In my part of the world I'm paying $15-20 for 250 g (9 oz).
- xethos 11mo agoArguably one of you just has better taste in coffee, especially at ~$10/lb
- devilsdata 11mo agoIs it possible that this phenomenon is specific to people with those mental illnesses? A wider general population study resulted in the inverse effect: https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/15/6/1354 https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/15/6/1354 I only did a postgraduate degree, so I don't have the practice reading scientific studies to determine which is true. Maybe someone with more knowledge can chime in?
- tootie 11mo agoNo, it affects everybody. Says so in the article. The distinction appears to be that severe mental illness is associated with shortened lifespan so coffee has a more profound anti-aging affect on that population.
- devilsdata 11mo agoInteresting. I wonder if that extends to any stimulant, or if it's something particular with caffeine and coffee. With that said, the fact that the other study seemed to find the opposite conclusion concerns me.
- tootie 11mo agoWhat other studies?
- foota 11mo agoIdk about the op study, but I could imagine confounders with instant coffee consumption.
- devilsdata 11mo agoTrue, and it could also be what the person has with the coffee. I have a feeling people that drink instant coffee are more likely to add milk, creamer, or sugar. That said, instant coffee is just freeze-dried coffee. There's a possibility its effect is no different.
- NedF 11mo ago> within the NHS recommended limit Over the NHS recommended limit is better than zero caffeine for everyone. If their limit is correct is in question Whether "those with severe mental illness" get more benefit seems unlikely biologically. But like everyone coffee is good for you. The only point of research like this, since we know coffee is good, is finding the mechanisms. But it's highly open to p-hacking/experimental error, which is how universities work now. You should default to this is citation farming.
- tug2024 11mo ago[dead]
- jmonty900 11mo agoI sure liked the first half of this title.
- chickensong 11mo agoJust enjoy some news and doom scrolling with your morning cuppa ;)
- DaveZale 11mo agoyup it's true, and as some point out, consumption in the early morning, when we all get a proinflammatory, normal response, is perfect timing for the antioxidant flood of coffee to counteract it all. The rest of the day is another story, every day! Hopefully one of the better stories.
- 0_____0 11mo agoI've been starting days with a bowl 2/3rds full of frozen blueberries (microwaved 2mins to soften) plus greek yogurt and a dash of maple syrup. It's a lot of blueberries. But I can afford $60/month in frozen blueberries. Plus they're tasty. Also antioxidants or whatever.
- onionisafruit 11mo agoThat was my routine for a few years to ward off huntington’s disease. I don’t think the science panned out for blueberries and huntington’s, but in the mean time I got old enough to realize I didn’t have the genes for it (yes I was too cowardly to be tested)
- 0_____0 11mo agoAnd you got to eat a ton of tasty berries in the meantime! Also congrats on getting old :) happy for you.
- NegativeLatency 11mo ago> coffee consumption within the NHS recommended limit
- tompccs 11mo agoThat title smells of p-hacking
- postsantum 11mo agoNo, that was stale robusta
- cj 11mo agoDirect link to study: https://mentalhealth.bmj.com/content/28/1/e301700 https://mentalhealth.bmj.com/content/28/1/e301700
- nelox 11mo ago[flagged]
- greekrich92 11mo agoThese AI posts are annoying
- cheschire 11mo agoThe posts or the AI replies to them?
- tomhow 11mo agoPlease stop. Article summaries have always been off topic on HN.
- nelox 11mo agoIt is a critique, not a summary. If you think it stops being one, point out where. I don’t take articles at face value, especially when it comes to science reporting. Journalists often overstate or oversimplify studies, so I read the actual paper. I highlighted what it really says, what it doesn’t say, and what the article adds that isn’t in the study at all. If an article misrepresents a paper’s core ideas, why shouldn’t that be called out? Misreporting confuses readers and undermines the authors’ work by failing to represent it accurately.
- stopbulying 11mo agoShould people be unequally denied caffeinenated coffee on the basis of medical status as determined by a physician they must pay? What about decaf only; 0.3% coffee? Is decaf linked to slower biological aging, too?
- ImHereToVote 11mo agoCoffee contains a bunch of healthy compounds. Quercetin for one. A bunch of other flavonoids.
- DiabloD3 11mo agoCoffee, the brew, is not a significant source of Quercetin. The grounds, the part you throw away, may be. But capers are like ~200mg per 100g, and outpaces all the other common sources of it, so if you were really big on Quercetin, you'd be looking at anything but coffee.
- ImHereToVote 11mo agoI do. I use Quercetin as my source of Quercetin.
- low_tech_punk 11mo agoIs it possible that the coffee drinkers have more social interaction with the barista and others? It's unclear from the paper if they eliminated the confounding factors around coffee drinking.
- agnishom 11mo agoDo people have social interactions with their barista?
- Zambyte 11mo agoYes
- a5c11 11mo agoWhat other social interactions are needed more than: "One flat white to go, please", and "Thank you"? Asking genuinely, because I don't know what else I can say.
- jlaternman 11mo agoLots of things. “Could I have some sugar, please; two frappy mochachos? one with almond milk; can you explain what all these options are, please; what the hell is mushroom powder?” In today’s coffee shops this can lead to hours of complex social interaction at the counter, enriching our lives and ultimately extending our lifespans. — sorry, couldn’t resist. In seriousness, I actually find this conversation interesting. Some coffee shops do have quite a social culture around them, though I think they’re outliers on whole. Here in Spain it’s a mix, but in some it is like everyone’s friends with the barista.
- twodave 11mo agoI usually make coffee at home, but the baristas are remarkably stable in my area. When I do go to a coffee shop (there are 2-3 that I might go to) there’s a good chance I’ll recognize the barista and that they’ll also remember me. In one such case I’ve been seeing the same one for close to a decade, and we always chat for a bit. I think most baristas who do it for more than a year or two learn to not primarily be a coffee factory but first to make a positive impact on the people they see. The coffee is something that can be made consistent (and in a way, boring) through practice, but personal connection, especially when it is genuine, has a real draw.
- kuipferings 11mo ago3-4 cups of coffee is the exact amount you need to get through a workday, and only lower class types drink instant coffee. All of these studies are hot garbage, hopelessly confounded, the biggest scam in science is "controlling for". Do an RCT and watch the coffee magic evaporate.
- brokensegue 11mo agoRCTs are expensive and sometimes possible. We do these studies first. The paper says >Our study suggests the importance of further research investigating the role of coffee consumption in biological ageing.
- mentos 11mo agoMy complete layman’s theory is because it acts as an appetite suppressant and calories consumed is a strong indicator of cell turnover and aging.
- Rebelgecko 11mo agoMy theory is that people with more severe mental illnesses are less likely to have their lives together enough to make coffee multiple times per day
- tim333 11mo agoThe study doesn't seem to try to distinguish cause and effect. It may be that people who feel better are more likely to go for coffee. That issue comes up quite often in alcohol studies - if you plot alcohol consumption against health the people who drink quite a lot are amongst the healthiest but the effect there is pretty much that drinking is fun but you have to be healthy to take it.
- rightbyte 11mo agoSure but wont alcohole have a more obvious "I don't feel well maybe I should not drink too much" effect? And care takers when you are really bad will hand you coffee but not beer. Etc.
- dyauspitr 11mo agoWhat do you mean people that drink a lot are the healthiest.
- tim333 11mo agoIt just tends to come out that way. Not the very healthiest but in my case for example I drank quite a lot in my 20s/30s when I was fit. Now I can't drink much and am not in as good a health (60s).
- jama211 11mo agoI’m rightfully dubious of studies like this. Too many variables. They stated what they controlled for, but it wasn’t all that much, and doesn’t have any clue at all mechanism. For all we know it could be that people who drink coffee are less stressed and it’s stress that ages you. Or people who drink coffee work outside less. Or own more frogs. I dunno. Just annoyed that studies like this get so much attention compared to studies that provide more value.
- tsoukase 11mo agoSince PCs became strong enough to analyse a few thousand rows of a spreadsheet, a lot of such observational (meta) analyses popped up linking an arbitrary environmental factor with a catchy target (death or well being). With such, they imply but never admit someone could hack his whole health status with a simple intervention, which obviously is not valid for any random subject. Such studies I categorise in click baity science, as they profoundly seek public attention.
- djaowjxj 11mo ago[dead]