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After 15 years, I use Outlook as my build pipeline
- Traubenfuchs 11mo ago[flagged]
- dxdm 11mo agoMom, didn't we talk about not posting to hacker news when you're like this?
- afavour 11mo agoWait, my docker registry has no authorization? Uh oh
- Traubenfuchs 11mo agoThe executing system provides an authenticated kubectl.
- dijit 11mo agoYes, all development is just backend web development and CRUD apps. If you're doing anything else, are you really an engineer? bwahaha.
- fHr 11mo agoyeah sure....
- pprotas 11mo agoIf your build pipeline is anything more than a monkey scratching bits into a spinning disk using a needle, you are a fraud.
- dctoedt 11mo ago> If your build pipeline is anything more than a monkey scratching bits into a spinning disk using a needle, you are a fraud. Obligatory XKCD cite: https://xkcd.com/378/ https://xkcd.com/378/
- rmonvfer 11mo agoUses kubernetes, blames others for over engineering. Are we living in a parody? Oh wait…
- worthless-trash 11mo agoFor a moment there I thought this was the parody llm HN site.
- probably_wrong 11mo agoNo plan survives contact with the enemy. Sure, "docker push" is all fine and well until "after two weeks, [your] coworker still does not have access to the server endpoint that he and [you] would need". And then what? Do you quit your job for fear that someone calls you a hack?
- skinner927 11mo agoThankfully k8s is not overengineered or you’d have pie on your face.
- slackfan 11mo agoIf your build pipeline is anything more than a deploy.sh file containing go build binary scp binary root@server:/deploymentlocation you are a hack, a fraud, an overengineer and someone who should NOT work as software or devops engineer.
- formerly_proven 11mo agoLook what “real” devops engineers have demanded respect for. They have played us for absolute fools!
- Traubenfuchs 11mo ago2 commands -that‘s 33% better than my solution!
- Atotalnoob 11mo agoThere are so many issues with what you have here… where to start… You aren’t running tests, unless you put them in the dockerfile which is a bad idea… You aren’t running security scans. how do you deploy manifest changes? Using Latest as a tag has so many issues. This is a trivial and niave pipeline I would expect from a junior or intern. Build pipelines are becoming more complicated because software is more complex. You can still promote ownership of the full pipeline while giving developers control. Don’t shy away from it, understand it, embrace it. It’s just going to continue getting more complex
- Traubenfuchs 11mo agoAdding steps for code quality scanning, dependency vulnerability analysis and a license scanner certainly makes it look like you actually achieved something in the next performance review, I will give you that.
- micahdeath 11mo agoI like [x]copy deployments personally, then you have 1 command =)
- Traubenfuchs 11mo agoI bow! We had that at my first job where I deployed .war to a remote production tomcat directly from eclipse with one tool button click. Zero lines of code even, depending on definition.
- ptdorf 11mo agoPeople don't get sarcarm :/ Totally unrelated, if you need to suffix a k8s deployment with "-deployment" you are a hack, a fraud, an overengineer and someone who should NOT work as software or devops engineer.
- dxdm 11mo ago> People don't get sarcarm :/ Famously so. If you want to remain unmisunderstood, make sure to use sarcasm. Draw a clear line into the shifting sand while cocking a single eyebrow. It's widely appreciated, it's an artform, and the comments are a blast. :)
- Proofread0592 11mo agoAs a dev currently working at a company where getting an access request fulfilled can sometimes take weeks, I feel this author's pain. But it seems like an enormous security hole, even with a codeword "password". The author didn't mention it, but I hope they're using whatever version of their company's E2E email encryption is for these messages.
- yabones 11mo agoYeah, this is textbook "shadow IT" that could easily lead to something going seriously wrong. It's a fun example, but not something to aspire to. Ultimately the problem is that in a lot of big corps, IT is basically unaccountable for setting things up wrong. Their only KPI is tickets closed, not the quality or success rate of their fixes.
- thewebguyd 11mo agoI've always felt that if business types can get over their fetish for trying to measure absolutely everything, we wouldn't have problems like these that stem from poorly thought out KPIs. They default to tickets closed, uptime, SLA adherence as KPIs because you can't effectively measure "is it set up correctly?" and because the business absolutely must measure everything, they come up with bullshit KPIs so they can have a pretty dashboard and pretend like they're actually managing. Glad I'm no longer in huge corps, but still an IT manager. Shadow IT is a direct symptom of IT not providing the right tools or having poor processes. But responsibility still lies higher up in the chain. If we weren't forced to quantify all activity, these issues wouldn't exist.
- grvdrm 11mo agoTicket closing and KPI chasing is alive and well in small companies too. I have a client (less than 100 folks) that has a JIRA reporting process on par (and as bad as) as F500 company. Seems to geared towards tracking work and increasing accountable behavior. But then the consultant overseeing it (not me) sent a Claude generated report with some sort of JIRA ticket dump as input. All the tickets closed were in fact not done or not relevant. But they were “closed” in JIRA. Same thing with completed tickets. Embarrassing work product and embarrassment for the company.
- fHr 11mo agothat guy is a fuckin legend
- corysama 11mo agoI knew a guy who would brag that he used Outlook as his build system 20 years ago. Builds would take 9 to 24 months depending on the complexity of the project. But, as the CTO of a mid-sized software company, it worked for him.
- ebiester 11mo agoCTOs are the original vibe coders.
- klooney 11mo agoOther than the theme, what's the difference between typing what you want into Slack and maybe getting it can typing it into ChatGPT and maybe getting it?
- ramon156 11mo ago> Builds would take 9 to 24 months depending on the complexity of the project. I might be stupid, are you saying a build would take 9 to 24 months to finish?
- wiether 11mo agoYeah, it confused me also Either its the wrong unit (minutes?) or the wrong definition of "build"?
- gdulli 11mo agoThey're saying he used Outlook to assign a project to a team.
- uliqquel 11mo agoMaybe the build system was him sending the email to some factory that would encode it into the silicon of a chip and ship the chip back to him.
- afavour 11mo agoMemories of waiting for months to get access to a MS SQL database and ending up putting an Access database on a network share for multiple user access instead. A horrible, horrible hack solution. But it worked!
- wswope 11mo agoI volunteered at an archaeology lab run by the state govt a few months ago. Knowing I was a data engineer, one of the archaeologists asked me to take a look at the cataloging system he’d cobbled together on his own: a shared-drive Access database with a full-featured CRUD interface that the whole office had been using for years. I was able to clean up one stray bug he had, and confirm his suspicion that one particular action was running slow because it had to touch multiple files by necessity (he’d rolled his own sharding) — but generally speaking, it was a work of art more effective than anything I could’ve ever come up with. Sometimes the “dirty hacks” are the best solutions.
- skydhash 11mo agoThe avoidance of dirty hacks are not because they don’t work. They do and can be pretty X-effective when you’re short on X. But the end result is that when you need to switch away from the hacks, then the interest paid on X can be enormous. If X includes time, it may never be repaid.
- WorldMaker 11mo agoDirectly related to which is the tech debt that accumulates just by using Access files in a shared folder. Access wasn't intended to work that way. It is documented in many places in Access' manuals to never do that. But it works and most versions of Access don't warn you when they detect you are using a shared folder, so most Access users don't question it. But I have seen the maintenance burden first hand of solving weird Access lock file problems (if I never have to manually find and delete an .LDB file again, that would be great) and silent corruption issues and more. I've seen the workarounds of auto-backups of the shared folder and then auto-restores of those backups when silly things happen like the .MDB file is not the expected file size. There's a special "joy" in needing to know the many under-the-hood versions of Access files and seeing apps that consume and/or produce more than one version at a time. That's just to maintain existing "apps", trying to migrate that data to modern databases for new apps is its own "joy" as well.
- pwdisswordfishs 11mo ago[dead]
- Jean-Papoulos 11mo ago>Shoddy stuff that has no chance of making its way into production is permissible That's cute.
- easterncalculus 11mo agoI don't know if Telegram, Slack, Discord, GitHub Actions, GitLab CI, Jenkins, or Kubernetes will be around (or without massive breaking changes) in 20 years, but email absolutely will be.
- throw-the-towel 11mo agoTIL that Jenkins was only released in 2011. Feels like it's been around since forever.
- wiether 11mo agoIf you're like me, in your mind Hudson and Jenkins are the same thing, so maybe you started using "Jenkins" before 2011 when the renaming happened!
- hshdhdhj4444 11mo agoI think that might be because it was called Hudson before that I believe. Unless that was a different project altogether?
- usrusr 11mo agoSame project, rebranded around Oracle. Basically MySQL/MariaDB without the alliteration.
- TechSquidTV 11mo ago2011 was a huge year for tech/devops. I feel like so much of what we do now started right then for some reason.
- deleted 11mo ago[deleted]
- arein3 11mo agoMight need to implement this at current project but with Teams
- homeonthemtn 11mo agoRealest post I've read in a long time Hacky is as hacky does.
- jbverschoor 11mo ago/Mail/Messaging in SMTP, and you have what it is: A message broker and queue. It has durability, retries, everything
- bux93 11mo agoSMTP is even a transport for SOAP It was really fun using filters in Pegasus Mail (no SOAP) to automate mailing lists, PGP key signing with e-mail validation etc.
- philo_sophia 11mo ago>When you leave software developers alone for too long, they start developing software I've gotten so bored at work lately I've been coding for fun again
- noman-land 11mo agoWhat job do you have that you get paid to do nothing?
- foepys 11mo agoSometimes it's not about doing nothing but only being allowed to do the same stuff over and over again to do because there is "no budget" to rewrite the codebase to automate the process.
- adastra22 11mo agoThis is horrifying.
- FuriouslyAdrift 11mo agoYou can use git as a backend for an MTA and come full circle...
- rAum 11mo agoLong ago, I used to work at some bank, where SVN branch merging was always super painful and instead of solving people problem, there was holy, e-mail based system running on our common dev machines. After recieving properly formatted email, script was executed to apply git merge between svn branches. In case of merge issues, the email was sent back with feedback. If everything was okay, a proper sign-off blessing by one of the technopriests as late check was applied and merge concluded.
- 1970-01-01 11mo agoGood. The next step is turning that into an OS. From there, you should be able to take it further and fully support virtualization.
- TechSquidTV 11mo agoI can not believe blogspot is still alive. I just went there and it auto-signed me in via my Google account to "Blogger" where there are some posts from Google's blogspot. The last post was in 2020 https://blogger.googleblog.com/ https://blogger.googleblog.com/
- iwriteaboutcode 11mo agoIt should receive a badge of honor because even Google can't kill it! Honestly though, it's pretty damn good for just hosting a blog, surprisingly many options. A bit weird to write in, so I write externally, but pretty fully featured for what I need.
- frankfrank13 11mo ago> In industrial scale software development, gaining access you are fully entitled to can sometimes take weeks. 4 years in consulting. I've spent the first WEEKS of a project twiddling my thumbs waiting for a laptop, just to spend more weeks waiting on access to source code, tooling, etc. My friends on the strategy side could start and finish entire projects in that time.
- john-carter 11mo ago[dead]
- m3047 11mo agoIt's been over 20 years, but I used to build batch processing pipelines using SMTP (not Outlook). Biggest "choose your own adventure" aspect is accounting / auditing (making sure you didn't lose batches). I still joke about it as an option; although if somebody took me up on it I'd write up at least a semi-serious proposal. In the middle are Mule, Rabbit, Kafka, ZMQ. At the other end is UDP multicast, and I still use that for VM hosts or where I can trust the switch.