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> competition We don’t need competition in insulin production. It is a know quantity with fixed and closed quality parameters. Fix the price and let suppliers
by rusk 11mo ago
> competition
We don’t need competition in insulin production. It is a know quantity with fixed and closed quality parameters. Fix the price and let suppliers compete on cost.
- pastage 11mo agoThere are many kinds of insulin variants on the market. The easy way to differentiate them is by release rate and duration. Gone in an hour for some and 24hours for others. There are other factors as well that make them incompatible with each other.
- rusk 11mo agoAll clearly categorised and regulated. Fill the boxes and ship em and STFU
- purple_turtle 11mo agoThe problem in USA is that producing insuline is so regulated that setting up and maintaining production is obnoxiously expensive. Note that if you cause by regulation or stupid laws something to be expensive to produce/import and then make it illegal to sell above that price - then you will get shortages. As noone will want to produce insuline if required paperwork costs more than it's selling price. Note that even if currently adding more regulation to solve problems caused by more regulation will not cause it, it may happen in future. US healthcare regulations are on Nth round of that.
- rusk 11mo ago> setting up and maintaining production is obnoxiously expensive. This is what I meant by compete on cost. The manufacturers that are best at cutting these costs will make the most profit. That’s where competition should be focused on such generic items.
- mexicocitinluez 11mo agoNone of this is while insulin is so expensive in the US. None of it. We've been producing insulin for 100 years now. You guys are just making things up and it's wild. I don't think a single person who is claiming that regulation is driving up insulin prices has even Googled it to make sure what they're saying makes sense. Spoiler alert: It's not. The cost of insulin is a result of monopolies, pharmacy benefit managers, patents, and most importantly: a LACK of regulation on drug prices.
- fragmede 11mo agoWe will have to wait see where it goes, but California is trying to make their own insulin, so starting January 1st, 2025 you can buy a pack for $55 a as a resident.
- purple_turtle 11mo ago2026?
- fragmede 11mo agoyes, thanks.
- toofy 11mo ago> The problem in USA is that producing insuline is so regulated that setting up and maintaining production is obnoxiously expensive. i don’t buy it. no other oecd nation has insulin prices as absurd as the us. this is a greed problem. the only people to blame when the government starts producing insulin will be the pharmaceutical companies and their refusal to be decent members of society. if they were even a tiny fraction more decent they wouldn’t be in the mess they’re directly causing. far too often companies are directly to blame for regulation as they repeatedly absolutely refuse to self-regulate and be decent pieces of society.
- 0xDEAFBEAD 11mo ago>this is a greed problem. I'll take it even further, if you look at the price of goods over time, it's even possible to see the ebb and flow of greed in the numbers: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/G5Qi8_vXwAAbRTn.jpg?name=orig https://pbs.twimg.com/media/G5Qi8_vXwAAbRTn.jpg?name=orig I wonder if prices are really a measurement of fluctuations in some underlying supernatural or cosmic psychic force?
- purple_turtle 11mo ago> this is a greed problem. Also that. But overregulation makes too hard for others to compete and offer cheaper insulin.
- rusk 11mo agoWhich may also be expressed as an expectation for a particular quality at a particular cost. There are no deadweights to exploit in insulin production. It seems to some people that regulation is the deadweight but without that quality guarantee you’re dependent on suppliers which duplicates the cost of “self regulation” across the sector.
- sophrosyne42 11mo agoGreed explains nothing. People will be greedy when they are incentivized to be greedy, and thrifty when they are incentivized to be thrifty. There are plenty of incentives, I might add, for regulators to be greedy though.
- mexicocitinluez 11mo ago> The problem in USA is that producing insuline is so regulated that setting up and maintaining production is obnoxiously expensive. This has absolutely nothing to do with insulin costs. Nada. Zip. Nil. > As noone will want to produce insuline if required paperwork costs more than it's selling price. Where are you getting this information from? I've been in the industry for a bit now and this is a first for me. That the reason why insulin is so expensive in the US is because it costs money to make????
- 0xDEAFBEAD 11mo ago>This has absolutely nothing to do with insulin costs. Nada. Zip. Nil. Why do you think there are so few insulin producers then? https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2015/07/15/422935288/biohackers-aim-to-make-homebrew-insulin-but-dont-try-it-yet https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2015/07/15/4229352...
- mrguyorama 11mo agoHow many insulin producers are there in europe?
- rusk 11mo agoBecause it’s such a basic commodity with very little differentiation so profitability can only be achieved at scale.
- mexicocitinluez 11mo agoYou're sharing a 10 year old article to back up your claims? And the answer is because it's a monopoly that the govt refuses to regulate.
- sophrosyne42 11mo agoNothing has fixed and closed quality parameters. At least not if your concern is quality as understood by the people who want or need insulin as opposed to whatever arbitrary standard a bureaucrat could make up.
- rusk 11mo ago> whatever arbitrary standard a bureaucrat You do know these people are scientific experts and have teams of scientific experts working for them, right. It’s not some blazing skulls stuffed shirt lol
- sophrosyne42 11mo agoNo amount of scientific expertise will turn a subjective thing (which is what product quality is) into an objective thing. Credible, ethical, and well-trained scientists should be able to recognize that and desist from dressing up their preferences into scientific dress and passing it off as the results of objective science.
- rusk 11mo ago> subjective thing There is nothing subjective about insulin quality you dimwit
- sophrosyne42 11mo agoThe quality of a product is subjective to the user of that product. This is a scientific fact of economics, and insistence otherwise is science denial.
- rusk 11mo agoThat’s why we have regulation LOL toxicity is not subjective Oh Lordy what has become of HN a load of fresh dummies with no grounding in the basic principles of libertarianism. All the fire none of the intellect. Just no sport.
- pipes 11mo agoThat would ensure that it is extremely unlikely we get innovation in insulin production as it removes the financial incentive to take the risk with innovation.
- zbentley 11mo agoPeople don't innovate to compete on cost?