4 ms·

I think current Element versions accept either a recovery key or recovery passphrase in the same input field, so there's no getting it wrong. Since you seem foc

by foresto 11mo ago

I think current Element versions accept either a recovery key or recovery passphrase in the same input field, so there's no getting it wrong. Since you seem focused on UI, it's worth noting that Element X (their beta mobile app) has a greatly simplified interface; their team clearly has been working to make it easier. Also, other clients exist. For whatever it's worth, I've been using Matrix for about five years, including some of its roughest times. I seldom see errors these days, but I can understand how folks who were frustrated with earlier iterations would still be soured to it. Such is the nature of an ambitious work in progress, I suppose. I use it because there is nothing else with the combination of features that are most important to me, and because (despite my gripes) I can see slow and steady improvement. I think it's moving in the right direction overall. I could picture introducing family members to it once Matrix 2.0 is released and the implementations shake out any early problems.

BrenBarn 11mo ago
> I can see slow and steady improvement. That is true, but what weakens my confidence is that the Element/Matrix team often doesn't present it that way. So much communication from them is about how it's amazing and great and the best messaging app in the world. If they presented it more like a typical slow-growth open source app I think they'd garner more goodwill. By setting high expectations they increase the likelihood of disappointment.
g-b-r 11mo ago
I tried the current Element and Element X. In short, the passphrase works with both and the recovery key with neither, specifically: Element classic has two separate fields; if I input the recovery key (in the correct field), I get told "Backup could not be decrypted with this PASSPHRASE: please verify that you entered the correct recovery passphrase." That's how it was the last time I used it, and if I'm not mistaken it's been for years. Element X has a single field, that supposedly takes both passphrases and recovery keys, but if I enter the recovery key I'm directed to a "Verify with another verified device" screen, even if I had logged out from all other sessions. Funnily, by the way, it seems that with Element X you can't do anything if you don't manage to get verified, there just doesn't seem to be a way to skip it. Furthermore, after signing out from Element X I'm unable to even just logging back in, I get an error ("Sorry, an error occurred") after I enter the credentials; even after clearing all the app's storage. Very, very weird. The new login-via-browser is pretty problematical, by the way, I could only make it work with Chrome.
- tcfhgj 11mo ago
  > Element X has a single field, that supposedly takes both passphrases and recovery keys, but if I enter the recovery key I'm directed to a "Verify with another verified device" screen, even if I had logged out from all other sessions. I have just tried this on Android. I am directed to 1) "Device verified - Now you can read or send messages securely, and ... - [Continue]" 2) "Help improve Element X ... [OK] [Not now]" 3) list of chats Element X Android fyi. No problems logging in using Firefox.
- foresto 11mo ago
  Since you didn't share all the details of your tests, I'm having trouble picturing how I could try reproducing what you did. (That's okay; I'm not an Element maintainer.) However, a couple of things occur to me: - No Matrix client that I know of supports setting both a randomly generated recovery key and recovery passphrase on the same account. So in order to test both, you would have to use a separate account for each. If you tried to test both on the same account, it's expected that one of the two would be rejected. - You didn't specify a platform, but since you wrote "Element classic", I guess you must mean Android or iOS. I used Element Desktop / Web to set up my accounts, which could explain why I saw different prompts. I hope you reported the error message referring to a passphrase when a key had been entered. I imagine that could leave the user wondering whether they had made a typo or the app had misinterpreted what they typed, which would not inspire confidence in it.

by foresto 11mo ago

BrenBarn 11mo ago

> I can see slow and steady improvement. That is true, but what weakens my confidence is that the Element/Matrix team often doesn't present it that way. So much communication from them is about how it's amazing and great and the best messaging app in the world. If they presented it more like a typical slow-growth open source app I think they'd garner more goodwill. By setting high expectations they increase the likelihood of disappointment.

g-b-r 11mo ago

I tried the current Element and Element X. In short, the passphrase works with both and the recovery key with neither, specifically: Element classic has two separate fields; if I input the recovery key (in the correct field), I get told "Backup could not be decrypted with this PASSPHRASE: please verify that you entered the correct recovery passphrase." That's how it was the last time I used it, and if I'm not mistaken it's been for years. Element X has a single field, that supposedly takes both passphrases and recovery keys, but if I enter the recovery key I'm directed to a "Verify with another verified device" screen, even if I had logged out from all other sessions. Funnily, by the way, it seems that with Element X you can't do anything if you don't manage to get verified, there just doesn't seem to be a way to skip it. Furthermore, after signing out from Element X I'm unable to even just logging back in, I get an error ("Sorry, an error occurred") after I enter the credentials; even after clearing all the app's storage. Very, very weird. The new login-via-browser is pretty problematical, by the way, I could only make it work with Chrome.

tcfhgj 11mo ago
> Element X has a single field, that supposedly takes both passphrases and recovery keys, but if I enter the recovery key I'm directed to a "Verify with another verified device" screen, even if I had logged out from all other sessions. I have just tried this on Android. I am directed to 1) "Device verified - Now you can read or send messages securely, and ... - [Continue]" 2) "Help improve Element X ... [OK] [Not now]" 3) list of chats Element X Android fyi. No problems logging in using Firefox.
foresto 11mo ago
Since you didn't share all the details of your tests, I'm having trouble picturing how I could try reproducing what you did. (That's okay; I'm not an Element maintainer.) However, a couple of things occur to me: - No Matrix client that I know of supports setting both a randomly generated recovery key and recovery passphrase on the same account. So in order to test both, you would have to use a separate account for each. If you tried to test both on the same account, it's expected that one of the two would be rejected. - You didn't specify a platform, but since you wrote "Element classic", I guess you must mean Android or iOS. I used Element Desktop / Web to set up my accounts, which could explain why I saw different prompts. I hope you reported the error message referring to a passphrase when a key had been entered. I imagine that could leave the user wondering whether they had made a typo or the app had misinterpreted what they typed, which would not inspire confidence in it.