4 ms·

Failure scenario in modern fission reactors is also benign. Reactors are designed to lock down to prevent any leaks. We deploy solar PV capacity, this doesn't

Failure scenario in modern fission reactors is also benign. Reactors are designed to lock down to prevent any leaks. We deploy solar PV capacity, this doesn't mean we actually get that much power from the deployments. Nuclear fission provides reliable, baseload power, and doesn't require huge battery arrays to compensate for the sun setting or winds calming.

toomuchtodo 11mo ago
Enough renewables are deployed annually to replace the global nuclear fission fleet, year after year, even when accounting for capacity factor derating (to make a like for like comparison). The race is over, and renewables (with batteries) won. If you can find someone unsophisticated to invest in a fission reactor that takes billions of dollars and 10-15 years to build, more power to you. There will be no need for it by 2035-2040 when it prepares to send its first kwh to the grid. (and to stay on topic for this thread, geothermal is a component of this when geothermal potential exists, cost is competitive, and dispatachability is a requirement to push out fossil generation in concert with renewables, hydro, legacy nuclear, battery storage discharge, and demand response) https://www.google.com/search?q=baseload+is+a+myth https://www.google.com/search?q=baseload+is+a+myth https://cleantechnica.com/2025/11/15/coal-killing-sodium-ion-energy-storage-is-coming-to-kill-your-coal-power-plants/ https://cleantechnica.com/2025/11/15/coal-killing-sodium-ion... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/q3-global-power-report-no-fossil-fuel-growth-expected-in-2025/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/q3-global-power-rep... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/chapter-1-how-batteries-will-unlock-solars-true-po/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e... https://world-nuclear.org/information-library/economic-aspects/economics-of-nuclear-power https://world-nuclear.org/information-library/economic-aspec... https://www.lazard.com/research-insights/levelized-cost-of-energyplus-lcoeplus/ https://www.lazard.com/research-insights/levelized-cost-of-e... https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/solar-pv-prices https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/solar-pv-prices https://ourworldindata.org/battery-price-decline https://ourworldindata.org/battery-price-decline https://ourworldindata.org/data-insights/solar-panel-prices-have-fallen-by-around-20-every-time-global-capacity-doubled https://ourworldindata.org/data-insights/solar-panel-prices-... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44513185 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44513185 (lfp battery storage cost citation in 2025)
- yawaramin 11mo ago
  > If you can find someone unsophisticated to invest in a fission reactor that takes billions of dollars and 10-15 years to build Unsophisticated investors like the Chinese government? 'Nearly every Chinese nuclear project that has entered service since 2010 has achieved construction in 7 years or less.' https://thebreakthrough.org/issues/energy/chinas-impressive-rate-of-nuclear-construction https://thebreakthrough.org/issues/energy/chinas-impressive-...
  - toomuchtodo 11mo ago
    They dabble in nuclear, but it is not their focus. China can do what the developed world cannot because they are a command economy with less expensive labor, which will only last for a bit longer due to their structural demographics. Unless the developed world no longer has labor regulations, developed world wages, and capital based allocation systems, my statement stands with regards to investment. If capital and labor does not matter, certainly, anything is possible (Paraoh demanding pyramids, for example). Your citation comes from an organization with pro nuclear bias. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Institute https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Institute Can China Break Nuclear Power’s Cost Curse—and What Can the US Learn? - https://rooseveltinstitute.org/blog/can-china-break-nuclear-powers-cost-curse/ https://rooseveltinstitute.org/blog/can-china-break-nuclear-... - September 17th, 2025 China built more solar power in the last 8 months than all the nuclear power built in the entire world in the entire history of human civilisation. And even if you adjust for utilisation rate to compare against nuclear utilisation China built more solar power generated per hour than all the nuclear power currently in operation generate in an hour - and did so in 12-18 months - https://bsky.app/profile/climatenews.bsky.social/post/3lggqudgejs23 https://bsky.app/profile/climatenews.bsky.social/post/3lggqu... - January 23, 2025 China is installing the wind and solar equivalent of five large nuclear power stations per week - https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2024-07-16/chinas-renewable-energy-boom-breaks-records/104086640 https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2024-07-16/chinas-renewa... - July 15th, 2024 Nuclear Continues To Lag Far Behind Renewables In China Deployments - https://cleantechnica.com/2024/01/12/nuclear-continues-to-lag-far-behind-renewables-in-china-deployments/ https://cleantechnica.com/2024/01/12/nuclear-continues-to-la... - January 12th, 2024 Nuclear Energy & Free Market Capitalism Aren’t Compatible - https://cleantechnica.com/2023/11/06/nuclear-energy-free-market-capitalism-arent-compatible/ https://cleantechnica.com/2023/11/06/nuclear-energy-free-mar... - November 6th, 2023 https://x.com/MoreBirths/status/1910780131318374524 https://x.com/MoreBirths/status/1910780131318374524 | https://archive.today/iu9jx https://archive.today/iu9jx (China demographics citation)
Spooky23 11mo ago
Nuclear is great, but it does require wheelbarrows of cash, and we don’t have a solution for waste products.
- yawaramin 11mo ago
  Things are more expensive when we keep reinventing the wheel and trying to do new things instead of just reusing proven designs. Remember that solar power also used to cost wheelbarrows of cash back in the day. When you do something repeatedly, it becomes less expensive over time. Nuclear is actually the leader in waste management. No other energy source has as complete a story. Eg what happens to solar panels when they EOL in 25 years? They go into landfills and leach toxic chemicals into the ground. These chemicals, like lead and cadmium are toxic forever. They have no 'half-life' in which their toxicity reduces.
  - toomuchtodo 11mo ago
    Solar panels are recycled at almost 100% of total materials. Redwood Materials (founded by Tesla's former CTO) has already established a supply chain to ingest and recycle EV and stationary storage batteries at scale. The problem is that the hardware is lasting longer than expected, and meaningful recycling volume does not yet exist. Conversely, ~95,000 metric tons of nuclear waste in the US does not have permanent storage or recycling solutions, as of this comment, and there is no plan for long term storage or recycling. Nuclear generation is experiencing a negative learning curve; we keep spending more the more we attempt to build it. (solar PV panels have a 25-30 year service life, at which point they will still produce power at ~80-85% initial rating, batteries have a 15-20 year service life, with sodium ion chemistries estimated to have up to 50 year service life assuming once daily cycling) https://www.epa.gov/hw/solar-panel-recycling https://www.epa.gov/hw/solar-panel-recycling https://www.energy.gov/eere/solar/articles/beyond-recycling-reducing-waste-solar-modules-theyre-even-made https://www.energy.gov/eere/solar/articles/beyond-recycling-... https://e360.yale.edu/features/solar-energy-panels-recycling https://e360.yale.edu/features/solar-energy-panels-recycling https://www.cnbc.com/2025/11/09/nuclear-power-energy-radioactive-waste-storage-disposal.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/11/09/nuclear-power-energy-radioac... https://www.gao.gov/nuclear-waste-disposal https://www.gao.gov/nuclear-waste-disposal https://decarbonization.visualcapitalist.com/visualizing-all-the-nuclear-waste-in-the-world/ https://decarbonization.visualcapitalist.com/visualizing-all... (nuclear power accounts for about 10% of electricity generation globally, as of this comment)

toomuchtodo 11mo ago

Enough renewables are deployed annually to replace the global nuclear fission fleet, year after year, even when accounting for capacity factor derating (to make a like for like comparison). The race is over, and renewables (with batteries) won. If you can find someone unsophisticated to invest in a fission reactor that takes billions of dollars and 10-15 years to build, more power to you. There will be no need for it by 2035-2040 when it prepares to send its first kwh to the grid. (and to stay on topic for this thread, geothermal is a component of this when geothermal potential exists, cost is competitive, and dispatachability is a requirement to push out fossil generation in concert with renewables, hydro, legacy nuclear, battery storage discharge, and demand response) https://www.google.com/search?q=baseload+is+a+myth https://www.google.com/search?q=baseload+is+a+myth https://cleantechnica.com/2025/11/15/coal-killing-sodium-ion-energy-storage-is-coming-to-kill-your-coal-power-plants/ https://cleantechnica.com/2025/11/15/coal-killing-sodium-ion... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/q3-global-power-report-no-fossil-fuel-growth-expected-in-2025/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/q3-global-power-rep... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e... https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/chapter-1-how-batteries-will-unlock-solars-true-po/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e... https://world-nuclear.org/information-library/economic-aspects/economics-of-nuclear-power https://world-nuclear.org/information-library/economic-aspec... https://www.lazard.com/research-insights/levelized-cost-of-energyplus-lcoeplus/ https://www.lazard.com/research-insights/levelized-cost-of-e... https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/solar-pv-prices https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/solar-pv-prices https://ourworldindata.org/battery-price-decline https://ourworldindata.org/battery-price-decline https://ourworldindata.org/data-insights/solar-panel-prices-have-fallen-by-around-20-every-time-global-capacity-doubled https://ourworldindata.org/data-insights/solar-panel-prices-... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44513185 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44513185 (lfp battery storage cost citation in 2025)

yawaramin 11mo ago
> If you can find someone unsophisticated to invest in a fission reactor that takes billions of dollars and 10-15 years to build Unsophisticated investors like the Chinese government? 'Nearly every Chinese nuclear project that has entered service since 2010 has achieved construction in 7 years or less.' https://thebreakthrough.org/issues/energy/chinas-impressive-rate-of-nuclear-construction https://thebreakthrough.org/issues/energy/chinas-impressive-...
- toomuchtodo 11mo ago
  They dabble in nuclear, but it is not their focus. China can do what the developed world cannot because they are a command economy with less expensive labor, which will only last for a bit longer due to their structural demographics. Unless the developed world no longer has labor regulations, developed world wages, and capital based allocation systems, my statement stands with regards to investment. If capital and labor does not matter, certainly, anything is possible (Paraoh demanding pyramids, for example). Your citation comes from an organization with pro nuclear bias. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Institute https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Institute Can China Break Nuclear Power’s Cost Curse—and What Can the US Learn? - https://rooseveltinstitute.org/blog/can-china-break-nuclear-powers-cost-curse/ https://rooseveltinstitute.org/blog/can-china-break-nuclear-... - September 17th, 2025 China built more solar power in the last 8 months than all the nuclear power built in the entire world in the entire history of human civilisation. And even if you adjust for utilisation rate to compare against nuclear utilisation China built more solar power generated per hour than all the nuclear power currently in operation generate in an hour - and did so in 12-18 months - https://bsky.app/profile/climatenews.bsky.social/post/3lggqudgejs23 https://bsky.app/profile/climatenews.bsky.social/post/3lggqu... - January 23, 2025 China is installing the wind and solar equivalent of five large nuclear power stations per week - https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2024-07-16/chinas-renewable-energy-boom-breaks-records/104086640 https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2024-07-16/chinas-renewa... - July 15th, 2024 Nuclear Continues To Lag Far Behind Renewables In China Deployments - https://cleantechnica.com/2024/01/12/nuclear-continues-to-lag-far-behind-renewables-in-china-deployments/ https://cleantechnica.com/2024/01/12/nuclear-continues-to-la... - January 12th, 2024 Nuclear Energy & Free Market Capitalism Aren’t Compatible - https://cleantechnica.com/2023/11/06/nuclear-energy-free-market-capitalism-arent-compatible/ https://cleantechnica.com/2023/11/06/nuclear-energy-free-mar... - November 6th, 2023 https://x.com/MoreBirths/status/1910780131318374524 https://x.com/MoreBirths/status/1910780131318374524 | https://archive.today/iu9jx https://archive.today/iu9jx (China demographics citation)

Spooky23 11mo ago

Nuclear is great, but it does require wheelbarrows of cash, and we don’t have a solution for waste products.

yawaramin 11mo ago
Things are more expensive when we keep reinventing the wheel and trying to do new things instead of just reusing proven designs. Remember that solar power also used to cost wheelbarrows of cash back in the day. When you do something repeatedly, it becomes less expensive over time. Nuclear is actually the leader in waste management. No other energy source has as complete a story. Eg what happens to solar panels when they EOL in 25 years? They go into landfills and leach toxic chemicals into the ground. These chemicals, like lead and cadmium are toxic forever. They have no 'half-life' in which their toxicity reduces.
- toomuchtodo 11mo ago
  Solar panels are recycled at almost 100% of total materials. Redwood Materials (founded by Tesla's former CTO) has already established a supply chain to ingest and recycle EV and stationary storage batteries at scale. The problem is that the hardware is lasting longer than expected, and meaningful recycling volume does not yet exist. Conversely, ~95,000 metric tons of nuclear waste in the US does not have permanent storage or recycling solutions, as of this comment, and there is no plan for long term storage or recycling. Nuclear generation is experiencing a negative learning curve; we keep spending more the more we attempt to build it. (solar PV panels have a 25-30 year service life, at which point they will still produce power at ~80-85% initial rating, batteries have a 15-20 year service life, with sodium ion chemistries estimated to have up to 50 year service life assuming once daily cycling) https://www.epa.gov/hw/solar-panel-recycling https://www.epa.gov/hw/solar-panel-recycling https://www.energy.gov/eere/solar/articles/beyond-recycling-reducing-waste-solar-modules-theyre-even-made https://www.energy.gov/eere/solar/articles/beyond-recycling-... https://e360.yale.edu/features/solar-energy-panels-recycling https://e360.yale.edu/features/solar-energy-panels-recycling https://www.cnbc.com/2025/11/09/nuclear-power-energy-radioactive-waste-storage-disposal.html https://www.cnbc.com/2025/11/09/nuclear-power-energy-radioac... https://www.gao.gov/nuclear-waste-disposal https://www.gao.gov/nuclear-waste-disposal https://decarbonization.visualcapitalist.com/visualizing-all-the-nuclear-waste-in-the-world/ https://decarbonization.visualcapitalist.com/visualizing-all... (nuclear power accounts for about 10% of electricity generation globally, as of this comment)