4 ms·

> They introduced some BLE features before the spec was finished In their defence, they went with Lightning shortly before the USB-C spec was finalized. Then,

by xethos 11mo ago

> They introduced some BLE features before the spec was finished In their defence, they went with Lightning shortly before the USB-C spec was finalized. Then, to avoid their customers being screwed over by constantly changing the connector, they kind of had to stick with it for a decade. People will complain if they push features that are ahead of the spec, and they'll complain if they let the spec be finalized before they use it. Being guided by "What's the best we can do for UX, assuming out users are our users in every product category we enter" seems to be their reasonable middle ground.

bmandale 11mo ago
both scenarios speak to either an incredible impatience, or deliberate incompatibility to tie people to their ecosystem.
binkHN 11mo ago
If Apple wasn't forced by the EU, they would try to preserve their walled garden as much as possible. iMessage is the prime example of this.
- raw_anon_1111 11mo ago
  Can another company federate with WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger?
  - littlecranky67 11mo ago
    Yes, because the EU mandated them to. Just no one seems to want to federate.
    - raw_anon_1111 11mo ago
      And you are perfectly capable of interacting with iMessage users now through SMS/MMS/RCS
      - monocasa 11mo ago
        Their RCS implementation is so incredibly broken, and I can tell as an Android user. It seems like every other message gets downgraded to SMS.
        xethos 11mo ago
        That's because SMS is a horribly broken, hacky standard, and RCS has to inherit and deal with all the horrifying edge-cases of SMS, MMS, and legacy cruft going back prior to the turn of the millenium. Then it has to accomodate every other intersted party, many of which hate each other. Apple has always been a bit of an odd duck ("Think Different" has been internalized for some time), but Verizon actively hates OTT messaging as they can't charge for it. Samsung would rather run their own RCS implementation to create and advertise "Samsung RCS", and Google can't push too hard without getting EU attention for antitrust (again). RCS has been stuck in limbo-hell for years for multiple reasons, none of which are easy.
        monocasa 11mo ago
        The specific issue I'm talking about is how Apple for some reason ties the presence of RCS persistently to a contact that requires the user to manually go in and adjust, otherwise the conversation switches back and forth between SMS and RCS as each participant texts back and forth. This is a problem no other vendors have, and is solely caused by Apple. https://www.androidauthority.com/android-iphone-rcs-messaging-issue-3517481/ https://www.androidauthority.com/android-iphone-rcs-messagin...
      - array_key_first 11mo ago
        Yes, except that SMS/MMS sucks major ass, and RCS is really, really bad too. Not as awful as SMS, but close, and missing various barebones features. That's not Apple's fault per se, but of course, they contribute to it. They should open up the iMessage protocol.
        raw_anon_1111 11mo ago
vee-kay 11mo ago
The only reason Apple ditched Lightning port and finally gave USB-C port in the iDevices, is because EU forced Apple to do so. But do you think your oh-so-common USB-C cables will work with a new iPhone? In my country (India), Apple still doesn't sell charger and cable along with its new iDevices, even though those gadgets are exorbitantly expensive. And Apple doesn't allow custom repair here, even though my country mandated the Right to Repair, like EU did so. My old Mac Mini 2012 is gathering dust in a cupboard, because Apple service center refused to upgrade it to new RAM and new SATA SSD, citing Apple policies.
- ffsm8 11mo ago
  Couldn't you just upgrade yourself in the pre Apple silicone days? Like within minutes, with no big changes? I didn't think it's rare that a company refuses to do any work on devices they no longer support. Their employees will no longer be trained to do this work, hence they'd have a nontrivial chance of causing damages. That's exactly why a right to repair is so important, so that other people can pick up their slack
  - lloeki 11mo ago
    Back when RAM and HDD were using standard parts, Apple packaged manuals with documentation as to how to proceed to such upgrades.
- monerozcash 11mo ago
  >But do you think your oh-so-common USB-C cables will work with a new iPhone? They seem to work just fine, yeah.
  - toyg 11mo ago
    "Seem". Until they don't. I've had multiple instances of Airpods stopping to connect with phones until I charged them at least once with original Apple cables. They might work fine for months, then stop ehaving unless connected through an all-Apple power pipeline (cable and charger). It's probably firmware updates requiring some sort of validation every now and then.

by xethos 11mo ago

bmandale 11mo ago

both scenarios speak to either an incredible impatience, or deliberate incompatibility to tie people to their ecosystem.

binkHN 11mo ago

If Apple wasn't forced by the EU, they would try to preserve their walled garden as much as possible. iMessage is the prime example of this.

raw_anon_1111 11mo ago
Can another company federate with WhatsApp or Facebook Messenger?
- littlecranky67 11mo ago
  Yes, because the EU mandated them to. Just no one seems to want to federate.
  - raw_anon_1111 11mo ago
    And you are perfectly capable of interacting with iMessage users now through SMS/MMS/RCS
    - monocasa 11mo ago
      Their RCS implementation is so incredibly broken, and I can tell as an Android user. It seems like every other message gets downgraded to SMS.
      - xethos 11mo ago
        That's because SMS is a horribly broken, hacky standard, and RCS has to inherit and deal with all the horrifying edge-cases of SMS, MMS, and legacy cruft going back prior to the turn of the millenium. Then it has to accomodate every other intersted party, many of which hate each other. Apple has always been a bit of an odd duck ("Think Different" has been internalized for some time), but Verizon actively hates OTT messaging as they can't charge for it. Samsung would rather run their own RCS implementation to create and advertise "Samsung RCS", and Google can't push too hard without getting EU attention for antitrust (again). RCS has been stuck in limbo-hell for years for multiple reasons, none of which are easy.
        monocasa 11mo ago
        The specific issue I'm talking about is how Apple for some reason ties the presence of RCS persistently to a contact that requires the user to manually go in and adjust, otherwise the conversation switches back and forth between SMS and RCS as each participant texts back and forth. This is a problem no other vendors have, and is solely caused by Apple. https://www.androidauthority.com/android-iphone-rcs-messaging-issue-3517481/ https://www.androidauthority.com/android-iphone-rcs-messagin...
    - array_key_first 11mo ago
      Yes, except that SMS/MMS sucks major ass, and RCS is really, really bad too. Not as awful as SMS, but close, and missing various barebones features. That's not Apple's fault per se, but of course, they contribute to it. They should open up the iMessage protocol.
      - raw_anon_1111 11mo ago

vee-kay 11mo ago

The only reason Apple ditched Lightning port and finally gave USB-C port in the iDevices, is because EU forced Apple to do so. But do you think your oh-so-common USB-C cables will work with a new iPhone? In my country (India), Apple still doesn't sell charger and cable along with its new iDevices, even though those gadgets are exorbitantly expensive. And Apple doesn't allow custom repair here, even though my country mandated the Right to Repair, like EU did so. My old Mac Mini 2012 is gathering dust in a cupboard, because Apple service center refused to upgrade it to new RAM and new SATA SSD, citing Apple policies.

ffsm8 11mo ago
Couldn't you just upgrade yourself in the pre Apple silicone days? Like within minutes, with no big changes? I didn't think it's rare that a company refuses to do any work on devices they no longer support. Their employees will no longer be trained to do this work, hence they'd have a nontrivial chance of causing damages. That's exactly why a right to repair is so important, so that other people can pick up their slack
- lloeki 11mo ago
  Back when RAM and HDD were using standard parts, Apple packaged manuals with documentation as to how to proceed to such upgrades.
monerozcash 11mo ago
>But do you think your oh-so-common USB-C cables will work with a new iPhone? They seem to work just fine, yeah.
- toyg 11mo ago
  "Seem". Until they don't. I've had multiple instances of Airpods stopping to connect with phones until I charged them at least once with original Apple cables. They might work fine for months, then stop ehaving unless connected through an all-Apple power pipeline (cable and charger). It's probably firmware updates requiring some sort of validation every now and then.