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> it's a 'software doesn't really kill people so government doesn't intervene in it' I think we've reached the point where this is no longer true - self drivin

by isodev 1y ago

> it's a 'software doesn't really kill people so government doesn't intervene in it' I think we've reached the point where this is no longer true - self driving cars, supposed robots you can take home, LLMs being unleashed to randomly guess at medical data or write software to do verification or sensitive tasks. I think software engineering is definitely engineering, we've just been successful in lobbying against proper regulation. But all that is changing, the EU is introducing the Cyber Resilience Act and I think we need a lot more of that.

binary132 1y ago
Pet Food Store App does not really need Real Engineering, no
- rdiddly 1y ago
  Any place money is changing hands needs at least enough engineering, enough "application of scientific principles," to do it securely. Observably failing at that task means it ends up not being a pet food store. (It ceases to exist or becomes a scam instead.)
- isodev 1y ago
  It really does. The pet food store app asks me for my cat’s allergies and medical conditions. Someone needs to be responsible if they fuck it up. Same with self driving cars - the whole idea of “engineering” is about quality and responsibility.
  - jiriro 1y ago
    > the whole idea of “engineering” is about quality and responsibility This is hilarious :-) Making things that work has precisely zero relationship with quality or responsibilty or whatever shit you wish. Of course you can pay me anytime for quality or responsibility or whatever :)
    - sarchertech 1y ago
      “Quality” is subjective, so you’re correct that it’s not about quality. A tool designed with a planned lifespan of 100 hour lifespan is just as much a product of engineering as one designed to last 10k. Responsibility though is very much is a central component of capital E Engineering. The modern profession in many ways is a direct response to big newsworthy engineering disasters.
      - jiriro 1y ago
        Responsibility does not have anything to do with engineering capital E or whatever. If you pay me I can of course sell you some responsibility or whatever. This is called business.
        sarchertech 1y ago
        When you hire a Professional Engineer there are minimum safety standards that they must meet. They can't charge you less and waive their liability. They are essentially required by law to "sell you some responsibility".
array_key_first 1y ago
Software companies are definitely flying too close to the sun here. I don't think this is sustainable, at all.

by isodev 1y ago

binary132 1y ago

Pet Food Store App does not really need Real Engineering, no

rdiddly 1y ago
Any place money is changing hands needs at least enough engineering, enough "application of scientific principles," to do it securely. Observably failing at that task means it ends up not being a pet food store. (It ceases to exist or becomes a scam instead.)
isodev 1y ago
It really does. The pet food store app asks me for my cat’s allergies and medical conditions. Someone needs to be responsible if they fuck it up. Same with self driving cars - the whole idea of “engineering” is about quality and responsibility.
- jiriro 1y ago
  > the whole idea of “engineering” is about quality and responsibility This is hilarious :-) Making things that work has precisely zero relationship with quality or responsibilty or whatever shit you wish. Of course you can pay me anytime for quality or responsibility or whatever :)
  - sarchertech 1y ago
    “Quality” is subjective, so you’re correct that it’s not about quality. A tool designed with a planned lifespan of 100 hour lifespan is just as much a product of engineering as one designed to last 10k. Responsibility though is very much is a central component of capital E Engineering. The modern profession in many ways is a direct response to big newsworthy engineering disasters.
    - jiriro 1y ago
      Responsibility does not have anything to do with engineering capital E or whatever. If you pay me I can of course sell you some responsibility or whatever. This is called business.
      - sarchertech 1y ago
        When you hire a Professional Engineer there are minimum safety standards that they must meet. They can't charge you less and waive their liability. They are essentially required by law to "sell you some responsibility".

array_key_first 1y ago

Software companies are definitely flying too close to the sun here. I don't think this is sustainable, at all.