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Nah. Categorizing all AI as slop lacks nuance and demonstrates a shallow understanding of art

by aeon_ai 1y ago

ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago
Categorizing AI generated media as anything but slop demonstrates a shallow understanding of art.
- aeon_ai 1y ago
  Define art for me then. Because if you can’t do that, and effectively articulate why AI media can’t be art when used as a tool by an artist to achieve their creative intent, I would claim the win on this. one.
  - ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago
    You were going to claim the “win” on this one no matter what anyone says. That’s one of the features of being arrogant. I have zero desire to get into a semantic argument over this. That would be very boring and is a poor refuge for anyone trying to have an honest discussion. It’s not a coincidence that nearly all the people today with actual artistic talent universally despise AI. Meanwhile it’s all the talentless tech bros who won’t shut up about how they’re now incredible “artists” that love AI. I don’t see prompting an AI as creating art in the same way that commissioning a painting doesn’t make you an artist. In this example, it’s the AI model that is the artist creating the “art”, but since AI models aren’t sentient (yet) then what they create isn’t art anymore than a sunset is despite being aesthetically beautiful. Your “it’s just a tool” argument is especially ridiculous when you consider that the “tool” can create the same “art” in its entirety without you. It would be like if I googled the Mona Lisa and copy pasted it into Paint and then called myself an artist because I used Google and Paint as my tools. In the case of AI models anything you can think to prompt is already embedded in the model so it’s not like you’re even creating anything. It’s already there. If you have infinite monkeys on a keyboard prompting AI they can generate every single possible image an AI is able to generate. Where is the artistry again?
    - aeon_ai 1y ago
      I'll note I used no pejorative terms to describe you in order to make my points. I don't need to cast you as a villain or "unwise" individual to argue against the statements themselves. -- Your framing of AI presumes that my proposal is prompt in >> art out. False frame. You also state "near universal" disdain of AI from people with "actual" talent. A bold claim to make with little data, and at least for me, clear examples of being false. I know award-winning directors, iconic creatives, and career/professional artists who are all excited by the technology, exploring ways to use it, and learning how to composite it into their work. Perhaps you would propose that they have no talent and are not "true" artists! This is why I ask for the definition of art. It's not a "poor refuge" for an honest discussion, it's something that is the fundamental term upon which your argument is hinged. You can't gatekeep "art" without defining what the gate is. The OP talks about Suno Studio - A DAW experience with recording, editing, generative tools, and generative restyling. This is, objectively, a different level of tool than a "prompt to music" generation experience. Something that is composited through multiple decisions made by a human, toward some end that only they see, through an iterative process... Well, I'd say that's where the artistry is.
      - ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago
        No, there is nothing artistic about tools that help you modify or organize your prompts aka commissions for all the reasons I already stated above. Let’s play a game. I’ll pick an artist who hates AI and you reply with an artist that loves AI. Let’s see who runs out first. https://www.wired.com/story/guillermo-del-toro-hopes-hes-dead-before-ai-art-goes-mainstream/ https://www.wired.com/story/guillermo-del-toro-hopes-hes-dea...
        aeon_ai 1y ago
        Modify or organize your prompts? lol - I don't think you have any familiarity with the tooling landscape in AI media gen. I'll do you one better - I'll cite someone who has changed their mind. https://deadline.com/2025/04/james-cameron-use-ai-cut-cost-filmmaking-1236364940/ https://deadline.com/2025/04/james-cameron-use-ai-cut-cost-f...
- doug_durham 1y ago
  So you must really hate collage artists. All they are doing is cutting out images and pasting them into new images. Picasso really produced some slot I guess. You seem to have a very rigid definition of "art".
  - viccis 1y ago
    That has nothing to do with AI, which itself is categorically and noncontingently "slop".
nxpnsv 1y ago
Not AI, suno.
- aeon_ai 1y ago
  One-shot generations? Multi-track stem generation? Use of Suno at all in the process of composition? Is slop a function defined by the tool or the users level of effort in using it?
  - danielbln 1y ago
    Don't bother, the slop line has been drawn in the sand and people will stay on their side. I also think that slop is low effort and/or low/zero iteration output, but beyond that the sloppiness fades away, but good luck convincing the hardcore slop hunters to see things in a nuanced way (in before ocean boiling, that's usually where that argument goes next).
    - spencerflem 1y ago
      It’s a very useful line in the sand. No Gen AI anywhere near art. Once you add in a level of nuance, youre bickering about the degree which is far worse argument to be having, tactically.
      - aeon_ai 1y ago
        Who knew that nuance was the enemy of rational thought.
        spencerflem 1y ago
        It’s the enemy of successful organization. I have thoughts on when AI is appropriate, but the conversations I want to be having is ‘how do we oppose AI’ and not ‘why is my specific definition of what is Ok better than your very similar one’. Also, once Any AI is allowed, each step beyond that will be barely worth fighting for because it’s only just beyond acceptability.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

Nah. Categorizing all AI as slop lacks nuance and demonstrates a shallow understanding of art

ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago

Categorizing AI generated media as anything but slop demonstrates a shallow understanding of art.

aeon_ai 1y ago
Define art for me then. Because if you can’t do that, and effectively articulate why AI media can’t be art when used as a tool by an artist to achieve their creative intent, I would claim the win on this. one.
- ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago
  You were going to claim the “win” on this one no matter what anyone says. That’s one of the features of being arrogant. I have zero desire to get into a semantic argument over this. That would be very boring and is a poor refuge for anyone trying to have an honest discussion. It’s not a coincidence that nearly all the people today with actual artistic talent universally despise AI. Meanwhile it’s all the talentless tech bros who won’t shut up about how they’re now incredible “artists” that love AI. I don’t see prompting an AI as creating art in the same way that commissioning a painting doesn’t make you an artist. In this example, it’s the AI model that is the artist creating the “art”, but since AI models aren’t sentient (yet) then what they create isn’t art anymore than a sunset is despite being aesthetically beautiful. Your “it’s just a tool” argument is especially ridiculous when you consider that the “tool” can create the same “art” in its entirety without you. It would be like if I googled the Mona Lisa and copy pasted it into Paint and then called myself an artist because I used Google and Paint as my tools. In the case of AI models anything you can think to prompt is already embedded in the model so it’s not like you’re even creating anything. It’s already there. If you have infinite monkeys on a keyboard prompting AI they can generate every single possible image an AI is able to generate. Where is the artistry again?
  - aeon_ai 1y ago
    I'll note I used no pejorative terms to describe you in order to make my points. I don't need to cast you as a villain or "unwise" individual to argue against the statements themselves. -- Your framing of AI presumes that my proposal is prompt in >> art out. False frame. You also state "near universal" disdain of AI from people with "actual" talent. A bold claim to make with little data, and at least for me, clear examples of being false. I know award-winning directors, iconic creatives, and career/professional artists who are all excited by the technology, exploring ways to use it, and learning how to composite it into their work. Perhaps you would propose that they have no talent and are not "true" artists! This is why I ask for the definition of art. It's not a "poor refuge" for an honest discussion, it's something that is the fundamental term upon which your argument is hinged. You can't gatekeep "art" without defining what the gate is. The OP talks about Suno Studio - A DAW experience with recording, editing, generative tools, and generative restyling. This is, objectively, a different level of tool than a "prompt to music" generation experience. Something that is composited through multiple decisions made by a human, toward some end that only they see, through an iterative process... Well, I'd say that's where the artistry is.
    - ukFxqnLa2sBSBf6 1y ago
      No, there is nothing artistic about tools that help you modify or organize your prompts aka commissions for all the reasons I already stated above. Let’s play a game. I’ll pick an artist who hates AI and you reply with an artist that loves AI. Let’s see who runs out first. https://www.wired.com/story/guillermo-del-toro-hopes-hes-dead-before-ai-art-goes-mainstream/ https://www.wired.com/story/guillermo-del-toro-hopes-hes-dea...
      - aeon_ai 1y ago
        Modify or organize your prompts? lol - I don't think you have any familiarity with the tooling landscape in AI media gen. I'll do you one better - I'll cite someone who has changed their mind. https://deadline.com/2025/04/james-cameron-use-ai-cut-cost-filmmaking-1236364940/ https://deadline.com/2025/04/james-cameron-use-ai-cut-cost-f...
doug_durham 1y ago
So you must really hate collage artists. All they are doing is cutting out images and pasting them into new images. Picasso really produced some slot I guess. You seem to have a very rigid definition of "art".
- viccis 1y ago
  That has nothing to do with AI, which itself is categorically and noncontingently "slop".

nxpnsv 1y ago

Not AI, suno.

aeon_ai 1y ago
One-shot generations? Multi-track stem generation? Use of Suno at all in the process of composition? Is slop a function defined by the tool or the users level of effort in using it?
- danielbln 1y ago
  Don't bother, the slop line has been drawn in the sand and people will stay on their side. I also think that slop is low effort and/or low/zero iteration output, but beyond that the sloppiness fades away, but good luck convincing the hardcore slop hunters to see things in a nuanced way (in before ocean boiling, that's usually where that argument goes next).
  - spencerflem 1y ago
    It’s a very useful line in the sand. No Gen AI anywhere near art. Once you add in a level of nuance, youre bickering about the degree which is far worse argument to be having, tactically.
    - aeon_ai 1y ago
      Who knew that nuance was the enemy of rational thought.
      - spencerflem 1y ago
        It’s the enemy of successful organization. I have thoughts on when AI is appropriate, but the conversations I want to be having is ‘how do we oppose AI’ and not ‘why is my specific definition of what is Ok better than your very similar one’. Also, once Any AI is allowed, each step beyond that will be barely worth fighting for because it’s only just beyond acceptability.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]