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This isn’t true and hasn’t been true fifty years ago either. A handful of the most well-known books regarding getting wealthy and having a high status were writ
by uvaursi 1y ago
This isn’t true and hasn’t been true fifty years ago either. A handful of the most well-known books regarding getting wealthy and having a high status were written almost a century ago. The practice of wealth accumulation was already established by anyone who was above room temperature IQ for as long as we have existed.
Deviance is all around, the author is too trapped in a bubble to see it.
- reaperducer 1y agoDeviance is all around, the author is too trapped in a bubble to see it. Show me the modern counter-culture movement. Show me the modern Firesign Theater. Show me today's National Lampoon. Show me the modern Anarchist's Cookbook. No, 2600 doesn't count. It's a toothless parody of what it once was that you can buy on the shelf at Barnes and Noble next to Taylor Swift magazines. Heck, even the 2000's had hipsters. Where are the protest songs? I think this is the first generation that doesn't have mainstream protest songs.
- nbk_2000 1y agoOther zines have filled the void left by 2600, one of my favorites being PoC||GTFO. (pocorgtfo.hacke.rs) I think the author isn't considering that people's bubbles have gotten smaller and more opaque. There's still plenty of weird hackers innovating, they just do it with their chosen peers, not in mass-culture. As predicted "The revolutions are not being televised."
- listenfaster 1y agoThanks for the reco for pocgtfo. I had no idea.
- vixen99 1y agoYou have a point. Deviance is tending not to stick its head above the parapet.
- JackMorgan 1y agoI generally agree with you. Which is why this Jesse Welles's stuff hits me like a freight train https://youtu.be/I6vjaimSK4E?si=e18sT1m179W2bM2G https://youtu.be/I6vjaimSK4E?si=e18sT1m179W2bM2G
- filoeleven 1y agoThis is who I thought of too. it’s your own damn fault you’re so damn fat / Shame shame shame All the food on the shelf was engineered for your health / So you’re gonna have to take the blame https://youtu.be/LtScpL5o7cg?si=h2x1ExSWl3-iE_3N https://youtu.be/LtScpL5o7cg?si=h2x1ExSWl3-iE_3N
- hypokite 1y agoIf you were to submit any writing daring original creation and significance today you are going to jail. Such was the demise of zwei sei zed /dev/null.
- jderick 1y agoBo Burnham
- engeljohnb 1y agoI suppose he is modern, but he's distinctly a millennial star. I don't think gen z/a cares aboht him.
- foul 1y agoMainstream protest songs?
- reaperducer 1y agoMainstream protest songs? The last century was full of them. From Bob Dylan to Marvin Gaye to Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young to Sting to U2. There were probably hundreds that made the Top 40 charts.
- marcosdumay 1y agoHum... Have you not noticed the problem? That's exactly the kind of stuff everybody is saying that doesn't count. It's not deviant if everybody is doing it.
- satellite2 1y agoYour meta-analysis is one degree too high. You were going to have the long tail anyway. It just shows there was an interest for the deviant.
- foul 1y agoThat's a folk music wave, a conscious soul album, conflated with more pop social commentary. Not much protest songs. Products made out of popular discontent. Now if you said Woody Guthrie... But in pre-war times was there a non-mainstream? The only thing that this may say is that in USA the regime fights dissent in mainstream media. Like, if you want to catch signs of a product made out of popular discontent, you can't e.g. find in UK charts the Sleaford Mods or Kneecap?
- lubujackson 1y agoGive me a break with this "where are the protest songs" stuff. I'm an old fart, but even I know stuff like Childish Gambino's "This Is America", a bunch of Kendrick Lamar songs (not to mention his Super Bowl performance), Beyonce's "Ameriican Requiem", etc. And let's not forget that protest songs aren't usually promoted by those in power...
- cheschire 1y agoIt's crazy to think that "This is America" was released 7 years ago.
- 01HNNWZ0MV43FF 1y ago2001 and 2016 have been unfortunately been very long years thus far
- bobthepanda 1y agoAlso this kind of stuff is still happening, look at all the blowback to Bad Bunny performing at the next Super Bowl
- keiferski 1y agoThere used to be much more tension between creating culture (art, music, etc.) and making money from it. I think that tension has pretty much evaporated.
- jhbadger 1y agoI don't think there was ever really such a tension in terms of making money from art, but rather how. The idea of "selling out" was that, say, selling the rights to your songs to advertisers was viewed as crass. That I agree has pretty much evaporated -- nobody calls musicians who allow their songs to be used in ads "sellouts" anymore.
- chemotaxis 1y agoFor whom - for Taylor Swift? The average artist experience is pretty miserable: it's harder than ever to break through because there is more competition - two or three generations who looked up to rock and pop stars and imagined that this could be a viable career. One in a thousand talented artists will get lucky, but I suspect the ratio is historically low. Everyone else more or less needs to find another job. There are other things that probably push artists toward the cultural mean. You're no longer trying to cater to the tastes of a wealthy patron or even a record studio executive. Now, you gotta get enough clicks on YouTube first. The surest way to do this is to look nice and do some unoffensive covers of well-known pop songs.
- margalabargala 1y agoThe tension the parent referred to is the concept of "selling out" as a bad thing. Your comment supports this. While you may talk about how it's harder to "break through" or "get lucky" than it was, it presents both of those as good things. There used to be other measures of success for musicians other than financial.
- moritzwarhier 1y agoThere is a term for this, at least some people used to use it, I think it would appear as tied to certain kind of "ideology" to most though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_industry https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_industry I also guess it is just a wordy description of the combination of commercial entertainment and industrialization. I like your point, although I feel that in some contexts, it was probably _easier_ for people to create something they feel is valuable as art and also can earn them money, a few decades ago. I don't think the tension has evaporated, it's just the difference between "art" and "entertainment". Sure, you can always say that entertainment is art. No matter if you're Christopher Nolan or a street musician who knows what to play to get some money. The tension is still there, there's just a mass-scale production of commercial art that hasn't been there before. But I'd say that probably, with these products that have giant budgets and are feeding thousands of people, there are just a few people involved who consider themselves artists in a sense that isn't the same in that a baker or sewer is also an artist. No coincidence we're discussing this in a forum that has software development as a main subject. Christopher Nolan's movies are "art" the same way Microsofts UI design is art, IMHO. I didn't bring Nolan into this in order to be smug about him, his work just feels like it symbolizes this kind of industrial cultural production well, especially because many people might consider him a top-notch _artist_.
- pfdietz 1y ago> Deviance is all around, the author is too trapped in a bubble to see it. Let's send the author to a furry con.
- readthenotes1 1y agoI wonder if you were to plot out the costume variations if they would be increasing or decreasing over time.
- omnicognate 1y agoFurry conventions have been going for 40 years. There are more than 50 of them catering to a worldwide "furry fandom" of millions. Is there a boiling cauldron of innovation there that I'm not aware of? From the outside it looks almost mainstream at this point.
- ChickeNES 1y agoRight? When Spencer's Gifts is using the word "yiff" in advertising, you can't quite call it underground now lol
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- pfdietz 1y agoHmm. I wonder if the real issue is we've run out of deviations? The space of innovative new deviations that are sufficiently attractive to matter may have been mined out.
- GuinansEyebrows 1y ago> The practice of wealth accumulation was already established by anyone who was above room temperature IQ for as long as we have existed i can't tell if you're trying to make a point about people who don't practice wealth accumulation. probably because i have a room temperature IQ.
- rkomorn 1y agoIn Kelvin?
- GuinansEyebrows 1y agocelsius
- dostick 1y agoTwenty? SO PROUD OF YOU POSTING HERE.
- rkomorn 1y agoRough.
- GuinansEyebrows 1y agoit's cold out here for us dummies. can i borrow a coat?
- rkomorn 1y agoWish I could help you but I don't remember where I put it.
- mihaic 1y agoI think you're missing that deviants have to interact with people in the normal sphere for them to count socially, and the fact that you're arguing that the author is in a bubble pretty much is making his case actually.