4 ms·

Apple says US passport digital IDs are coming to Wallet 'soon'

32 points by SilverElfin 1y ago

IOT_Apprentice 1y ago
Will DHS and ICE consider them valid proof of citizenship? I’d really like that confirmed.
- iAMkenough 1y ago
  Considering REAL ID is not sufficient for DHS or ICE, I highly doubt it. > Apple says it is not a replacement for a physical passport, and it cannot be used for international travel and border crossing purposes. I'd read that as you're still expected to produce physical documents if you get questioned.
  - ImJamal 1y ago
    > Considering REAL ID is not sufficient for DHS or ICE, I highly doubt it. You can get a real id without being a citizen so it shouldn't be used as proof of citizenship. From the California DMV site: > Any Californian who can prove their current legal presence in the United States (U.S.) with one of the accepted identity documents (original or certified copy) is eligible to receive a REAL ID driver license or identification (DL/ID) card. This includes all U.S. citizens, permanent residents who are not U.S. citizens (Green Card holders), and those with temporary legal status, such as recipients of Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) or Temporary Protected Status (TPS) and holders of a valid student or employment visa. https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/driver-licenses-identification-cards/real-id/what-is-real-id/real-id-info-non-u-s-citizens/ https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/driver-licenses-identification...
    - iAMkenough 1y ago
      As you pointed out, you need to have a valid legal status to obtain a REAL ID. My gripe is that presenting that proof of valid legal status is not enough proof for the enforcement agencies checking for valid legal status. A digital version of your passport is not going to make those agencies less difficult to work with in public places.
      - ImJamal 1y ago
        You had to have legal status when you received the real id. Having a non-expired real id does not mean you still have legal status.
    - wildzzz 1y ago
      REAL ID was never intended to be a citizen ID card. It's really just an extension of state IDs to have better identity verification by requiring more documents. The goal is that if someone has a REAL ID, then that's really who they are.
sigmar 1y ago
I added my US passport to my Pixel's wallet app in June. It's neat and let's you see what data is transmitted over NFC, and lists some details about the signed certificate for the data (seems they do only 2 weeks of validity for each cert signature, and the app fetches a new sig automatically) but I have yet to come across TSA agents advertising acceptance of digital IDs, so typically I default to my passport card.
ravenstine 1y ago
Maybe I'm just not imaginative enough, but I don't imagine myself relying on a digital device in order to prove my identity in foreign countries. Drop your phone and break it... then what do you do? And yeah, you can lose your physical passport, but you can also repeatedly stomp on it and even submerge it in water and it will still be useful.
- btian 1y ago
  The article says this is not a replacement for physical passport.
  - matthewdgreen 1y ago
    Not useful for much in the real world, but extremely useful for online age verification.
  - makeitdouble 1y ago
    I'm not sure what it actually means. For instance Apple Pay is probably not supposed to replace your actual credit card, but if you can live your life without ever using the physical one, that's just legalese. If it really doesn't do much (i.e. only help to pass TSA lines), then perhaps it should be called something else. If it effectively can act as a passport in 80%+ more situations, "not a replacement for xxxx" will just be legalese for most users.
    - morshu9001 1y ago
      Yeah I purely care about whether or not this will get me through TSA. I'm against Apple Pay and all that, but I really don't want to carry (=risk losing) my physical passport just for domestic travel.
      - chrisphilip 1y ago
        You can use a Real ID drivers license for domestic travel, passport is only required when leaving the country.
everfrustrated 1y ago
First step on the path to signing everything you write on the internet with your government issued digital ID. Be careful what you give up in the name of convenience.
- morshu9001 1y ago
  Who says it's my- oh, FaceID
eqvinox 1y ago
> when my iPhone is my wallet, passport, visa, and any other identity document I might require. ...also if your phone gets stolen now, you're completely screwed... for physical objects, you're supposed to keep your passport and wallet separate when travelling; makes recovering the respective other one easier if it gets stolen...

32 points by SilverElfin 1y ago

IOT_Apprentice 1y ago

Will DHS and ICE consider them valid proof of citizenship? I’d really like that confirmed.

iAMkenough 1y ago
Considering REAL ID is not sufficient for DHS or ICE, I highly doubt it. > Apple says it is not a replacement for a physical passport, and it cannot be used for international travel and border crossing purposes. I'd read that as you're still expected to produce physical documents if you get questioned.
- ImJamal 1y ago
  > Considering REAL ID is not sufficient for DHS or ICE, I highly doubt it. You can get a real id without being a citizen so it shouldn't be used as proof of citizenship. From the California DMV site: > Any Californian who can prove their current legal presence in the United States (U.S.) with one of the accepted identity documents (original or certified copy) is eligible to receive a REAL ID driver license or identification (DL/ID) card. This includes all U.S. citizens, permanent residents who are not U.S. citizens (Green Card holders), and those with temporary legal status, such as recipients of Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) or Temporary Protected Status (TPS) and holders of a valid student or employment visa. https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/driver-licenses-identification-cards/real-id/what-is-real-id/real-id-info-non-u-s-citizens/ https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/driver-licenses-identification...
  - iAMkenough 1y ago
    As you pointed out, you need to have a valid legal status to obtain a REAL ID. My gripe is that presenting that proof of valid legal status is not enough proof for the enforcement agencies checking for valid legal status. A digital version of your passport is not going to make those agencies less difficult to work with in public places.
    - ImJamal 1y ago
      You had to have legal status when you received the real id. Having a non-expired real id does not mean you still have legal status.
  - wildzzz 1y ago
    REAL ID was never intended to be a citizen ID card. It's really just an extension of state IDs to have better identity verification by requiring more documents. The goal is that if someone has a REAL ID, then that's really who they are.

sigmar 1y ago

I added my US passport to my Pixel's wallet app in June. It's neat and let's you see what data is transmitted over NFC, and lists some details about the signed certificate for the data (seems they do only 2 weeks of validity for each cert signature, and the app fetches a new sig automatically) but I have yet to come across TSA agents advertising acceptance of digital IDs, so typically I default to my passport card.

ravenstine 1y ago

Maybe I'm just not imaginative enough, but I don't imagine myself relying on a digital device in order to prove my identity in foreign countries. Drop your phone and break it... then what do you do? And yeah, you can lose your physical passport, but you can also repeatedly stomp on it and even submerge it in water and it will still be useful.

btian 1y ago
The article says this is not a replacement for physical passport.
- matthewdgreen 1y ago
  Not useful for much in the real world, but extremely useful for online age verification.
- makeitdouble 1y ago
  I'm not sure what it actually means. For instance Apple Pay is probably not supposed to replace your actual credit card, but if you can live your life without ever using the physical one, that's just legalese. If it really doesn't do much (i.e. only help to pass TSA lines), then perhaps it should be called something else. If it effectively can act as a passport in 80%+ more situations, "not a replacement for xxxx" will just be legalese for most users.
  - morshu9001 1y ago
    Yeah I purely care about whether or not this will get me through TSA. I'm against Apple Pay and all that, but I really don't want to carry (=risk losing) my physical passport just for domestic travel.
    - chrisphilip 1y ago
      You can use a Real ID drivers license for domestic travel, passport is only required when leaving the country.

everfrustrated 1y ago

First step on the path to signing everything you write on the internet with your government issued digital ID. Be careful what you give up in the name of convenience.

morshu9001 1y ago
Who says it's my- oh, FaceID

eqvinox 1y ago

> when my iPhone is my wallet, passport, visa, and any other identity document I might require. ...also if your phone gets stolen now, you're completely screwed... for physical objects, you're supposed to keep your passport and wallet separate when travelling; makes recovering the respective other one easier if it gets stolen...