5 ms·

So he used money from Libya to get elected and then later he bombed them?

by rapsey 1y ago

adev_ 1y ago
In short, yes. Additionally budget for political campaigns are strictly regulated in France. And getting bribes from foreign dictator is, of course, not allowed. The reason he did not get condemned also for that is that the judge could not proove the usage of the money.
- timeon 1y ago
  > And getting bribes from foreign dictator is, of course, not allowed. Couldn't he setup some crypto fund instead? Or investment in ballroom? Or simply just receive present, let say plane, instead of money? Would that help him in this case?
  - vkou 1y ago
    In a country with a working judiciary, unlikely. In a banana republic, the optics don't really matter in these kinds of situations.
  - adev_ 1y ago
    > Couldn't he setup some crypto fund instead? Or investment in ballroom? Or simply just receive present, let say plane, instead of money? Would that help him in this case? An other French politician, Francois Fillon, tried that with bribes as gift including some luxury Suits. In addition of some public money redirection to his own family. And it did not play well for him either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fillon_affair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fillon_affair Ironically, he was Sarkozy's Prime Minster. The party that they both come from (The republicans, previously UMP, previously RPR) has a long history of financial abuses and associated judgements. The only "new" thing here is that it explicitly condemned a previous President.
moralestapia 1y ago
I'll have to read more into this, but it says he just "conspired" to do it, whatever that means. The solitary confinement part is quite harsh, I've never understood how that is supposed to rehabilitate someone. In France there's early release, parole, etc. so real time he spends behind bars might be as low as two years. Edit: The WP article is actually a very interesting read, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_financing_in_the_2007_French_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_financing_in_the_2007_F...
- seszett 1y ago
  > The solitary confinement part is quite harsh, I've never understood how that is supposed to rehabilitate someone. In this case it's for his own wellbeing, because it's probably difficult for a former president to go along well with the rest of the prison population. I also read a statement that it would help prevent other inmates taking and publicly sharing pictures of him (since some inmates do manage to have phones even if they are forbidden). Prison in general is one of the worst ways to rehabilitate someone though, I do agree with you.
  - kergonath 1y ago
    > it's probably difficult for a former president to go along well with the rest of the prison population Particularly for him who was very keen to be seen as tough on crime to get votes from the far right.
- byroot 1y ago
  > I'll have to read more into this, but it says he just "conspired" to do it, whatever that means. The court couldn't prove beyond reasonable doubt that the money was used for his campaign. However they were able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that he knew what his subordinates were planing and that he did nothing to stop it. In France conspiring to commit a crime is punishable, regardless of whether the crime actually happened or not. That's a law that has been crafted by Sarkozy's own party. > The solitary confinement part is quite harsh The solitary part isn't a punishment, but to ensure his safety. They even went as far as to allocated another cell for the two full time police officers of his security detail... Also the upside is that he has a cell for himself, something a lot of prisoners would love to have given the over prison occupancy in France is 137% (and up to 200% in some specific prisons).
pfannkuchen 1y ago
I think he was trying to chase the Libyans into France.
csomar 1y ago
More like bombed Gaddafi and guaranteed his downfall than bombed "Libya". It is probably a bit more complicated than that, though. The U.S./NATO were also involved and there is a lot of money there. He probably thought he could get away with it. But make no mistake this is a political play and everyone involved is as dirty as the Paris Seine.
- _ache_ 1y ago
  Hey! The Seine isn't dirty as this guy. Maybe the Seine was heavily covered as dirty by the media but remember that you shouldn't swim in the San Francisco bay either. Wait for the next JO to hear about water quality problem with the LA beach area under rain.
  - SiempreViernes 1y ago
    Yeah, only a few contestants in the Olympics got sick after the triathlon! ;)

So he used money from Libya to get elected and then later he bombed them?

by rapsey 1y ago

So he used money from Libya to get elected and then later he bombed them?

In short, yes. Additionally budget for political campaigns are strictly regulated in France. And getting bribes from foreign dictator is, of course, not allowed. The reason he did not get condemned also for that is that the judge could not proove the usage of the money.

timeon 1y ago
> And getting bribes from foreign dictator is, of course, not allowed. Couldn't he setup some crypto fund instead? Or investment in ballroom? Or simply just receive present, let say plane, instead of money? Would that help him in this case?
- vkou 1y ago
  In a country with a working judiciary, unlikely. In a banana republic, the optics don't really matter in these kinds of situations.
- adev_ 1y ago
  > Couldn't he setup some crypto fund instead? Or investment in ballroom? Or simply just receive present, let say plane, instead of money? Would that help him in this case? An other French politician, Francois Fillon, tried that with bribes as gift including some luxury Suits. In addition of some public money redirection to his own family. And it did not play well for him either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fillon_affair https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fillon_affair Ironically, he was Sarkozy's Prime Minster. The party that they both come from (The republicans, previously UMP, previously RPR) has a long history of financial abuses and associated judgements. The only "new" thing here is that it explicitly condemned a previous President.

moralestapia 1y ago

I'll have to read more into this, but it says he just "conspired" to do it, whatever that means. The solitary confinement part is quite harsh, I've never understood how that is supposed to rehabilitate someone. In France there's early release, parole, etc. so real time he spends behind bars might be as low as two years. Edit: The WP article is actually a very interesting read, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_financing_in_the_2007_French_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_financing_in_the_2007_F...

seszett 1y ago
> The solitary confinement part is quite harsh, I've never understood how that is supposed to rehabilitate someone. In this case it's for his own wellbeing, because it's probably difficult for a former president to go along well with the rest of the prison population. I also read a statement that it would help prevent other inmates taking and publicly sharing pictures of him (since some inmates do manage to have phones even if they are forbidden). Prison in general is one of the worst ways to rehabilitate someone though, I do agree with you.
- kergonath 1y ago
  > it's probably difficult for a former president to go along well with the rest of the prison population Particularly for him who was very keen to be seen as tough on crime to get votes from the far right.
byroot 1y ago
> I'll have to read more into this, but it says he just "conspired" to do it, whatever that means. The court couldn't prove beyond reasonable doubt that the money was used for his campaign. However they were able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that he knew what his subordinates were planing and that he did nothing to stop it. In France conspiring to commit a crime is punishable, regardless of whether the crime actually happened or not. That's a law that has been crafted by Sarkozy's own party. > The solitary confinement part is quite harsh The solitary part isn't a punishment, but to ensure his safety. They even went as far as to allocated another cell for the two full time police officers of his security detail... Also the upside is that he has a cell for himself, something a lot of prisoners would love to have given the over prison occupancy in France is 137% (and up to 200% in some specific prisons).

pfannkuchen 1y ago

I think he was trying to chase the Libyans into France.

csomar 1y ago

More like bombed Gaddafi and guaranteed his downfall than bombed "Libya". It is probably a bit more complicated than that, though. The U.S./NATO were also involved and there is a lot of money there. He probably thought he could get away with it. But make no mistake this is a political play and everyone involved is as dirty as the Paris Seine.

_ache_ 1y ago
Hey! The Seine isn't dirty as this guy. Maybe the Seine was heavily covered as dirty by the media but remember that you shouldn't swim in the San Francisco bay either. Wait for the next JO to hear about water quality problem with the LA beach area under rain.
- SiempreViernes 1y ago
  Yeah, only a few contestants in the Olympics got sick after the triathlon! ;)