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> It’s only in recent history that freedom has come to mean having a huge array of choices in life. Did we take a wrong turn? Said who? This is an argument fro

> It’s only in recent history that freedom has come to mean having a huge array of choices in life. Did we take a wrong turn? Said who? This is an argument from invented opposition. I’m not sure anyone actually defines freedom as "a huge array of choices". The author seems to invent a mainstream narrative just to dismantle it(arguing against a straw man) Abundance of choice and freedom are orthogonal. Having the right choice and being free are not.

bfio 1y ago
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gtowey 1y ago
I think it's definitely the case where corporations and the media want us to believe that having a huge array of choices is freedom.
- dkdcio 1y ago
  how? in what way? why? what does that even mean?
  - lm28469 1y ago
    Unlimited options when it comes to consumerists gadgets, 1 option when it comes to being a wage slave your whole life
    - card_zero 1y ago
      It's not like they're obstructing a better arrangement. I guess you have in mind something like: all the pointless churn of making the latest video doorbells and smart watches could instead be dedicated to giving me and you some time off work. So, UBI? Maybe. But this is obstructed by voters, or by practicalities.
- ch4s3 1y ago
  Choice is an aspect of freedom. You could have absolutely freedom from any kind of social or political obligation or coercion and if all you can do with that is how potatoes then what good is it?
- hinkley 1y ago
  Salesmanship has long been associated with convincing people they have a problem and then offering a solution. And an evergreen one is the single differentiating feature. Like color. How many kitchenaid appliances have been sold in a faddish color only to be replaced by white or black or red a handful of years later? Those things were tanks. Still are to an extent.
  - h2zizzle 1y ago
    On the higher end. Low-end are imported often-junk with a badge stamped on them.
    - hinkley 1y ago
      It’s solving a different problem in that case. I want one but not for that much. Also being poor is expensive.
AnthonyMouse 1y ago
> Said who? This is an argument from invented opposition. I’m not sure anyone actually defines freedom as "a huge array of choices". The author seems to invent a mainstream narrative just to dismantle it(arguing against a straw man) It's the inversion of something which is correct. If you don't have any choice or are limited to a small number of bad options, that's not freedom. Freedom requires choice. But choice is necessary, not sufficient. Having a thousand frivolous choices that are all bad and still not the ones you ought to have is not it either.
PaulDavisThe1st 1y ago
The American media environment in the post-WWII era (say, 1948-1968) was full of both explicit and implicit claims that the vast array of consumer choices available to Americans was evidence of the freedom the Americans had.
- marcosdumay 1y ago
  And it was. Evidence of a fact is different from the fact.
  - PaulDavisThe1st 1y ago
    The GP: > Said who? This is an argument from invented opposition. I’m not sure anyone actually defines freedom as "a huge array of choices". This is an argument about who "defined freedom as ..." and I pointed out who did.

bfio 1y ago

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gtowey 1y ago

I think it's definitely the case where corporations and the media want us to believe that having a huge array of choices is freedom.

dkdcio 1y ago
how? in what way? why? what does that even mean?
- lm28469 1y ago
  Unlimited options when it comes to consumerists gadgets, 1 option when it comes to being a wage slave your whole life
  - card_zero 1y ago
    It's not like they're obstructing a better arrangement. I guess you have in mind something like: all the pointless churn of making the latest video doorbells and smart watches could instead be dedicated to giving me and you some time off work. So, UBI? Maybe. But this is obstructed by voters, or by practicalities.
ch4s3 1y ago
Choice is an aspect of freedom. You could have absolutely freedom from any kind of social or political obligation or coercion and if all you can do with that is how potatoes then what good is it?
hinkley 1y ago
Salesmanship has long been associated with convincing people they have a problem and then offering a solution. And an evergreen one is the single differentiating feature. Like color. How many kitchenaid appliances have been sold in a faddish color only to be replaced by white or black or red a handful of years later? Those things were tanks. Still are to an extent.
- h2zizzle 1y ago
  On the higher end. Low-end are imported often-junk with a badge stamped on them.
  - hinkley 1y ago
    It’s solving a different problem in that case. I want one but not for that much. Also being poor is expensive.

AnthonyMouse 1y ago

> Said who? This is an argument from invented opposition. I’m not sure anyone actually defines freedom as "a huge array of choices". The author seems to invent a mainstream narrative just to dismantle it(arguing against a straw man) It's the inversion of something which is correct. If you don't have any choice or are limited to a small number of bad options, that's not freedom. Freedom requires choice. But choice is necessary, not sufficient. Having a thousand frivolous choices that are all bad and still not the ones you ought to have is not it either.

PaulDavisThe1st 1y ago

The American media environment in the post-WWII era (say, 1948-1968) was full of both explicit and implicit claims that the vast array of consumer choices available to Americans was evidence of the freedom the Americans had.

marcosdumay 1y ago
And it was. Evidence of a fact is different from the fact.
- PaulDavisThe1st 1y ago
  The GP: > Said who? This is an argument from invented opposition. I’m not sure anyone actually defines freedom as "a huge array of choices". This is an argument about who "defined freedom as ..." and I pointed out who did.