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This is interesting but I feel like a lot of these Rust-inspired package managers are a little... too inspired by Rust. This project for instance uses .toml as
by ModernMech 1y ago
This is interesting but I feel like a lot of these Rust-inspired package managers are a little... too inspired by Rust. This project for instance uses .toml as a config file format, presumably because that's what Cargo does.
But I think for this project in particular, Lua for the config files would have been a better choice!
I think that Lua tries to be a good configuration language (it started as a configuration language called SOL (sun), which configured reports for lithology profiles), and in fact Luarocks uses "rockspec" for their config, which is syntactically Lua. Lux claims to be inspired by Luarocks, and yet they chose to use toml over lua for config. I'm wondering why? What was wrong with lua that made toml a better choice?
edit: Okay, I've found more information where they say they support both formats... which, I don't know if that's the right call? Seems like going with one or the other is better from a project management standpoint, although I can see why they want to give users the option.
> Not everyone may want to migrate (nor use) the TOML system for describing a project. For this reason, I’d had liked Lux to support a rockspec file alongside the TOML file (similar to the old project.rockspec format). This has finally been implemented! By creating a file called extra.rockspec in the project root, you will instruct Lux to merge the TOML and the rockspec together when performing any sort of operation.
- pepperfritz 1y ago[flagged]
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- arccy 1y agoTOML is seriously ugly... nested configs are less clear in toml compared to even YAML.
- BugsJustFindMe 1y ago> I can see why they want to give users the option I completely dislike the practice of giving options for no reason other than to give options. Don't make me learn different ways of doing the same thing to succeed in an ecosystem. Don't make me learn differences and similarities. If one way works properly and doesn't have obvious downsides, stick with having one way. If it has obvious downsides, stick with having a different one way. Subjective format taste isn't a real downside. Pick one format and stick with it. The line from the zen of Python about how "there should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it" is something that people all too often forget the value of.
- giancarlostoro 1y ago> The line from the zen of Python about how "there should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it" is something that people all too often forget. The zen of Python should be the zen of all languages.
- BugsJustFindMe 1y agoYes, it should be. Sadly it's not even unambiguously the zen of Python these days.
- fullstop 1y agoYes, one way to do it. Sync or async!
- giancarlostoro 1y agoAll I'm hearing is that Erlang is the true Zen.
- dirtbag__dad 1y agoUnfortunately in practice you see snowflake implementations left and right in python. It’s still unclear to me if python is too expressive for its own good, or if it’s so widely used, that it’s impossible to avoid nonsense
- giancarlostoro 1y agoI assume like 70% of Python developers do not even know the Zen of Python, let alone PEP-8. It's likely the size.
- mrcjkb 1y agoGood thing we're not giving options for no reason other than to give options ;)
- monooso 1y agoThe irony of quoting the Zen of Python in a discussion about a package manager. I can think of at least three Python package managers off the top of my head.
- mrcjkb 1y ago> presumably because that's what Cargo does. Nope. We chose TOML as the default for various reasons: - Simplicity. There are use cases for a turing complete configuration language. Lux is not one of them. - Ergonomics. The ability to edit it using the CLI (technically, that could be possible with Lua too, but it would be a lot more complex and not a very pleasant UX). > which, I don't know if that's the right call? The reason we currently support importing a Lua extra.rockspec is ease of migration for complex projects, e.g. with platform-specific overrides (not yet supported by the TOML spec).
- ModernMech 1y agoThanks that does answer my question! Had you considered parsing a subset of lua to get the properties you want? That way users don't have to learn a whole other syntax. I'm thinking in particular of my students whom I teach lua. They struggle enough learning one language, having to teach a second with all its quirks seems like a lot to throw at them.
- NuclearPM 1y agoDo you think that is more difficult than explaining to the students why they can’t use loops in their lua config files?
- ModernMech 1y agoI wouldn't present it to them as "these config files are the same thing as Lua but without loops", but instead "these are config files and they have the same syntax as the Lua records we just learned about". And I would prefer that over "these are config files and they have a different syntax as the Lua records we just learned about." Although I can see merits on discussing that syntax differences exist between languages, that tends to overwhelm people learning their first language.
- mrcjkb 1y agoThat's a neat idea, but it would mean we'd have to maintain our own library. When editing with the CLI, you have to make sure you preserve comments, which the toml-edit crate does quite well.