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Jeep wrangler owners waiting for answers week after an update bricked their cars
- deveac 1y agoI planned on keeping my Wrangler for life when I ordered it, and so optioned it as mechanically simple as possible, including roll-down windows, manual trans, and no keyless entry. Stuff like this is, in part, why. Threw an aftermarket wireless CarPlay head unit in, and that is all the tech I need and more.
- shtzvhdx 1y agoWhat year is your wrangler?
- jmann99999 1y agoI bought my 2018 Wrangler with the same idea... keep it for life. That was also the last year they offered the "lifetime" warranty. Glad I went for that. So far, the Jeep has been fairly reliable, with my issues being: - Electric door locks and mirrors stopped working - Radiator leaked - CV Joints The Lifetime Warranty has now broken even (~$2500). Unfortunately, now my issue is rust, and the warranty doesn't cover that.
- jrnng 1y agoCheck out woolwax or similar products for rust prevention
- ssl-3 1y agoRust. I live in the north half of Ohio, so my stuff gets bathed in salty brine for several months out of the year and rust is a real problem for me. What I've found that works (for me): For stuff that isn't yet rusted, Fluid Film. It's easy to buy (it's on the shelf even at Wal-Mart). It's made primarily from lanolin, which is a product of the wool industry and is how sheep stay dry. If I were Very Serious about it, I'd find a shop that would cover the whole bottom of the vehicle (and anything that can be reached through holes) in the stuff and pay them to get that done. (I buy it in spray cans; some shops buy it in 55 gallon drums.) For stuff that is definitely already rusting, Corrosion-X. It's some kind of oily chemical soup that is supposed to prevent existing rust from getting worse, and also prevent new rust. One interesting feature is that it's available in 3 different viscosities; vaguely speaking, those viscosities are thin, medium, and elephant snot. The thin one does a fantastic job of creeping around to cover even unseen surfaces, but it washes off the fastest. The thicker ones hang around longer and creep less. (Tradeoffs, I guess.) I prefer Fluid Film just because it's more natural than some other things are and that makes me feel good in some way that I don't care to rationalize, but Fluid Film is not very good at recovering from existing rust. Corrosion-X, though? I can get the thin version of that worked into the joint of a completely rusted-stuck pair of box-jointed pliers and have them working very well (and looking fairly decent, though not "new") in a few minutes with a shop rag. I've heard stories of it being used to hose down whole electrical rooms in ocean-going boats. It's amazing stuff. (And it's expensive.) The practical downside is that these products all feel greasy, and they all turn black with enough time and enough miles. They're all ugly. For visible painted body panels, the best way I know to deal with small spots of rust from rock chips and stuff is to go full-ass on it. Get the Dremel out, pick an appropriate abrasive stone, and start grinding those little pinholes out until there's nothing but clean, shiny metal surrounded by paint. And then: Fill in with touchup paint that matches the factory paint code. (It's never perfect, but it does get easier to do a job that looks better than little rust spots do with some practice...and the little spots then don't turn into big spots.) Rust never sleeps. Good luck.
- greenavocado 1y agoFluid Film is inferior to Noxudol. There are many shops in the US which will apply Noxudol both underneath and inside body panels and frame rails with special 360 degree applicators. I believe it is a formula developed in Scandinavia. All of my cars are sprayed with the stuff for over a decade with no other maintenance.
- ssl-3 1y agoThanks for the tip. I hadn't heard of that one before. ~3 minutes of homework just now tells me that this is something I should probably have on the shelf in the garage.
- greenavocado 1y agoToyota required dealers to apply Noxudol to the new replacement truck frames as part of their recall service for rust.
- ssl-3 1y agoToyota may in fact be the world's foremost expert on recalling and replacing entire truck frames. I don't know if that's a blessing or a curse for Noxudol as an agent of longevity, but I'll try to see all of that in a positive light. :)
- jmann99999 1y agoThanks for the suggestions! Unfortunately, I have it on top and under the paint. I'll take a look at these for the uncovered portions.
- olelele 1y ago...how do you know the consistency of elephant snot?
- ssl-3 1y ago
- olelele 1y agoThere was a car mechanic who lived next to where my dad grew up in rural Sweden. He spent enormous amounts of time on the cars he got in to fix and took out automatic locks and all electric wiring to the point of the car being basically invincible to time and very simple to repair again. Some cars he never managed to finish fixing and they were simply left forever in his front yard... My grandma drives a 25 y o Suzuki Alto that is basically this car. It even has the old school non powered steering. Runs great still, has no issues since she only drives in summer. There is really something to be said for old mechanics and simple electric solutions. These days _everything_ has an embedded microcontroller and a touchscreen. I'm more on the luddite edge myself... If anyone is interested I can try to dig up an interview with the car mech on youtube (in swedish) :)
- jqpabc123 1y agoI have friends who ignored my advice and bought Jeeps. I told them, don't expect reliability --- and this is an example.
- pixxel 1y ago[dead]
- Brett_Riverboat 1y agojust another reason among many for why I refuse to own a car with an internet connection.
- SteveNuts 1y agoOr anything made by Stellantis, in my case at least.
- whynotmaybe 1y agoHow does it work in this case? The car has an esim and can connect to cellular network?
- bnjms 1y agoPeople on hn and I assume car forums will remove the radio antenna or otherwise disconnect the relevant hardware.
- SoftTalker 1y agoHowever, a second update has now been pushed that reportedly reverts the software to the previous version, and Jeep Cares cautioned that customers will not be able to tell which version they currently have by looking at Uconnect, because the problematic package doesn’t make any changes to the infotainment suite itself, meaning the version numbers will appear the same. What kind of complete amateur hour operation are they running there at Jeep/Stellantis?
- vincekerrazzi 1y agoAfter working with them for nearly a year, it’s even worse than you think. Half the team didn’t have basic understanding of git, and exactly none of the team designing the “smart charge” scheduling had or even had driven an EV. The complete incompetence of every vehicle OEM team I worked with outside of Tesla and Rivian is part of the reason I left that job.
- jve 1y agoYou are just confirming my suspicion on that car manufacturers have terrible software divisions. Outside of some new EVs which have software one of major selling points. Why don't classic manufacturers not ramp up their software quality side? I mean it's 2025, they lag behind at least a decade, but software development (infotaiment) practices seems like dark ages. Except for MCU - from user perspective they just work.
- HotGarbage 1y agoBecause everyone is making $300k+ at MAGA and they're offering half, if that.
- AlotOfReading 1y agoYou don't need 300k FAANG workers to make competent and reliable software. Companies in China and Japan manage just fine and half the tier 1s actually writing anything are outsourcing it to places where 300k USD is unthinkable. It's more important to start with an organization that cares about quality in the first place.
- rossdavidh 1y agoThe first question for any dev to ask themselves before rolling out any software update: do you know how to roll it back? This ought to be the sort of thing that management is there to remind the developers of, but in practice it seems like the opposite is true.
- gridspy 1y agoYeah, In application programming over the air is frankly terrifying because when it goes bad it goes really bad.
- Gigachad 1y agoI remember a firefox dev commenting that the updater code was the most dangerous part of the app to touch because if you break it, it's game over, you can't push a fix.
- Raicuparta 1y agoI already feel this with an app that only serves a few thousand people. Even with the paranoia I managed to mess up the updater once, a year+ later and still have people who haven't updated from that version. Always good to have a few redundant systems to help with this. Minimum being some way to push alerts to specific versions.
- throwaway173738 1y ago100%. How you manage updates and software configuration in general in remote embedded systems is near to my heart for the same reasons. I keep having to fight at work because none of my coworkers or management understand that outsourcing updates is basically hiring a third party to sometimes brick your equipment.
- rkomorn 1y ago> This ought to be the sort of thing that management is there to remind the developers of, but in practice it seems like the opposite is true. In my experience, management does remind developers of this. Usually after an incident that ultimately boils down to management having incentivized everything else at the cost of good operational practices.
- onetokeoverthe 1y ago[dead]
- dmix 1y agoThere's no recall yet? That's strange. Usually minor firmware recalls make headlines (at least for Tesla), this is a major issue without even a recall announcement?
- wand3r 1y agoTesla isn't the best proxy for what is normal. While Tesla has had a lot of issues and the critiques and articles are valid, it definitely seems like the media coverage was much more widespread and pervasive because 1)Anti Elon sentiment sells ads and clicks 2) it was somewhat agenda based. I am not making a political statement, but I think what I said is objectively true.
- RickJWagner 1y agoAfter years of development, Jeeps can now break down faster and more efficiently. Also: “power terrain”? For an auto mag, that’s a mistake on par with a software developer deploying to production without a backout plan.
- saurik 1y agoIt's been a decade now, I guess, since Charlie Miller figured out how to hack into Jeep Grand Cherokees and remotely disable the brakes. https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-highway/ https://www.wired.com/2015/07/hackers-remotely-kill-jeep-hig...
- kotaKat 1y agoThe funny part is one of Chrysler's "mitigations" was adding a "security gateway module" to "protect" all the communications (read: lock out diagnostic tools). The call still came from inside the house.
- chasing0entropy 1y agoOTA firmware updates for a vehicle should not exist. A car is an appliance that should do what it does. There are up upgrades to four rolling wheels. If there are, roll them into the next model year. Let the dealers upgrade older vehicles or recall the model.
- constantcrying 1y agoCustomers demand Software upgrades. >Let the dealers upgrade And every single customer will hate you for this.
- smileysteve 1y agoIf worked fine in the em early 2000 for cars with service plans or recalls. But they only did like 3-4 upgrades total while the model was still being produced. (Bmw experience)
- constantcrying 1y ago>If worked fine in the em early 2000 for cars with service plans or recalls. If you are telling customers today that their car will not receive updates or that the only way to receive updates is with an appointment at a dealership, they will not buy your car. It is not the early 2000s anymore, customers expect and want software support for their vehicles.
- chasing0entropy 1y agoYou've been drinking too much corporate coolaid. Zero percent of consumers care about having forced OTA updates. They want their vehicle to turn on, go, stop, and stream music from their personal tracking device. Next you'll tell me co-pilot is the best part of office 365
- smileysteve 1y agoIn the context, it would take an ignorant consumer to choose a vehicle that could lose engine, steering, and braking - and complete bricking - while at highway speed, over a dealer appointment that's included in your maintenance program. Frankly, this incident seems like an active nhsta would regulate away ota updates on its own. The best interpretation is that this single update is worse than the failed keyed ignition issues that led to push to start regulation.
- proactivesvcs 1y ago"So, if you’re a Wrangler 4xe owner, here’s your order of operations for the time being:" Do not use the vehicle under any circumstances and have the dealer take it away and keep it until it is safe to drive again.
- hulitu 1y ago> Jeep wrangler owners waiting for answers week after an update bricked their cars Don't worry. It will be fixed in a future update. Does Microsoft entered the Automotive business ? Because this surely looks like a lot of the issues with Windows, where an update breaks something and Microsoft needs a couple of succesive updates, until they acknoledge and fix the problem.