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I agree, and I was about to post the same thing. The idea of quantum processes fueling consciousness is my latest obsession. Specifically because I have genetic

by Noaidi 1y ago

I agree, and I was about to post the same thing. The idea of quantum processes fueling consciousness is my latest obsession. Specifically because I have genetic polymorphisms in the DNM3 gene that help maintain the functionality of these microtubules. https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/Q9UQ16/entry https://www.uniprot.org/uniprotkb/Q9UQ16/entry And let’s just say my experience of reality, or my consciousness, is quite unusual. My gene polymorphisms in DNM3 are linked to obsessive compulsive disorder, which I have. Like Penrose said, I believe our consciousness is an electromagnetic field, and not anything solid, but rather a femoral and affected by electromagnetic forces inside and outside of our brain

BirAdam 1y ago
I've had a weird thought that it might be that consciousness is the result of a quantum field that collapses to instantiate a consciousness when enough feedback mechanisms are present to allow for its function. Of course, this is likely not true, but it would explain a few things.
- exe34 1y ago
  I too am emotionally sensitive to the electromagnetic field. My phone is the transducer.
shadowgovt 1y ago
Interesting. I don't know that it's a literal electromagnetic field, but it does seem to be a dynamic pattern. I don't personally think I have enough information yet to guess at what medium that pattern is encoded in (I mean, except, broadly, "Brain stuff"). Not long ago, I suffered the first bout of unexpected unconsciousness I'd ever experienced; a series of unfortunate events caused me to pass out from pain (which I didn't quite understand was really a thing before then... Haha no that's real, you can get your brain shorted out from too much pain signal). The experience was a little... Cosmologically-reframing. It wasn't like sleep; it was a missing-time experience. Like, post-event me is acutely aware of a lack of me in that period of time; the body was there (I assume; I couldn't see it but there's nowhere for it to have gone), the thing I'd call myself seems to have completely 404'd for about a half hour. Put lots of thoughts of my own mortality in my head. Not sure I'd recommend it.
vasco 1y ago
> Like Penrose said, I believe our consciousness is an electromagnetic field, Careful around magnets my friend, your consciousness will change a lot if you're right.
- TehCorwiz 1y ago
  It does, we actually use Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation to treat Major Depressive Disorder and a few other things. Precisely because electromagnetic waves can alter our perceptions and behavior. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulat...
  - andy99 1y ago
    No, TMS is electric shock therapy, the magnetic field induces electrical currents in the brain and that is the mechanism for the effect. EM waves can “alter our perceptions and behavior” in the sense that electric shocking the brain can, not through some special interaction.
    - TehCorwiz 1y ago
      There's no shock. There's also no direct contact. It's literally magnetic.
      - cwillu 1y ago
        A changing magnetic field induces an electric field; this is how asynchronous motors work. Having been in the room with a patient undergoing TMS a couple dozen times, I can assure you that the electromagnet will induce a muscle twitch from the electric field it creates. What it doesn't do is cause a seizure, which is the typical desired result of ECT.
    - Noaidi 1y ago
      > No, TMS is electric shock therapy, This is just 100% false. To say that TMS is electric shock therapy because it changed electrical signals in the brain is totally misleading, if not, totally misunderstanding the science of the relationship between electricity and magnetism. The fact that both electricity and magnetism can affect neurotransmission does not mean that TMS and ECT are the same thing. When they give people ECT they’re giving them controlled seizures. In TMS this is not the case at all.
tsimionescu 1y ago
> I believe our consciousness is an electromagnetic field Well, this is almost certainly true in some very vague sense - I mean, it seems much more unlikely to meaningfully categorize it as a gravitational phenomenon, or a strong interaction phenomenon or a weak interaction phenomenon. Though it would be cool if somehow it turned out our minds had color charge. Of course, this is only the same sense in which Linux and McDonalds and potatoes are also electromagnetic fields, or phenomena related to it.
- markhahn 1y ago
  I think sometimes people forget that when we think of "chemistry", we're talking about an approximation based on behavior that ultimately emerges from quantum effects. It's just that you don't often need to model the full wavefunction to talk about an iron atom's ionization state in that cuvette where you're testing your pool water. We don't see a lot of macro-scale quantum weirdness because big and warm directly implies vast amounts of interaction - decoherence.
  - tsimionescu 1y ago
    Note that decoherence is only part of the answer. It explains why we don't see constructive interference, but it doesn't explain other effects that are missing from the classical world, such as why all classical objects have definite properties in the same measurment basis.

by Noaidi 1y ago

BirAdam 1y ago

I've had a weird thought that it might be that consciousness is the result of a quantum field that collapses to instantiate a consciousness when enough feedback mechanisms are present to allow for its function. Of course, this is likely not true, but it would explain a few things.

exe34 1y ago
I too am emotionally sensitive to the electromagnetic field. My phone is the transducer.

shadowgovt 1y ago

Interesting. I don't know that it's a literal electromagnetic field, but it does seem to be a dynamic pattern. I don't personally think I have enough information yet to guess at what medium that pattern is encoded in (I mean, except, broadly, "Brain stuff"). Not long ago, I suffered the first bout of unexpected unconsciousness I'd ever experienced; a series of unfortunate events caused me to pass out from pain (which I didn't quite understand was really a thing before then... Haha no that's real, you can get your brain shorted out from too much pain signal). The experience was a little... Cosmologically-reframing. It wasn't like sleep; it was a missing-time experience. Like, post-event me is acutely aware of a lack of me in that period of time; the body was there (I assume; I couldn't see it but there's nowhere for it to have gone), the thing I'd call myself seems to have completely 404'd for about a half hour. Put lots of thoughts of my own mortality in my head. Not sure I'd recommend it.

vasco 1y ago

> Like Penrose said, I believe our consciousness is an electromagnetic field, Careful around magnets my friend, your consciousness will change a lot if you're right.

TehCorwiz 1y ago
It does, we actually use Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation to treat Major Depressive Disorder and a few other things. Precisely because electromagnetic waves can alter our perceptions and behavior. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transcranial_magnetic_stimulat...
- andy99 1y ago
  No, TMS is electric shock therapy, the magnetic field induces electrical currents in the brain and that is the mechanism for the effect. EM waves can “alter our perceptions and behavior” in the sense that electric shocking the brain can, not through some special interaction.
  - TehCorwiz 1y ago
    There's no shock. There's also no direct contact. It's literally magnetic.
    - cwillu 1y ago
      A changing magnetic field induces an electric field; this is how asynchronous motors work. Having been in the room with a patient undergoing TMS a couple dozen times, I can assure you that the electromagnet will induce a muscle twitch from the electric field it creates. What it doesn't do is cause a seizure, which is the typical desired result of ECT.
  - Noaidi 1y ago
    > No, TMS is electric shock therapy, This is just 100% false. To say that TMS is electric shock therapy because it changed electrical signals in the brain is totally misleading, if not, totally misunderstanding the science of the relationship between electricity and magnetism. The fact that both electricity and magnetism can affect neurotransmission does not mean that TMS and ECT are the same thing. When they give people ECT they’re giving them controlled seizures. In TMS this is not the case at all.

tsimionescu 1y ago

> I believe our consciousness is an electromagnetic field Well, this is almost certainly true in some very vague sense - I mean, it seems much more unlikely to meaningfully categorize it as a gravitational phenomenon, or a strong interaction phenomenon or a weak interaction phenomenon. Though it would be cool if somehow it turned out our minds had color charge. Of course, this is only the same sense in which Linux and McDonalds and potatoes are also electromagnetic fields, or phenomena related to it.

markhahn 1y ago
I think sometimes people forget that when we think of "chemistry", we're talking about an approximation based on behavior that ultimately emerges from quantum effects. It's just that you don't often need to model the full wavefunction to talk about an iron atom's ionization state in that cuvette where you're testing your pool water. We don't see a lot of macro-scale quantum weirdness because big and warm directly implies vast amounts of interaction - decoherence.
- tsimionescu 1y ago
  Note that decoherence is only part of the answer. It explains why we don't see constructive interference, but it doesn't explain other effects that are missing from the classical world, such as why all classical objects have definite properties in the same measurment basis.