6 ms·

I mean, Whole Foods targets upper middle class folks, you’re far away from the average American experience

Jensson 1y ago
Yeah, when I visited USA I was shocked to find lots of larger "grocery stores" didn't even stock the basics. In Europe that isn't a thing, everything larger than a regular room has fresh vegetables and meat and other staples, even in immigrant areas. Sure it might be possible to find that in USA as well, but its so much harder as not every store has it.
- vel0city 1y ago
  What kind of "basics" did you find missing in actual grocery stores, and what were the actual stores in question?
  - OJFord 1y ago
    Not GP, but I can offer: real cheese (not squares of individually wrapped plastic, nor grated and mixed with whatever to prevent caking), Walmart.
    - vel0city 1y ago
      What? Just about every Walmart with a grocery I've been to sells blocks of cheese. These are all available at multiple Walmarts around me. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Block-Sharp-Cheddar-Cheese-8-oz/34186946 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Block-Sharp-Cheddar-C... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Low-Moisture-Part-Skim-Mozzarella-Cheese-16-oz-Block-Plastic-Packaging/10452382 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Low-Moisture-Part-Ski... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Frigo-Parmesan-Cheese-Wedge-5-oz-Plastic-Wrap-Refrigerated-Hard-Cheese/10307247 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Frigo-Parmesan-Cheese-Wedge-5-oz-... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tillamook-Medium-Cheddar-Cheese-Block-1-lb-Aged-60-Days/10292851 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tillamook-Medium-Cheddar-Cheese-B... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Swiss-Cheese-Block-8-oz/10452776 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Swiss-Cheese-Block-8-... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Dutchmark-Smoked-Gouda-Cheese-7-oz/409234097 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Dutchmark-Smoked-Gouda-Cheese-7-o... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castello-Gourmet-Creamy-Danish-Havarti-Cheese-8oz-Block/42393930 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castello-Gourmet-Creamy-Danish-Ha... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Kerrygold-Grass-Fed-Dubliner-Irish-Cheese-7oz/15724255 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Kerrygold-Grass-Fed-Dubliner-Iris... and on and on and on and on and on... It might not be right next to the pre-shredded cheese (usually those house brand blocks of cheddar and what not are), sometimes they're in a fancier part of the deli area. But I can't think of a time I've gone to a Walmart looking for a block of cheese and not found any cheese. Its not going to be the fanciest varieties, but once again the question was for "basics" that don't exist. Having cheddar, swiss, parmesean, gouda, etc. is having the basics.
      - thatfrenchguy 1y ago
        Yeah, no European is going to tell you this is "real cheese"
        vel0city 1y ago
        What makes it not "real cheese"?
        OJFord 1y ago
        The 'cheddars' are a weird colour and look rubbery, the 'mozzarella' is a hard block(‽), the 'Swiss cheese' is... I don't know what, which Swiss cheese is it? I didn't look further than that; the parmesan looked most plausible - though '10 months' stood out, I don't think I've seen less than 24 in UK supermarkets, possibly it's a PDO related thing regulating the process. (Whereas the US doesn't respect PDO and linked one possibly made in US anyway.)
        vel0city 1y ago
        You're able to tell the actual texture and hardness of the cheese through pictures on website listing. Incredible. Cheddar is expected to be this color in the US market, its common to add annatto to it. There are other white cheddars as well, but its usually expected to be about this color. Its not weird to be in cheese as its commonly found in Red Leicester, Double Gloucester, Cheshire, and Shropshire Blue, French Mimolette, and even other European varieties of cheddar. Mozzarella often comes in multiple different varieties. There's the "fresh" mozzarella which is sold in the whey, while there's also commonly "low-moisture" mozzarella that's commonly used for shredding purposes. This is true in the US as in Europe. Either way, "fresh" mozzarella can also be easily found at Walmart. https://www.walmart.com/ip/BelGioioso-Fresh-Mozzarella-Cheese-Ball-Specialty-Soft-Cheese-Refrigerated-8-oz-Plastic-Wrapping/15754144 https://www.walmart.com/ip/BelGioioso-Fresh-Mozzarella-Chees... "Swiss cheese" is a common name for Emmental in the US. So once again, ignorance. Thanks for showcasing it so clearly. I guess Emmental isn't a real cheese either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_cheese_(North_America) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_cheese_(North_America) So ignorance and pretentiousness. Got it. Thanks for proving it. But hey, you also said these products didn't even exist just a few comments ago so its not too surprising. Once again, I'm not saying these are high quality cheeses. They're cheap. They're not fancy at all. Nobody goes to Walmart to get "the good stuff". But that doesn't make them not cheese. Maybe crappy cheeses, sure. Maybe produced in not the right region for a given name according to some jurisdictions. But the standard given was real and basic, not fancy or high end or excellent quality or whatever. I would agree, for good cheese I don't go to Walmart, I go elsewhere. But if all I need is a block of cheddar or emmental or "gouda" or whatever to make some sandwiches, its fine. If you had said "good" cheese I'd have agreed with you. It's not great cheese. If I'm wanting good cheese I'll go elsewhere. But instead the standard was "real" cheese.
    - asdff 1y ago
      Real cheese is not rare. It is a little pricey though. Usually north of $15 a lb.
      - vel0city 1y ago
        What makes the cheese in the links I provided below not "real cheese"? None are >$15/lb, at least around me. Note, I agree, they're not fancy cheeses, they're quite basic, plain, and common varieties. But how are they not real cheeses?
        asdff 1y ago
        Just my choice of words nothing too serious.
      - thatfrenchguy 1y ago
        at Safeway or Walmart? Absolutely not what most europeans would consider "real cheese"
- volkl48 1y ago
  Were you actually visiting what Americans would consider a grocery store? I'm not saying this is specifically the case for you, but it is remarkably common for visitors from other parts of the world to visit, go into what we consider a "convenience store", and then be confused that there's basically nothing in terms of actual groceries in there, with probably 80%+ of the "consumable" shelving devoted to snack/"junk" items. Those stores are intended pretty much entirely for stuff people want while on the go, and the few "groceries" they stock are basically aimed at the kind of things a drunk/stoned person is craving at 3AM when nothing else is open (say, a frozen pizza), or the few things you might run out of by surprise in the morning/when about to eat and be willing to greatly overpay for being able to grab somewhere close by before your meal/schedule is ruined. (ex: milk, condiments, maybe eggs).
  - vel0city 1y ago
    I do wonder if people are stopping into a CVS or Walgreens and thinking those are grocery stores. In a lot of the rest of the world, a small corner market like that would be a grocer, but in the US grocers are much larger stores.
  - Jensson 1y ago
    > I'm not saying this is specifically the case for you, but it is remarkably common for visitors from other parts of the world to visit, go into what we consider a "convenience store", and then be confused that there's basically nothing in terms of actual groceries in there, with probably 80%+ of the "consumable" shelving devoted to snack/"junk" items. But that is the problem isn't it? That you have to drive so far and look on a map to find a grocery store while in Europe you can just walk for 5 minutes and find one where you can buy fresh produce. So in Europe there are these convenient grocery stores that stocks fresh produce and so on, USA not having those is what we talked about. So sure if you define "grocery store" as a store that sells fresh produce you are right, but then there are very few grocery stores in USA which is still the problem we talked about. It is so much easier and faster to get these wares in Europe than in USA.
    - volkl48 1y ago
- supportengineer 1y ago
  Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Please provide some, or retract your claim.
nradov 1y ago
I thought that Whole Foods targets folks who like their food flavored with rat droppings? https://www.siliconvalley.com/2025/06/26/cupertino-whole-foods-still-closed/ https://www.siliconvalley.com/2025/06/26/cupertino-whole-foo...
asdff 1y ago
Leafy greens and cuts of meat are not something exclusive to whole foods. The real issue is people don't cook for themselves and seek out premade shelf stable offerings of what their grandparents were making from scratch decades ago. It is like knowledge has been lost.

Yeah, when I visited USA I was shocked to find lots of larger "grocery stores" didn't even stock the basics. In Europe that isn't a thing, everything larger than a regular room has fresh vegetables and meat and other staples, even in immigrant areas. Sure it might be possible to find that in USA as well, but its so much harder as not every store has it.

vel0city 1y ago
What kind of "basics" did you find missing in actual grocery stores, and what were the actual stores in question?
- OJFord 1y ago
  Not GP, but I can offer: real cheese (not squares of individually wrapped plastic, nor grated and mixed with whatever to prevent caking), Walmart.
  - vel0city 1y ago
    What? Just about every Walmart with a grocery I've been to sells blocks of cheese. These are all available at multiple Walmarts around me. https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Block-Sharp-Cheddar-Cheese-8-oz/34186946 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Block-Sharp-Cheddar-C... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Low-Moisture-Part-Skim-Mozzarella-Cheese-16-oz-Block-Plastic-Packaging/10452382 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Low-Moisture-Part-Ski... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Frigo-Parmesan-Cheese-Wedge-5-oz-Plastic-Wrap-Refrigerated-Hard-Cheese/10307247 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Frigo-Parmesan-Cheese-Wedge-5-oz-... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tillamook-Medium-Cheddar-Cheese-Block-1-lb-Aged-60-Days/10292851 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Tillamook-Medium-Cheddar-Cheese-B... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Swiss-Cheese-Block-8-oz/10452776 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Great-Value-Swiss-Cheese-Block-8-... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Dutchmark-Smoked-Gouda-Cheese-7-oz/409234097 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Dutchmark-Smoked-Gouda-Cheese-7-o... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castello-Gourmet-Creamy-Danish-Havarti-Cheese-8oz-Block/42393930 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Castello-Gourmet-Creamy-Danish-Ha... https://www.walmart.com/ip/Kerrygold-Grass-Fed-Dubliner-Irish-Cheese-7oz/15724255 https://www.walmart.com/ip/Kerrygold-Grass-Fed-Dubliner-Iris... and on and on and on and on and on... It might not be right next to the pre-shredded cheese (usually those house brand blocks of cheddar and what not are), sometimes they're in a fancier part of the deli area. But I can't think of a time I've gone to a Walmart looking for a block of cheese and not found any cheese. Its not going to be the fanciest varieties, but once again the question was for "basics" that don't exist. Having cheddar, swiss, parmesean, gouda, etc. is having the basics.
    - thatfrenchguy 1y ago
      Yeah, no European is going to tell you this is "real cheese"
      - vel0city 1y ago
        What makes it not "real cheese"?
        OJFord 1y ago
        The 'cheddars' are a weird colour and look rubbery, the 'mozzarella' is a hard block(‽), the 'Swiss cheese' is... I don't know what, which Swiss cheese is it? I didn't look further than that; the parmesan looked most plausible - though '10 months' stood out, I don't think I've seen less than 24 in UK supermarkets, possibly it's a PDO related thing regulating the process. (Whereas the US doesn't respect PDO and linked one possibly made in US anyway.)
        vel0city 1y ago
        You're able to tell the actual texture and hardness of the cheese through pictures on website listing. Incredible. Cheddar is expected to be this color in the US market, its common to add annatto to it. There are other white cheddars as well, but its usually expected to be about this color. Its not weird to be in cheese as its commonly found in Red Leicester, Double Gloucester, Cheshire, and Shropshire Blue, French Mimolette, and even other European varieties of cheddar. Mozzarella often comes in multiple different varieties. There's the "fresh" mozzarella which is sold in the whey, while there's also commonly "low-moisture" mozzarella that's commonly used for shredding purposes. This is true in the US as in Europe. Either way, "fresh" mozzarella can also be easily found at Walmart. https://www.walmart.com/ip/BelGioioso-Fresh-Mozzarella-Cheese-Ball-Specialty-Soft-Cheese-Refrigerated-8-oz-Plastic-Wrapping/15754144 https://www.walmart.com/ip/BelGioioso-Fresh-Mozzarella-Chees... "Swiss cheese" is a common name for Emmental in the US. So once again, ignorance. Thanks for showcasing it so clearly. I guess Emmental isn't a real cheese either. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_cheese_(North_America) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_cheese_(North_America) So ignorance and pretentiousness. Got it. Thanks for proving it. But hey, you also said these products didn't even exist just a few comments ago so its not too surprising. Once again, I'm not saying these are high quality cheeses. They're cheap. They're not fancy at all. Nobody goes to Walmart to get "the good stuff". But that doesn't make them not cheese. Maybe crappy cheeses, sure. Maybe produced in not the right region for a given name according to some jurisdictions. But the standard given was real and basic, not fancy or high end or excellent quality or whatever. I would agree, for good cheese I don't go to Walmart, I go elsewhere. But if all I need is a block of cheddar or emmental or "gouda" or whatever to make some sandwiches, its fine. If you had said "good" cheese I'd have agreed with you. It's not great cheese. If I'm wanting good cheese I'll go elsewhere. But instead the standard was "real" cheese.
  - asdff 1y ago
    Real cheese is not rare. It is a little pricey though. Usually north of $15 a lb.
    - vel0city 1y ago
      What makes the cheese in the links I provided below not "real cheese"? None are >$15/lb, at least around me. Note, I agree, they're not fancy cheeses, they're quite basic, plain, and common varieties. But how are they not real cheeses?
      - asdff 1y ago
        Just my choice of words nothing too serious.
    - thatfrenchguy 1y ago
      at Safeway or Walmart? Absolutely not what most europeans would consider "real cheese"
volkl48 1y ago
Were you actually visiting what Americans would consider a grocery store? I'm not saying this is specifically the case for you, but it is remarkably common for visitors from other parts of the world to visit, go into what we consider a "convenience store", and then be confused that there's basically nothing in terms of actual groceries in there, with probably 80%+ of the "consumable" shelving devoted to snack/"junk" items. Those stores are intended pretty much entirely for stuff people want while on the go, and the few "groceries" they stock are basically aimed at the kind of things a drunk/stoned person is craving at 3AM when nothing else is open (say, a frozen pizza), or the few things you might run out of by surprise in the morning/when about to eat and be willing to greatly overpay for being able to grab somewhere close by before your meal/schedule is ruined. (ex: milk, condiments, maybe eggs).
- vel0city 1y ago
  I do wonder if people are stopping into a CVS or Walgreens and thinking those are grocery stores. In a lot of the rest of the world, a small corner market like that would be a grocer, but in the US grocers are much larger stores.
- Jensson 1y ago
  > I'm not saying this is specifically the case for you, but it is remarkably common for visitors from other parts of the world to visit, go into what we consider a "convenience store", and then be confused that there's basically nothing in terms of actual groceries in there, with probably 80%+ of the "consumable" shelving devoted to snack/"junk" items. But that is the problem isn't it? That you have to drive so far and look on a map to find a grocery store while in Europe you can just walk for 5 minutes and find one where you can buy fresh produce. So in Europe there are these convenient grocery stores that stocks fresh produce and so on, USA not having those is what we talked about. So sure if you define "grocery store" as a store that sells fresh produce you are right, but then there are very few grocery stores in USA which is still the problem we talked about. It is so much easier and faster to get these wares in Europe than in USA.
  - volkl48 1y ago
supportengineer 1y ago
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Please provide some, or retract your claim.

nradov 1y ago

I thought that Whole Foods targets folks who like their food flavored with rat droppings? https://www.siliconvalley.com/2025/06/26/cupertino-whole-foods-still-closed/ https://www.siliconvalley.com/2025/06/26/cupertino-whole-foo...

asdff 1y ago

Leafy greens and cuts of meat are not something exclusive to whole foods. The real issue is people don't cook for themselves and seek out premade shelf stable offerings of what their grandparents were making from scratch decades ago. It is like knowledge has been lost.