6 ms·

ElementaryOS – Thoughtful, capable and ethical replacement for Windows/macOS

104 points by donutshop 1y ago

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
rckt 1y ago
Last time I tried it there was no way to upgrade between versions. One had to reinstall the os to upgrade. But maybe this changed.
- sprkwd 1y ago
  This too is the blocker for me using it on the regular.
chakintosh 1y ago
This seems like a great OS to install on a child's computer
- poly2it 1y ago
  What makes an OS great for children?
  - BoredPositron 1y ago
    I guess the 'Screen Time & Limits' app featured prominently further down the page.
- pndy 1y ago
  Years ago I installed it on my sister's computer as Windows replacement. She was initially happy but soon started to complain that it was hard for her to use, apps would freeze and graphic artifacts would remain on the screen in similar way as on XP once. In the end we went with Xubuntu because we thought that reinstalling as "upgrade" is not worth it. It's a stop-gap for those who were using OSX and not a permanent solution, or something for people who want to try Linux but want a really easy way. But then, there are better managed and newbie friendly distributions already.
bsimpson 1y ago
Elementary has been around for a long time. From what I recall, it tries to ape the Mac style on Linux the same way that KDE has been accused of aping Windows. The original founder (Cassidy James Blaede) is now a designer for GNOME: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJq8Cq9LixE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJq8Cq9LixE I wonder why this is on the front page today.
- noosphr 1y ago
  OP probably had to update Windows today. It's a weird world where KDE out of the box is more usable than Windows. I gave the wrong laptop to my mother a few months back and she only told me when she finished banking that the windows menu looked funny (Like the hacker one you put on the family computer when you were 12.) it was KDE. Usually she asks for help at least once on windows for getting the wifi connected. The year of desktop Linux was 5 years ago and we didn't even notice.
  - carl_dr 1y ago
    /r/thathappened She had an account on the wrong laptop?
    - sgc 1y ago
      That is such an awkward comment and not really worthy of hn. Have you never logged into a bank website?
    - noosphr 1y ago
      All my pcs have a locked down guest/guest account which gets nuked on logout.
    - 553468907542358 1y ago
      Go back to reddit
- taejavu 1y ago
  It’s on the front page because Apple dropped the ball so hard with Tahoe that people are willing to entertain the thought of switching to just about anything other than macOS
stavros 1y ago
What's a popular rolling release distro that's fairly stable, but also modern, for my dad's computer? He just wants a good balance of "things won't break" and "things will get updated". Ubuntu is ok, but maybe pop!OS or something else is better for him?
- rahimnathwani 1y ago
  Fedora isn't a rolling release but updates pretty often.
- haunter 1y ago
  Fedora Kinoite https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/kinoite/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/kinoite/ I really do think that immutable distros are the future especially if you want something that don’t break. And imo KDE is arguably the best DE right now, that is if you believe DEs should follow the WinNT era UX principles. But there is a version with GNOME too or Cosmic https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/silverblue/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/silverblue/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/cosmic/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/cosmic/
  - stavros 1y ago
    Thanks! I do love KDE, it's my daily driver. Exit: OK immutable looks really interesting, thank you.
    - baobun 1y ago
      Immutable is promising and Kinoite great but just heads up that since it's Fedora based you still have their major-release-upgrade cycle to follow. There are rolling immutable/atomic distros but Kinoute is not one.
      - Alupis 1y ago
        FWIW, Kinoite will auto-update itself (the base image gets an update nearly every day). While Fedora technically isn't a rolling release distro, it is very "bleeding edge" and it's major release cycle is quite frequent. With the Atomic (Immutable) flavors, major releases are an easy upgrade - just click the "Upgrade" button then reboot without fear of anything breaking.
Qem 1y ago
IIRC ElementaryOS had the distinction of using mostly Vala/Genie for development of distro specific software. Is that still the case?
- janc_ 1y ago
  They certainly still recommend it. Too bad the evolution & development of Vala itself has stagnated mostly.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    IMHO they missed the boat - they should have pushed Objective C and later Swift. Lots of Mac / iOS developers were curious about Elementary when it was new.
    - janc_ 1y ago
      They forked off from Gnome, and thus used Gobject/Gtk, which probably wouldn't fit so well with Objective C & its decendents…
themafia 1y ago
> We review all AppCenter apps to ensure they’re properly using permissions Who is "we?" How is that team selected? Are their decisions public? What is the review or appeal process like?
- DanRabbit 1y ago
  “We” is just our developer community. Folks that have write access to our git repos. We manage AppCenter reviews as pull requests to a public git repository: https://github.com/elementary/appcenter-reviews https://github.com/elementary/appcenter-reviews There’s some more documentation for developers here: https://docs.elementary.io/develop/appcenter/publishing-requirements https://docs.elementary.io/develop/appcenter/publishing-requ...
doug_durham 1y ago
I find the description of the project to be patronizing. "Just the apps you need"? How do you know what I need? What about the battery life I need, or the excellent touchpad support that I need? Most distros drop the ball on those fundamental things.
yunnpp 1y ago
Cannot recommend. The software center immediately broke itself into a loop of god-knows-what error that rendered itself unable to update the system. The system generally suffered from poor usability as well. Cannot comment much further because I didn't use it very long. I paid $20 for it and wish the project well, but it's a pass from me for the time being.
- naasking 1y ago
  I recently installed it on a 13 year old old MacBook, haven't had any issues.
  - literatepeople 1y ago
    I am still a sponsor or elementary and used it for years, and often the first few months are fine until you hit a wall or need to upgrade it. recently switched to Fedora and have been much happier.
    - d3Xt3r 1y ago
      > often the first few months are fine until you hit a wall or need to upgrade it. This is a common theme with Ubuntu and every Ubuntu-based distro - they all eventually break when doing updates. Eg: https://ounapuu.ee/posts/2025/02/05/done-with-ubuntu/ https://ounapuu.ee/posts/2025/02/05/done-with-ubuntu/
- SyneRyder 1y ago
  Similar issues here with software center. There are some updates that continue working fine, but I'll often have to drop to the command line and use apt to do the full system update... which is not very "elementaryOS-like", when you consider how much it focuses on usability and UI and making a system where users won't need the command line. EDIT: Tried again today, and the specific error I get when trying to update via Software Center, which then prevents any further updating: http:// archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy-updates/main amd64 libsmbclient amd64 2:4.15.13+dfsg-0ubuntu1.8 is not (yet) available (404 Not Found) I've mostly stayed on elementaryOS 7.x, which is actually the best Linux I've ever tried for my use case. It's the closest Linux to what I would like my computer to feel like, and for a while I was running it almost as a daily driver for about 50% of my work (with Windows / mac for the rest). But the elementaryOS 8.x series was far too buggy on my system, even the dock was unusable for too long (though apparently now resolved). Having to reinstall the OS with each major version is awkward too, even when I run my Linux installs off a USB stick for easy switching.
renewiltord 1y ago
Oh I remember using this years ago. It was pretty good. My memory always confuses it with enlightenment which had fancy compositing on a crappy computer in the early 2000s which I loved it for.
StopDisinfo910 1y ago
Did Elementary change designer? This version seems to have flaws I didn’t see in the old announcements. Spacing and padding are a bit inconsistent and sometimes a bit strange. Font sizing can be weird and alignment is hit and miss especially when icons and text are involved. Clearly these are details but I’m wondering if they lost man power on these points. I still greatly appreciate the project ambition and am impressed by what they have managed to achieve.
wsgeorge 1y ago
I fell in love with elementaryOS when I first learned about it c. 2013, and followed it closely (used to read commits weekly) for perhaps a year. It was one of the first open source projects I really loved. But I eventually went back to Ubuntu because I was newish to Linux and I needed something that Just Worked™, without the funny business. I eventually fell out of love with elementaryOS when the team seemed to double down hard on some unpopular design decisions wrt window control buttons/behaviour, for instance. I always felt that they had taken on more than they could chew, and all the good will of their community wasn't going to change that fact. To this day I maintain that the project should have just been Pantheon, the Desktop Environment. The team seems to have strong opinions about UX, and that's where most of that matters. I'm not the only one who thought of that, and the team's justifications for their decision to roll their own distro never came across as strong. I've since moved on (to macOS and Ubuntu one the side), but once in a while I browse the official sub for the latest. I've never shaken off that feeling that the really talented founders could have spent their energy more wisely.
kingforaday 1y ago
Serious question. What does the project mean by ethical replacement? The main webpage makes no further declaration around it for deeper understanding. Nothing in support pages or in developer resources. Anyone else familiar with the project that could describe why that needed to be called out?
- sergiotapia 1y ago
  Probably a dig at DHH given the tremendous growth and popularity of Omarchy. He's being attacked for "being a nazi" by the usual suspects.
  - crtasm 1y ago
    It's been there for at least 4 years so I would think not https://web.archive.org/web/20210902014243/https://elementary.io/ https://web.archive.org/web/20210902014243/https://elementar...
    - sergiotapia 1y ago
      I stand corrected!
- baggy_trough 1y ago
  "I happen to own a little open source software company that is expressly anti-fascist, has a “No AI” policy, and has recently been called “aggressively queer” in case you’re interested in supporting tech companies like that:" https://mastodon.social/@danirabbit@mastodon.online/115356065854982668 https://mastodon.social/@danirabbit@mastodon.online/11535606...
nipperkinfeet 1y ago
Elementary OS is stuck in 2011, offering limited customization options. I remember having hard time adding desktop icons. These days, much superior distributions are available. Examples include Mint, EndeavourOS and Fedora...
- Wowfunhappy 1y ago
  Customization is great, but what's even better is when the defaults are just perfect to begin with...
- DaSHacka 1y ago
  But are any of those "aggressively queer"? Didn't think so. Checkmate, Linux users
  - bigyabai 1y ago
    Even as a happy Linux user and gay person, I have to admit that much of GNOME's design philosophy is queer to me.
hecifato 1y ago
Elementary was one of the first Linux distros I installed back in 2020. Eventually I moved on to other distros and DE’s. I was hopeful for Elementary eventually becoming THE Linux distro I would recommend people but it hasn’t happened yet, and I don’t know if it ever will. I remember Elementary being big on UX, design, creating a universal app store for Linux, and providing a sane default type of experience. Pretty much all of that fizzled out over the past 5 years. GNOME and Plasma both leapfrogged Pantheon as a DE. Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, and Fedora are all far easier recommends over Elementary.
- SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
  My outside reading: there were about 2-3 key people driving the project at that time. My understanding is that right around that time or shortly thereafter there was a falling out of some sort between two of the key people, one left, and the momentum just tanked after that. Note that this is just an outsiders perspective gained from reading blog posts from the org and watching release cadences
valunord 1y ago
[flagged]
- outcoldman 1y ago
  Can anybody explain what is behind this statement? Tried to google, could not find much.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    Queer people are terrorists now, don’t you read your GOP newsletter? /s
    - 553468907542358 1y ago
      Can't even murder political opponents without being called a terrorist. Damn the right!
  - pndy 1y ago
    I remember people on mastodon saying that project leader went too much political by focusing on gender and identity while actual system development was pushed away. But since my journey with elementary was over years ago I didn't care that much. Maybe check other search engines and go with "elementaryos controversial" or similar words
  - outcoldman 1y ago
    FYI: found information here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30611748 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30611748
- saubeidl 1y ago
  ????
dang 1y ago
These seem to be the major related threads. Others? Elementary OS 7 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34598987 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34598987 - Jan 2023 (92 comments) Elementary OS 6.1 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29627193 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29627193 - Dec 2021 (142 comments) Elementary OS 6 Odin - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28130560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28130560 - Aug 2021 (319 comments) Elementary OS 6 beta - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27001736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27001736 - May 2021 (69 comments) Cheers to 10 Years - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26658317 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26658317 - April 2021 (77 comments) Elementary OS 5.1 Hera - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21719028 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21719028 - Dec 2019 (190 comments) Elementary OS – Fast, open, privacy-respecting replacement for Windows and macOS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18472018 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18472018 - Nov 2018 (421 comments) Elementary OS 5 Juno Is Here - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18236240 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18236240 - Oct 2018 (15 comments) Switching from macOS: Developer Environment - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12877045 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12877045 - Nov 2016 (172 comments) Switching from macOS: The Basics - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12853531 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12853531 - Nov 2016 (593 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12830761 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12830761 - Oct 2016 (386 comments) Elementary OS Loki 0.4 Stable Release - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12465763 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12465763 - Sept 2016 (63 comments) Elementary OS Freya Released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9361477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9361477 - April 2015 (87 comments) Elementary OS 0.3 “Freya” is released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9359722 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9359722 - April 2015 (62 comments) Elementary OS Freya Beta 2 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9049592 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9049592 - Feb 2015 (43 comments) Myths about ElementaryOS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7864397 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7864397 - June 2014 (53 comments) ElementaryOs Luna released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6193148 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6193148 - Aug 2013 (296 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2781891 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2781891 - July 2011 (79 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2091736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2091736 - Jan 2011 (15 comments)
TheAceOfHearts 1y ago
I'm not sure if anything about this has changed since I last tried ElementaryOS an unknown number of years ago, but one of the issues I remember encountering was that applications that weren't built-in had inconsistent styling. I think you get a better more consistent and featureful experience just by using KDE. Even the list of applications on AppCenter is woefully limited, compared to using Flatpack and being able to access the full repertoire of Linux Desktop applications.
- bsimpson 1y ago
  Isn't that just a Linux problem, where someone could be using GTK or Kirigami or Iced for widgets? Most Mac developers use Cocoa/SwiftUI, so they get whatever widgets the UXEs at Apple have produced. Adobe famously did their post-2000 UIs in Java, so they have a nonstandard design system; you can tell they don't use Cocoa just by looking at their apps. Since there's no Apple to make an official toolkit for Linux, each developer uses whatever he wants, which means this app might use the GTK Save button, whereas that one uses Kirigami.
  - seec 1y ago
    You can tell the Adobe UI isn't native but it's actually pretty good. In fact, I believe they had the right call since Apple frameworks are too limiting for complexe software like that and they needed the cross-platform compatibility anyway. Serif does the same with their suite of Apps and it's fine as well. Blender is custom as well... Apple aficionados tend to get worked up about it (and I used to be this type) but they need to understand that there is always a necessary power balance to maintain, and going all-in with Apple tools is not a very good decision for a large software. They have proven time and time again that they will just mess up stuff when it suits them and companies with such big software endeavors cannot submit totally to the Apple agenda. And even as an end user I would argue that UI uniformity is not very relevant, how the software works / what it allows is much more important. Relying too much on Apple software is also a losing strategy, as they have shown with Aperture and their office suite, they have basically rewritten from scratch every time with a newer incompatible format creating a lot of headaches and somehow managing to take years to give back functionality that existed before. Apple focuses way too much on looks at the expense of many other properties (as they have shown again recently with the Liquid Glass) and its basically fashion at this point. And since Apple cannot cater to every single use case, plenty of devs end up having to work up a custom UI on top of their framework, so if there is a complexe use case, you might as well cut the middle man from the get go...
hubrix 1y ago
I am wondering why no one is using the wonderful LLM coding tools to cut branches of open source apps rewriting them for consistent UI. From my experience with them so far this is a task that they would be really good at especially if the underlying codebase has decent test coverage.
raffael_de 1y ago
Isn't it a bit misleading to compare this to Windows or macOS, when it is actually Ubuntu with a preinstalled window manager, like Gnome or KDE, and it just looks a little like macOS out of the box? From the web-site I couldn't tell why I would consider it over established options like Linux Mint. To qualify as a replacement I would expect it to run native binaries. LibreOffice for example is a replacement for Office as it can handle xlsx and docx etc.

104 points by donutshop 1y ago

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

rckt 1y ago

Last time I tried it there was no way to upgrade between versions. One had to reinstall the os to upgrade. But maybe this changed.

sprkwd 1y ago
This too is the blocker for me using it on the regular.

chakintosh 1y ago

This seems like a great OS to install on a child's computer

poly2it 1y ago
What makes an OS great for children?
- BoredPositron 1y ago
  I guess the 'Screen Time & Limits' app featured prominently further down the page.
pndy 1y ago
Years ago I installed it on my sister's computer as Windows replacement. She was initially happy but soon started to complain that it was hard for her to use, apps would freeze and graphic artifacts would remain on the screen in similar way as on XP once. In the end we went with Xubuntu because we thought that reinstalling as "upgrade" is not worth it. It's a stop-gap for those who were using OSX and not a permanent solution, or something for people who want to try Linux but want a really easy way. But then, there are better managed and newbie friendly distributions already.

bsimpson 1y ago

Elementary has been around for a long time. From what I recall, it tries to ape the Mac style on Linux the same way that KDE has been accused of aping Windows. The original founder (Cassidy James Blaede) is now a designer for GNOME: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJq8Cq9LixE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJq8Cq9LixE I wonder why this is on the front page today.

noosphr 1y ago
OP probably had to update Windows today. It's a weird world where KDE out of the box is more usable than Windows. I gave the wrong laptop to my mother a few months back and she only told me when she finished banking that the windows menu looked funny (Like the hacker one you put on the family computer when you were 12.) it was KDE. Usually she asks for help at least once on windows for getting the wifi connected. The year of desktop Linux was 5 years ago and we didn't even notice.
- carl_dr 1y ago
  /r/thathappened She had an account on the wrong laptop?
  - sgc 1y ago
    That is such an awkward comment and not really worthy of hn. Have you never logged into a bank website?
  - noosphr 1y ago
    All my pcs have a locked down guest/guest account which gets nuked on logout.
  - 553468907542358 1y ago
    Go back to reddit
taejavu 1y ago
It’s on the front page because Apple dropped the ball so hard with Tahoe that people are willing to entertain the thought of switching to just about anything other than macOS

stavros 1y ago

What's a popular rolling release distro that's fairly stable, but also modern, for my dad's computer? He just wants a good balance of "things won't break" and "things will get updated". Ubuntu is ok, but maybe pop!OS or something else is better for him?

rahimnathwani 1y ago
Fedora isn't a rolling release but updates pretty often.
haunter 1y ago
Fedora Kinoite https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/kinoite/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/kinoite/ I really do think that immutable distros are the future especially if you want something that don’t break. And imo KDE is arguably the best DE right now, that is if you believe DEs should follow the WinNT era UX principles. But there is a version with GNOME too or Cosmic https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/silverblue/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/silverblue/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/cosmic/ https://fedoraproject.org/atomic-desktops/cosmic/
- stavros 1y ago
  Thanks! I do love KDE, it's my daily driver. Exit: OK immutable looks really interesting, thank you.
  - baobun 1y ago
    Immutable is promising and Kinoite great but just heads up that since it's Fedora based you still have their major-release-upgrade cycle to follow. There are rolling immutable/atomic distros but Kinoute is not one.
    - Alupis 1y ago
      FWIW, Kinoite will auto-update itself (the base image gets an update nearly every day). While Fedora technically isn't a rolling release distro, it is very "bleeding edge" and it's major release cycle is quite frequent. With the Atomic (Immutable) flavors, major releases are an easy upgrade - just click the "Upgrade" button then reboot without fear of anything breaking.

Qem 1y ago

IIRC ElementaryOS had the distinction of using mostly Vala/Genie for development of distro specific software. Is that still the case?

janc_ 1y ago
They certainly still recommend it. Too bad the evolution & development of Vala itself has stagnated mostly.
- actionfromafar 1y ago
  IMHO they missed the boat - they should have pushed Objective C and later Swift. Lots of Mac / iOS developers were curious about Elementary when it was new.
  - janc_ 1y ago
    They forked off from Gnome, and thus used Gobject/Gtk, which probably wouldn't fit so well with Objective C & its decendents…

themafia 1y ago

> We review all AppCenter apps to ensure they’re properly using permissions Who is "we?" How is that team selected? Are their decisions public? What is the review or appeal process like?

DanRabbit 1y ago
“We” is just our developer community. Folks that have write access to our git repos. We manage AppCenter reviews as pull requests to a public git repository: https://github.com/elementary/appcenter-reviews https://github.com/elementary/appcenter-reviews There’s some more documentation for developers here: https://docs.elementary.io/develop/appcenter/publishing-requirements https://docs.elementary.io/develop/appcenter/publishing-requ...

doug_durham 1y ago

I find the description of the project to be patronizing. "Just the apps you need"? How do you know what I need? What about the battery life I need, or the excellent touchpad support that I need? Most distros drop the ball on those fundamental things.

yunnpp 1y ago

Cannot recommend. The software center immediately broke itself into a loop of god-knows-what error that rendered itself unable to update the system. The system generally suffered from poor usability as well. Cannot comment much further because I didn't use it very long. I paid $20 for it and wish the project well, but it's a pass from me for the time being.

naasking 1y ago
I recently installed it on a 13 year old old MacBook, haven't had any issues.
- literatepeople 1y ago
  I am still a sponsor or elementary and used it for years, and often the first few months are fine until you hit a wall or need to upgrade it. recently switched to Fedora and have been much happier.
  - d3Xt3r 1y ago
    > often the first few months are fine until you hit a wall or need to upgrade it. This is a common theme with Ubuntu and every Ubuntu-based distro - they all eventually break when doing updates. Eg: https://ounapuu.ee/posts/2025/02/05/done-with-ubuntu/ https://ounapuu.ee/posts/2025/02/05/done-with-ubuntu/
SyneRyder 1y ago
Similar issues here with software center. There are some updates that continue working fine, but I'll often have to drop to the command line and use apt to do the full system update... which is not very "elementaryOS-like", when you consider how much it focuses on usability and UI and making a system where users won't need the command line. EDIT: Tried again today, and the specific error I get when trying to update via Software Center, which then prevents any further updating: http:// archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu jammy-updates/main amd64 libsmbclient amd64 2:4.15.13+dfsg-0ubuntu1.8 is not (yet) available (404 Not Found) I've mostly stayed on elementaryOS 7.x, which is actually the best Linux I've ever tried for my use case. It's the closest Linux to what I would like my computer to feel like, and for a while I was running it almost as a daily driver for about 50% of my work (with Windows / mac for the rest). But the elementaryOS 8.x series was far too buggy on my system, even the dock was unusable for too long (though apparently now resolved). Having to reinstall the OS with each major version is awkward too, even when I run my Linux installs off a USB stick for easy switching.

renewiltord 1y ago

Oh I remember using this years ago. It was pretty good. My memory always confuses it with enlightenment which had fancy compositing on a crappy computer in the early 2000s which I loved it for.

StopDisinfo910 1y ago

Did Elementary change designer? This version seems to have flaws I didn’t see in the old announcements. Spacing and padding are a bit inconsistent and sometimes a bit strange. Font sizing can be weird and alignment is hit and miss especially when icons and text are involved. Clearly these are details but I’m wondering if they lost man power on these points. I still greatly appreciate the project ambition and am impressed by what they have managed to achieve.

wsgeorge 1y ago

I fell in love with elementaryOS when I first learned about it c. 2013, and followed it closely (used to read commits weekly) for perhaps a year. It was one of the first open source projects I really loved. But I eventually went back to Ubuntu because I was newish to Linux and I needed something that Just Worked™, without the funny business. I eventually fell out of love with elementaryOS when the team seemed to double down hard on some unpopular design decisions wrt window control buttons/behaviour, for instance. I always felt that they had taken on more than they could chew, and all the good will of their community wasn't going to change that fact. To this day I maintain that the project should have just been Pantheon, the Desktop Environment. The team seems to have strong opinions about UX, and that's where most of that matters. I'm not the only one who thought of that, and the team's justifications for their decision to roll their own distro never came across as strong. I've since moved on (to macOS and Ubuntu one the side), but once in a while I browse the official sub for the latest. I've never shaken off that feeling that the really talented founders could have spent their energy more wisely.

kingforaday 1y ago

Serious question. What does the project mean by ethical replacement? The main webpage makes no further declaration around it for deeper understanding. Nothing in support pages or in developer resources. Anyone else familiar with the project that could describe why that needed to be called out?

sergiotapia 1y ago
Probably a dig at DHH given the tremendous growth and popularity of Omarchy. He's being attacked for "being a nazi" by the usual suspects.
- crtasm 1y ago
  It's been there for at least 4 years so I would think not https://web.archive.org/web/20210902014243/https://elementary.io/ https://web.archive.org/web/20210902014243/https://elementar...
  - sergiotapia 1y ago
    I stand corrected!
baggy_trough 1y ago
"I happen to own a little open source software company that is expressly anti-fascist, has a “No AI” policy, and has recently been called “aggressively queer” in case you’re interested in supporting tech companies like that:" https://mastodon.social/@danirabbit@mastodon.online/115356065854982668 https://mastodon.social/@danirabbit@mastodon.online/11535606...

nipperkinfeet 1y ago

Elementary OS is stuck in 2011, offering limited customization options. I remember having hard time adding desktop icons. These days, much superior distributions are available. Examples include Mint, EndeavourOS and Fedora...

Wowfunhappy 1y ago
Customization is great, but what's even better is when the defaults are just perfect to begin with...
DaSHacka 1y ago
But are any of those "aggressively queer"? Didn't think so. Checkmate, Linux users
- bigyabai 1y ago
  Even as a happy Linux user and gay person, I have to admit that much of GNOME's design philosophy is queer to me.

hecifato 1y ago

Elementary was one of the first Linux distros I installed back in 2020. Eventually I moved on to other distros and DE’s. I was hopeful for Elementary eventually becoming THE Linux distro I would recommend people but it hasn’t happened yet, and I don’t know if it ever will. I remember Elementary being big on UX, design, creating a universal app store for Linux, and providing a sane default type of experience. Pretty much all of that fizzled out over the past 5 years. GNOME and Plasma both leapfrogged Pantheon as a DE. Ubuntu, Debian, Mint, and Fedora are all far easier recommends over Elementary.

SOLAR_FIELDS 1y ago
My outside reading: there were about 2-3 key people driving the project at that time. My understanding is that right around that time or shortly thereafter there was a falling out of some sort between two of the key people, one left, and the momentum just tanked after that. Note that this is just an outsiders perspective gained from reading blog posts from the org and watching release cadences

valunord 1y ago

[flagged]

outcoldman 1y ago
Can anybody explain what is behind this statement? Tried to google, could not find much.
- actionfromafar 1y ago
  Queer people are terrorists now, don’t you read your GOP newsletter? /s
  - 553468907542358 1y ago
    Can't even murder political opponents without being called a terrorist. Damn the right!
- pndy 1y ago
  I remember people on mastodon saying that project leader went too much political by focusing on gender and identity while actual system development was pushed away. But since my journey with elementary was over years ago I didn't care that much. Maybe check other search engines and go with "elementaryos controversial" or similar words
- outcoldman 1y ago
  FYI: found information here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30611748 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30611748
saubeidl 1y ago
????

dang 1y ago

These seem to be the major related threads. Others? Elementary OS 7 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34598987 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34598987 - Jan 2023 (92 comments) Elementary OS 6.1 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29627193 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29627193 - Dec 2021 (142 comments) Elementary OS 6 Odin - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28130560 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28130560 - Aug 2021 (319 comments) Elementary OS 6 beta - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27001736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27001736 - May 2021 (69 comments) Cheers to 10 Years - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26658317 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26658317 - April 2021 (77 comments) Elementary OS 5.1 Hera - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21719028 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21719028 - Dec 2019 (190 comments) Elementary OS – Fast, open, privacy-respecting replacement for Windows and macOS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18472018 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18472018 - Nov 2018 (421 comments) Elementary OS 5 Juno Is Here - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18236240 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18236240 - Oct 2018 (15 comments) Switching from macOS: Developer Environment - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12877045 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12877045 - Nov 2016 (172 comments) Switching from macOS: The Basics - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12853531 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12853531 - Nov 2016 (593 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12830761 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12830761 - Oct 2016 (386 comments) Elementary OS Loki 0.4 Stable Release - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12465763 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12465763 - Sept 2016 (63 comments) Elementary OS Freya Released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9361477 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9361477 - April 2015 (87 comments) Elementary OS 0.3 “Freya” is released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9359722 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9359722 - April 2015 (62 comments) Elementary OS Freya Beta 2 - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9049592 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9049592 - Feb 2015 (43 comments) Myths about ElementaryOS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7864397 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7864397 - June 2014 (53 comments) ElementaryOs Luna released - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6193148 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6193148 - Aug 2013 (296 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2781891 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2781891 - July 2011 (79 comments) Elementary OS - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2091736 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2091736 - Jan 2011 (15 comments)

TheAceOfHearts 1y ago

I'm not sure if anything about this has changed since I last tried ElementaryOS an unknown number of years ago, but one of the issues I remember encountering was that applications that weren't built-in had inconsistent styling. I think you get a better more consistent and featureful experience just by using KDE. Even the list of applications on AppCenter is woefully limited, compared to using Flatpack and being able to access the full repertoire of Linux Desktop applications.

bsimpson 1y ago
Isn't that just a Linux problem, where someone could be using GTK or Kirigami or Iced for widgets? Most Mac developers use Cocoa/SwiftUI, so they get whatever widgets the UXEs at Apple have produced. Adobe famously did their post-2000 UIs in Java, so they have a nonstandard design system; you can tell they don't use Cocoa just by looking at their apps. Since there's no Apple to make an official toolkit for Linux, each developer uses whatever he wants, which means this app might use the GTK Save button, whereas that one uses Kirigami.
- seec 1y ago
  You can tell the Adobe UI isn't native but it's actually pretty good. In fact, I believe they had the right call since Apple frameworks are too limiting for complexe software like that and they needed the cross-platform compatibility anyway. Serif does the same with their suite of Apps and it's fine as well. Blender is custom as well... Apple aficionados tend to get worked up about it (and I used to be this type) but they need to understand that there is always a necessary power balance to maintain, and going all-in with Apple tools is not a very good decision for a large software. They have proven time and time again that they will just mess up stuff when it suits them and companies with such big software endeavors cannot submit totally to the Apple agenda. And even as an end user I would argue that UI uniformity is not very relevant, how the software works / what it allows is much more important. Relying too much on Apple software is also a losing strategy, as they have shown with Aperture and their office suite, they have basically rewritten from scratch every time with a newer incompatible format creating a lot of headaches and somehow managing to take years to give back functionality that existed before. Apple focuses way too much on looks at the expense of many other properties (as they have shown again recently with the Liquid Glass) and its basically fashion at this point. And since Apple cannot cater to every single use case, plenty of devs end up having to work up a custom UI on top of their framework, so if there is a complexe use case, you might as well cut the middle man from the get go...

hubrix 1y ago

I am wondering why no one is using the wonderful LLM coding tools to cut branches of open source apps rewriting them for consistent UI. From my experience with them so far this is a task that they would be really good at especially if the underlying codebase has decent test coverage.

raffael_de 1y ago

Isn't it a bit misleading to compare this to Windows or macOS, when it is actually Ubuntu with a preinstalled window manager, like Gnome or KDE, and it just looks a little like macOS out of the box? From the web-site I couldn't tell why I would consider it over established options like Linux Mint. To qualify as a replacement I would expect it to run native binaries. LibreOffice for example is a replacement for Office as it can handle xlsx and docx etc.