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They are also very fast at electrifying everything. Especially for transportation, they built large high speed train network(runs on electricity) and are far ah

by mrtksn 1y ago

They are also very fast at electrifying everything. Especially for transportation, they built large high speed train network(runs on electricity) and are far ahead in electrifying the public transport like busses which also resulted in Chinese electric cars dominance. Future is electric, USA can't give up its fossils and EU not happy about ICE cars being phased out(or more precisely someone else winning the phase out) but that's really inevitable. US, EU should just drop everything and go electric or in a few years will look like backward civilizations because China is exporting that all over the world.

dzhiurgis 1y ago
How much of total transportation is trains?
- vkou 1y ago
  Not great. 7.0% of person-kilometers travelled. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20240916-1#:~:text=Transport%20by%20planes%20made%20up,Hungary%20(13.0%25)%20trailing%20behind.&text=Austria%20ranked%20highest%20in%20rail,awareness%20of%20sustainable%20urban%20mobility. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/d...
  - kragen 1y ago
    That's in the EU, though. China?
- csomar 1y ago
  China is probably doing it for geo-political purposes (ie: if there is no oil, I can still move people with trains). They are ready to take a financial hit for that safety net. Europe is in a similar predicament but even the Russian war didn’t seem to teach them a lesson?
  - dzhiurgis 1y ago
    There already more people in EVs than in trains
  - kragen 1y ago
    Trains also enjoy great economies of scale, so once you have high ridership and an extensive network, you aren't taking a financial hit anymore. For medium distances, like 300–3000km, trains also provide speeds that passengers can't get any other way, because they avoid the huge overhead of going through an airport. It's an investment, not an expense. But China has also electrified a lot of its cars and trucks, and continues to do so rapidly.
nonethewiser 1y ago
>Future is electric, USA can't give up its fossils and EU not happy about ICE cars being phased out(or more precisely someone else winning the phase out) but that's really inevitable Claims like this would need to be quantified further in order to make any real predictions, but I think these sorts of predictions about future electrification may turn out to be shockingly wrong. For example, many predict we have or will soon hit peak oil. Whereas I would wager it will continue to grow. You didn't mention global oil production, but I want to get specific. 50 years from now I think global oil production will be higher than it is today. There is a strong desire by many for oil production to decrease and to electrify, but the incentive structure just isnt there. It's too cheap and useful and the energy demand is effectively unlimited. Im not even saying we shouldnt move away from it. Just that we wont.
- fakedang 1y ago
  Oil isn't a binary for energy though. There's a growing need for it in other industries, from plastics to pharma to fertilizers. Moreover, oil production is currently staying high because the OPEC cartel can't simply afford to shut down well production - only scale it down very gradually and pray that no one finds out (which is impossible given that oil is sold on the spot market). On the other hand, American Big Oil is dependent on global prices - too low and drilling deep or fracking becomes infeasible for them, while high prices mean economic slowdown (due to domino effects on other industries) until OPEC bandies together to stabilize prices to reasonable levels (which is $65-75 per barrel). Currently we're in a situation where OPEC, remembering 2014 and hell bent on diversification, is offloading record quantities of crude into the market, to ensure that American production stays infeasible.
  - nonethewiser 1y ago
    Yes, hence more demand for oil
    - metalman 1y ago
      less d3mand for oil, more demand for energy, much more to the point is the endless potential of abundent solar energy and the comming crisis caused by the end of scarcity your grandkids will dealing meems of archiologists finding fossil fossil fuel cars
port11 1y ago
It must be considerably easy for China to do all this since a lot of this stuff is made in China.

by mrtksn 1y ago

dzhiurgis 1y ago

How much of total transportation is trains?

vkou 1y ago
Not great. 7.0% of person-kilometers travelled. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20240916-1#:~:text=Transport%20by%20planes%20made%20up,Hungary%20(13.0%25)%20trailing%20behind.&text=Austria%20ranked%20highest%20in%20rail,awareness%20of%20sustainable%20urban%20mobility. https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/d...
- kragen 1y ago
  That's in the EU, though. China?
csomar 1y ago
China is probably doing it for geo-political purposes (ie: if there is no oil, I can still move people with trains). They are ready to take a financial hit for that safety net. Europe is in a similar predicament but even the Russian war didn’t seem to teach them a lesson?
- dzhiurgis 1y ago
  There already more people in EVs than in trains
- kragen 1y ago
  Trains also enjoy great economies of scale, so once you have high ridership and an extensive network, you aren't taking a financial hit anymore. For medium distances, like 300–3000km, trains also provide speeds that passengers can't get any other way, because they avoid the huge overhead of going through an airport. It's an investment, not an expense. But China has also electrified a lot of its cars and trucks, and continues to do so rapidly.

nonethewiser 1y ago

>Future is electric, USA can't give up its fossils and EU not happy about ICE cars being phased out(or more precisely someone else winning the phase out) but that's really inevitable Claims like this would need to be quantified further in order to make any real predictions, but I think these sorts of predictions about future electrification may turn out to be shockingly wrong. For example, many predict we have or will soon hit peak oil. Whereas I would wager it will continue to grow. You didn't mention global oil production, but I want to get specific. 50 years from now I think global oil production will be higher than it is today. There is a strong desire by many for oil production to decrease and to electrify, but the incentive structure just isnt there. It's too cheap and useful and the energy demand is effectively unlimited. Im not even saying we shouldnt move away from it. Just that we wont.

fakedang 1y ago
Oil isn't a binary for energy though. There's a growing need for it in other industries, from plastics to pharma to fertilizers. Moreover, oil production is currently staying high because the OPEC cartel can't simply afford to shut down well production - only scale it down very gradually and pray that no one finds out (which is impossible given that oil is sold on the spot market). On the other hand, American Big Oil is dependent on global prices - too low and drilling deep or fracking becomes infeasible for them, while high prices mean economic slowdown (due to domino effects on other industries) until OPEC bandies together to stabilize prices to reasonable levels (which is $65-75 per barrel). Currently we're in a situation where OPEC, remembering 2014 and hell bent on diversification, is offloading record quantities of crude into the market, to ensure that American production stays infeasible.
- nonethewiser 1y ago
  Yes, hence more demand for oil
  - metalman 1y ago
    less d3mand for oil, more demand for energy, much more to the point is the endless potential of abundent solar energy and the comming crisis caused by the end of scarcity your grandkids will dealing meems of archiologists finding fossil fossil fuel cars

port11 1y ago

It must be considerably easy for China to do all this since a lot of this stuff is made in China.