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Its "product recommendation" capabilities are growing quickly, which is directly convertible to ad revenue, and we know ad revenue sustained Google for two deca

by ip26 1y ago

Its "product recommendation" capabilities are growing quickly, which is directly convertible to ad revenue, and we know ad revenue sustained Google for two decades.

malfist 1y ago
ML can do just as good if not better job of product recommendations without the risk of hallucinations and is cheaper to boot.
bayindirh 1y ago
It'd be very fun and ironic if all this research, turmoil and energy waste just boiled down to a "better ad machine". I'm aware of other applications of AI and LLMs, but what most of the people see are the consumer facing ones like ChatGPT/Gemini/etc.
- ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
  Well, what I don’t mind, are truly relevant ads. This is different from showing me (a man in my 60s) ED medicine ads, unsolicited, whenever I visit a news site. The behavior I need is typical “honest broker” behavior. These folks have been around for centuries. It’s a totally valid (and valuable) service. If I can present a specific workflow and requirements description to ChatGPT, and it responds with paid recommendations that actually match my needs, I don’t really mind. I would still like to know about alternatives, but I will still have something that will fit the bill.
  - bayindirh 1y ago
    When I think about ads, I think about Google's paper [0], which allows multiple self-interested LLMs bid for possible ad-spots in the prompt, which is just a different flavor of what we have today. As noted on the thread, a good ML model can do better, with less. I can use that kind of recommendation system for discovering my alternatives for a given item/tech/whatever, on demand. But current crop of LLMs, with a strong leaning for embedding seamless ads into prompt responses, a double no. No, because I don't agree on how training data is stol ^H^H^H^H collected from wider internet and everything, another no for unsolicited ads. I'll continue using Kagi and being a luddite, thanks. [0]: https://research.google/blog/mechanism-design-for-large-language-models/ https://research.google/blog/mechanism-design-for-large-lang...
    - ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
      I guess I should clarify that I want a broker, not unsolicited ads. If LLMs can become true brokers, that would be great, but the pressure to corrupt would be tremendous. Not sure if we’ll ever get there, though. I have hope. The broker model is centuries old. It’s really a solved problem. The issue is that the current generation is notoriously bad at learning from history.
      - bayindirh 1y ago
        Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, and I agree, LLMs can be good brokers if they can be kept reliable. > The issue is that the current generation is notoriously bad at learning from history. On top of that, the same people think they can just move to another planet and survive by eating money there.
- ares623 1y ago
  It’s like nuclear fusion. The power of the sun, to boil water.
- ip26 1y ago
  The Internet is funded almost entirely by an ad machine, but has a few knock-on benefits people have grown rather fond of.

by ip26 1y ago

Its "product recommendation" capabilities are growing quickly, which is directly convertible to ad revenue, and we know ad revenue sustained Google for two decades.

malfist 1y ago

ML can do just as good if not better job of product recommendations without the risk of hallucinations and is cheaper to boot.

bayindirh 1y ago

It'd be very fun and ironic if all this research, turmoil and energy waste just boiled down to a "better ad machine". I'm aware of other applications of AI and LLMs, but what most of the people see are the consumer facing ones like ChatGPT/Gemini/etc.

ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
Well, what I don’t mind, are truly relevant ads. This is different from showing me (a man in my 60s) ED medicine ads, unsolicited, whenever I visit a news site. The behavior I need is typical “honest broker” behavior. These folks have been around for centuries. It’s a totally valid (and valuable) service. If I can present a specific workflow and requirements description to ChatGPT, and it responds with paid recommendations that actually match my needs, I don’t really mind. I would still like to know about alternatives, but I will still have something that will fit the bill.
- bayindirh 1y ago
  When I think about ads, I think about Google's paper [0], which allows multiple self-interested LLMs bid for possible ad-spots in the prompt, which is just a different flavor of what we have today. As noted on the thread, a good ML model can do better, with less. I can use that kind of recommendation system for discovering my alternatives for a given item/tech/whatever, on demand. But current crop of LLMs, with a strong leaning for embedding seamless ads into prompt responses, a double no. No, because I don't agree on how training data is stol ^H^H^H^H collected from wider internet and everything, another no for unsolicited ads. I'll continue using Kagi and being a luddite, thanks. [0]: https://research.google/blog/mechanism-design-for-large-language-models/ https://research.google/blog/mechanism-design-for-large-lang...
  - ChrisMarshallNY 1y ago
    I guess I should clarify that I want a broker, not unsolicited ads. If LLMs can become true brokers, that would be great, but the pressure to corrupt would be tremendous. Not sure if we’ll ever get there, though. I have hope. The broker model is centuries old. It’s really a solved problem. The issue is that the current generation is notoriously bad at learning from history.
    - bayindirh 1y ago
      Yeah, I understand where you're coming from, and I agree, LLMs can be good brokers if they can be kept reliable. > The issue is that the current generation is notoriously bad at learning from history. On top of that, the same people think they can just move to another planet and survive by eating money there.
ares623 1y ago
It’s like nuclear fusion. The power of the sun, to boil water.
ip26 1y ago
The Internet is funded almost entirely by an ad machine, but has a few knock-on benefits people have grown rather fond of.