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> I've seen this sentiment so many times from westerners. You all say this, and yet at the same time you levy economic sanctions on countries... "You all" is a
by kelnos 1y ago
> I've seen this sentiment so many times from westerners. You all say this, and yet at the same time you levy economic sanctions on countries...
"You all" is a weird way of putting it. I don't support my government levying sanctions on these countries, but I have zero power to change it.
It's funny, as the gist author points out that he doesn't support the actions of the Islamic Republic, and has no power to change it because it's minority rule by a theocratic dictatorship.
But even in the US, no one I've ever had the option to vote for (and who had even a remote chance of winning) would ever consider lifting these sanctions. So I am similarly powerless to change this situation.
I think sanctions are largely pointless if their stated goal is to get citizens to rise up and change their governments. Asking people to risk their lives (when you're not risking anything at all) is an awful thing to do, and this sort of thing isn't likely to work.
But it's probably not really that; the idea is to choke the economies of these countries so they can't do whatever Bad Thing the sanction-leviers are worried about (like developing nuclear weapons). How effective sanctions are at achieving that goal is an exercise left to the reader. And even if they are effective, there's a lot of collateral damage that hurts people who have no say in the matter.
- bitkrieg 1y ago[flagged]
- skywhopper 1y agoStill a little different yet.
- ceejayoz 1y agoYeah, one set of regressive nuts has nukes.
- surgical_fire 1y agoDifferent as they may be, I wouldn't visit either.
- spwa4 1y ago[flagged]
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- integralid 1y agoThat's an insane take, to the point I thought you're being sarcastic. He's not asking Americans to overthrow their government. He's not even asking Americans to lift the sanctions (as he said explicitly). In fact, he's not asking for anything, just recollecting his experiences. More importantly, you're comparing asking a (poor) country citizens to overthrow their own government with a (rich, western) country... lifting an economic policy that doesn't even work?
- FrustratedMonky 1y agoIt might be insane take, but that is the take of the US Government. That is the policy and a frequent GOP talking point. Sanctions -> Pressure on the people -> People are miserable -> People rise up and revolt against their Government -> Government is replaced with Rainbows and Unicorns.
- soulofmischief 1y agoUh. The US is currently increasingly subject to an theocratic autocracy, as Trump and his cabal of Christian nationalists terrorize our country. By your logic, we are not a part of the modern world.
- code_for_monkey 1y agothe US is currently ruled by a known pedophile rapist and still people feel comfortable looking down at other places. We shouldnt be part of the modern world!
- gizzlon 1y ago> Either fight of the theocratic lunatics that benefit of your taxes and work, then you and all your countrymen will be welcomed into the modern world, or at least move to a place where your work no longer benefits theocratic lunatics. Thanks! I will steal this quote and use it in response to Americans very soon
- tuveson 1y ago> But even in the US, no one I've ever had the option to vote for (and who had even a remote chance of winning) would ever consider lifting these sanctions. So I am similarly powerless to change this situation. Not saying Obama’s foreign policy was perfect, but he did do the Iran nuclear deal which lifted some sanctions, and started the process of normalizing relations with Cuba. Like so many other things, these were immediately undone by his successor…
- nanliu 1y agoLong term foreign relationships cannot be built on top of four year presidential terms. Besides Israel, I'm not sure any country has continuity between recent administrations.
- inetknght 1y ago> Long term foreign relationships cannot be built on top of four year presidential terms. Yes indeed, I agree. Although: long term foreign relationships certainly can be un-built on top of four year presidential terms. See: current US president and rest-of-the-world.
- baggachipz 1y agoNot just un-built, but poisoned for generations.
- marcosdumay 1y agoIt's very rare that international relations get poisoned for generations without some ongoing work from both involved parties. Populations tend to forget things on the timeline of a decade or so. The US can rebuild most of what they destroyed. It's gone now, and some of it they were already on the process of losing and can't get back. But no country is beyond reconstruction.
- baggachipz 1y ago
- swat535 1y ago> but I have zero power to change it. I was under the assumption that in Western democracies, citizens have a say their government and its enacted laws. We can't unfortunately assert the same for people of Iran since they don't live in a democracy.
- imchillyb 1y agoSanctions are not designed to coerce a populace into rebellion, in order to facilitate regime change. Sanctions are designed to prevent an enemy government from profiting from our western economy. Sanctions are designed to bring hostile entities to the negotiation table. Sanctions curtail the worst behaviors of enemy nations because the sanctions deny those enemies money. Money is power. Little money = little power.
- int_19h 1y agoFor the most part, sanctions are designed to be "something" in the infamous "SOMEBODY DO SOMETHING RIGHT NOW!!!1!" mantra. They rarely achieve any of the goals that you enumerate, disproportionately inconveniencing regular citizens - government actors have the means and the know-how to work around them. But mob justice demands an eye for an eye, which is to say, someone must be made to suffer - and sanctions provide a way to do that, even if the people actually suffering are rarely morally responsible.
- YC984983427 1y ago> but I have zero power to change it. Well, it sounds like you should rise up against your government in violent revolution, then! After all, that's what's expected of Iranian, Cuban and Venezuelan people when the West destroys their countries with sanctions. Get to it!