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> "...happiness to become one’s default state of mind." I have read psychologists saying that "happiness as default state" is a social construct myth of modern

by shark1 1y ago

> "...happiness to become one’s default state of mind." I have read psychologists saying that "happiness as default state" is a social construct myth of modern times. You cannot be happy all the time, the fact of being unhappy sometimes is what drives you self-reflect and to chase meaning to your life. To feel pleasure you need to feel some pain.

adammarples 1y ago
That's not what they said, they said a default state. You can't always be happy, but you can default to it when you have nothing else going on.
- tirant 1y ago
  I would call that more content than happy. Interestingly in languages like Spanish, 'contento' is almost overlapping semantically with the word happy ('feliz') in its day-to-day usage, and I find it a more adequate usage of the concept. So content is basically the baseline when no needs are impacting your state-of-mind, and happy would be the consequence of a positive event or result.
  - adammarples 1y ago
    I agree
randomtoast 1y ago
> You cannot be happy all the time, the fact of being unhappy sometimes is what drives you self-reflect and to chase meaning to your life. Each time you go through a cycle of honest self-reflection, you grow emotionally stronger. When a similar situation arises again, it will not affect you as deeply as it did the first time. After enough cycles, you may reach a point where your default state remains largely unaffected by such events. This equanimity, that comes with a deep inner calm, allows a naturally happy default state to emerge.
xandrius 1y ago
First let's start off that psychology is not like other fields, as it's often theories/opinions. That statement is someone's way to describe what they found out to be best for them. Not an axiom for everyone. And default doesn't mean always, it means that one's general state is happiness. For me, for that statement to make sense, the word "happiness" would be replaced with something like "being glad" (gladness?), as I always feel glad of myself/my life but I see happiness as something more active, like being sad. While I see this gladness as a passive state. But again, that's my personal take.
maplethorpe 1y ago
I do agree a balance of pain and pleasure is necessary. But I also believe you can make your default state a gentle fluctuation between the two, rather than wild swings. In my experience, this is largely a force of habit -- I one day found my default reaction to almost any event was to chastise myself, for example. If you can break this habit and return to a more tranquil medium, I think that's as close to being "always happy" as it's possible to get.
- grugagag 1y ago
  You may think you can change it but what if that came with the package? What if you were born bipolar or depressive?
psychoslave 1y ago
Pleasure is not the same as happy. Probably no one, even the luckiest entity in the universe, can avoid to go through some painful emotion. But how we handle raw emotions, within interpretation processes, is what makes all the difference. Actually, an entity that would only go through an indefinitely long flow of pleasant emotions and still end up being depressed and feeling unsatisfied the whole time is perfectly conceivable.
- fuzzfactor 1y ago
  >an entity that would only go through an indefinitely long flow of pleasant emotions and still end up being depressed and feeling unsatisfied the whole time is perfectly conceivable. I don't think it's that rare. Fortunately, the opposite is also true.
K0balt 1y ago
I would argue that perhaps you have confused happiness with joy, or I have confused happiness with a lack of sadness, or perhaps with satisfaction. While I find that joy is a fickle and fleeting thing, I feel that I am happy most of the time, satisfied that things are as they must be, or at least close enough that the state of affairs does not poorly reflect on my efforts. Sadness or grief make their appearance, but need not make life a poverty of happiness. I think probably many people think that happiness and joy are the same thing, thus robbing themselves of happiness in an eternal pursuit of joy. If joy were constant, it wouldn’t be the joyful treasure that it is.
- mi_lk 1y ago
  You didn't explain how you define joy and happiness, can you elaborate how they are different
  - twelvechairs 1y ago
    I think in short: - big things (e.g. someone dies) you cant avoid being sad - small everyday things (e.g. someone cuts you off at the intersection) you have a choice to smile and treat it lightly or go all passive aggressive and spiteful.
    - fuzzfactor 1y ago
      Sometimes you have to find some middle ground wherever you can get it. Like why curse a slow driver when you can have a 100% positive attitude? "You can do it! You can do it! There is a gas pedal. You're almost there, don't give up!"
  - coldtea 1y ago
    Happiness is being content. You can be a generally happy person. Joy is more exuberant - but more fleeting. You can't be a person constantly experiencing joy (except maybe as a bipolar during their manic phase)
  - K0balt 1y ago
    In my understanding, Joy is the emotion of overt happiness. It elicits silly behavior, celebratory vocalisation, laughter, and hugging. Happiness is the state of satisfied being devoid of feelings of remorse, emotional pain, grief, or anger. It is a state that accepts joy, that provokes appreciation, gratitude, and satisfaction. It is a generally open and creative state, that gravitates toward the positive. It is possible to maintain a state of happiness amid unfavourable events and conditions if your mind and actions are guided by a moral framework, and even to maintain a sense of happiness through hardships and injustice if you have built the philosophical structure to separate your mind and sense of self from your circumstances.
ErigmolCt 1y ago
If happiness were truly a "default" state, it would stop registering as happiness at all
123pie123 1y ago
I strive for my default state to be "content", with fleeting moments of happiness
Ruarl 1y ago
Happiness as the default state has nothing to do with being happy all the time. Perhaps you need to refine your understanding of “default”.
tenahu 1y ago
I think that depends on how you interpret "happiness to become one’s default state of mind." I think feeling happy is my default. I still get mad, hurt, sad, bored, etc. But when those feelings wear away, I return to a general state of happy contentment.
coldtea 1y ago
>I have read psychologists saying that "happiness as default state" is a social construct myth of modern times. Psychologists are what's the actual social construct myth of modern times. >You cannot be happy all the time That's not what "happiness as default state" implies though. It's about happiness being the disposition you opt for, as opposed to wallowing in misery and seeing fault in everything as your baseline. "Default state" precisely conveys that it's not about "all the time". Just what you should strive to start from and return to.
- BarryMilo 1y ago
  Psychologists are a myth?
  - tnel77 1y ago
    I suspect they mean that psychologists are more a problem than a useful profession.
    - slfnflctd 1y ago
      They certainly are when they're poorly trained and not held to proper academic standards. I've had more than one licensed psychologist attempt to proselytize to me. Granted, my location is part of the problem, but it still should never have happened. There are other, less rigorously trained people you can go to for that kind of thing and they're a dime a dozen. It objectively made things worse for me as some of my most major issues directly involve religion(s) pushed upon me as a child.
  - coldtea 1y ago
    Not their existance, their utility
    - BarryMilo 1y ago
      Do you believe the same thing about psychiatrists? How are we to deal with mental illness?
ronbenton 1y ago
Default state doesn’t mean all the time though?
- fuzzfactor 1y ago
  So much of the time it's only when launching the app.
burnt-resistor 1y ago
That passage came across to me as toxic positivity, but I hope that's not the case. Being real is perhaps healthier and more honest than completely avoiding anything that isn't pure bliss or joy.
wraptile 1y ago
There's fundamental lack of emotional depth in our society as I believe you can be happy and displeased or in pain _at the same time_. I can say that I'm never unhappy but I do feel displeasure, anger and pain at times as these aren't opposites and don't cancel each other out in my model of the world.
fuzzfactor 1y ago
When tragedy and pain are far more prominent than anything else, it kind of reduces to positive resolve. If others can not feel joy from that in person, you're doing it wrong. Never forget what it feels like when fate smiles on you, even when it's almost never.

by shark1 1y ago

adammarples 1y ago

That's not what they said, they said a default state. You can't always be happy, but you can default to it when you have nothing else going on.

tirant 1y ago
I would call that more content than happy. Interestingly in languages like Spanish, 'contento' is almost overlapping semantically with the word happy ('feliz') in its day-to-day usage, and I find it a more adequate usage of the concept. So content is basically the baseline when no needs are impacting your state-of-mind, and happy would be the consequence of a positive event or result.
- adammarples 1y ago
  I agree

randomtoast 1y ago

> You cannot be happy all the time, the fact of being unhappy sometimes is what drives you self-reflect and to chase meaning to your life. Each time you go through a cycle of honest self-reflection, you grow emotionally stronger. When a similar situation arises again, it will not affect you as deeply as it did the first time. After enough cycles, you may reach a point where your default state remains largely unaffected by such events. This equanimity, that comes with a deep inner calm, allows a naturally happy default state to emerge.

xandrius 1y ago

First let's start off that psychology is not like other fields, as it's often theories/opinions. That statement is someone's way to describe what they found out to be best for them. Not an axiom for everyone. And default doesn't mean always, it means that one's general state is happiness. For me, for that statement to make sense, the word "happiness" would be replaced with something like "being glad" (gladness?), as I always feel glad of myself/my life but I see happiness as something more active, like being sad. While I see this gladness as a passive state. But again, that's my personal take.

maplethorpe 1y ago

I do agree a balance of pain and pleasure is necessary. But I also believe you can make your default state a gentle fluctuation between the two, rather than wild swings. In my experience, this is largely a force of habit -- I one day found my default reaction to almost any event was to chastise myself, for example. If you can break this habit and return to a more tranquil medium, I think that's as close to being "always happy" as it's possible to get.

grugagag 1y ago
You may think you can change it but what if that came with the package? What if you were born bipolar or depressive?

psychoslave 1y ago

Pleasure is not the same as happy. Probably no one, even the luckiest entity in the universe, can avoid to go through some painful emotion. But how we handle raw emotions, within interpretation processes, is what makes all the difference. Actually, an entity that would only go through an indefinitely long flow of pleasant emotions and still end up being depressed and feeling unsatisfied the whole time is perfectly conceivable.

fuzzfactor 1y ago
>an entity that would only go through an indefinitely long flow of pleasant emotions and still end up being depressed and feeling unsatisfied the whole time is perfectly conceivable. I don't think it's that rare. Fortunately, the opposite is also true.

K0balt 1y ago

I would argue that perhaps you have confused happiness with joy, or I have confused happiness with a lack of sadness, or perhaps with satisfaction. While I find that joy is a fickle and fleeting thing, I feel that I am happy most of the time, satisfied that things are as they must be, or at least close enough that the state of affairs does not poorly reflect on my efforts. Sadness or grief make their appearance, but need not make life a poverty of happiness. I think probably many people think that happiness and joy are the same thing, thus robbing themselves of happiness in an eternal pursuit of joy. If joy were constant, it wouldn’t be the joyful treasure that it is.

mi_lk 1y ago
You didn't explain how you define joy and happiness, can you elaborate how they are different
- twelvechairs 1y ago
  I think in short: - big things (e.g. someone dies) you cant avoid being sad - small everyday things (e.g. someone cuts you off at the intersection) you have a choice to smile and treat it lightly or go all passive aggressive and spiteful.
  - fuzzfactor 1y ago
    Sometimes you have to find some middle ground wherever you can get it. Like why curse a slow driver when you can have a 100% positive attitude? "You can do it! You can do it! There is a gas pedal. You're almost there, don't give up!"
- coldtea 1y ago
  Happiness is being content. You can be a generally happy person. Joy is more exuberant - but more fleeting. You can't be a person constantly experiencing joy (except maybe as a bipolar during their manic phase)
- K0balt 1y ago
  In my understanding, Joy is the emotion of overt happiness. It elicits silly behavior, celebratory vocalisation, laughter, and hugging. Happiness is the state of satisfied being devoid of feelings of remorse, emotional pain, grief, or anger. It is a state that accepts joy, that provokes appreciation, gratitude, and satisfaction. It is a generally open and creative state, that gravitates toward the positive. It is possible to maintain a state of happiness amid unfavourable events and conditions if your mind and actions are guided by a moral framework, and even to maintain a sense of happiness through hardships and injustice if you have built the philosophical structure to separate your mind and sense of self from your circumstances.

ErigmolCt 1y ago

If happiness were truly a "default" state, it would stop registering as happiness at all

123pie123 1y ago

I strive for my default state to be "content", with fleeting moments of happiness

Ruarl 1y ago

Happiness as the default state has nothing to do with being happy all the time. Perhaps you need to refine your understanding of “default”.

tenahu 1y ago

I think that depends on how you interpret "happiness to become one’s default state of mind." I think feeling happy is my default. I still get mad, hurt, sad, bored, etc. But when those feelings wear away, I return to a general state of happy contentment.

coldtea 1y ago

>I have read psychologists saying that "happiness as default state" is a social construct myth of modern times. Psychologists are what's the actual social construct myth of modern times. >You cannot be happy all the time That's not what "happiness as default state" implies though. It's about happiness being the disposition you opt for, as opposed to wallowing in misery and seeing fault in everything as your baseline. "Default state" precisely conveys that it's not about "all the time". Just what you should strive to start from and return to.

BarryMilo 1y ago
Psychologists are a myth?
- tnel77 1y ago
  I suspect they mean that psychologists are more a problem than a useful profession.
  - slfnflctd 1y ago
    They certainly are when they're poorly trained and not held to proper academic standards. I've had more than one licensed psychologist attempt to proselytize to me. Granted, my location is part of the problem, but it still should never have happened. There are other, less rigorously trained people you can go to for that kind of thing and they're a dime a dozen. It objectively made things worse for me as some of my most major issues directly involve religion(s) pushed upon me as a child.
- coldtea 1y ago
  Not their existance, their utility
  - BarryMilo 1y ago
    Do you believe the same thing about psychiatrists? How are we to deal with mental illness?

ronbenton 1y ago

Default state doesn’t mean all the time though?

fuzzfactor 1y ago
So much of the time it's only when launching the app.

burnt-resistor 1y ago

That passage came across to me as toxic positivity, but I hope that's not the case. Being real is perhaps healthier and more honest than completely avoiding anything that isn't pure bliss or joy.

wraptile 1y ago

There's fundamental lack of emotional depth in our society as I believe you can be happy and displeased or in pain _at the same time_. I can say that I'm never unhappy but I do feel displeasure, anger and pain at times as these aren't opposites and don't cancel each other out in my model of the world.

fuzzfactor 1y ago

When tragedy and pain are far more prominent than anything else, it kind of reduces to positive resolve. If others can not feel joy from that in person, you're doing it wrong. Never forget what it feels like when fate smiles on you, even when it's almost never.