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This is what I return to every time when someone confuses morality and laws. 100% of Hitler's reign was legal. Everything he did was 100% legal. Morality is a

by tomp 1y ago

This is what I return to every time when someone confuses morality and laws. 100% of Hitler's reign was legal. Everything he did was 100% legal. Morality is and must be above laws. (Edit: ChatGPT reminds me that Hitler's post-1933 actions were legal; the earlier (and failed) "Beer Hall Putsch" was illegal.)

bruffen 1y ago
[flagged]
dudefeliciano 1y ago
which is also the excuse many nazis used at the nuremberg trials
aredox 1y ago
Alas, this is the same argument that can be used against the 1st amendment and the political opposition: "Rejoicing in Kirk's death is immoral, therefore the 1st amendment doesn't apply, and let's abusively prosecute anyone we can tie to him in any way".
- tomp 1y ago
  No it can’t, you’re literally confusing immoral with illegal in your comment.
  - AnimalMuppet 1y ago
    You said that morality must be above the laws. That means that one has priority over the other. aredox is arguing based on that, not confusing the two.
orwin 1y ago
Not really, the Nazis did manage to push a lot of pro-nazi judges everywhere, who judged that what their friends were doing was legal, but fair judges wouldn't have danced to the same tune. A Brown shirt killed by a communist/socialist was always illegal, but a communist/socialist killed by a brown shirt was always self defence and always legal. That's why the rule of law is so important, and that's why it shouldn't have exceptions for anyone, even policemen (arguments could be made for elected people as long as they are elected though).
- dudefeliciano 1y ago
  > the Nazis did manage to push a lot of pro-nazi judges everywhere Which is what republicans and Trump have been doing the past 10-15 years. Just need to look at how the supreme court is behaving as of late.
ghtbircshotbe 1y ago
This is a common thing to hear, but I'm not sure how true it is. It would be nice to hear from a historian, but Hitler and the Nazis did many things that were not legal in the early days. They did dodgy and possibly illegal things to give Hitler German citizenship so that he could run in German elections. He literally employed a private army which was committing violent acts across Germany. Not long after being appointed chancellor he personally ordered murders and assassinations including the night of long knives.
ofrzeta 1y ago
> (Edit: ChatGPT reminds me that Hitler's post-1933 actions were legal; the earlier (and failed) "Beer Hall Putsch" was illegal.) Looking back it seems crazy that he only got one year in jail for the failed Putsch.

by tomp 1y ago

bruffen 1y ago

[flagged]

dudefeliciano 1y ago

which is also the excuse many nazis used at the nuremberg trials

aredox 1y ago

Alas, this is the same argument that can be used against the 1st amendment and the political opposition: "Rejoicing in Kirk's death is immoral, therefore the 1st amendment doesn't apply, and let's abusively prosecute anyone we can tie to him in any way".

tomp 1y ago
No it can’t, you’re literally confusing immoral with illegal in your comment.
- AnimalMuppet 1y ago
  You said that morality must be above the laws. That means that one has priority over the other. aredox is arguing based on that, not confusing the two.

orwin 1y ago

Not really, the Nazis did manage to push a lot of pro-nazi judges everywhere, who judged that what their friends were doing was legal, but fair judges wouldn't have danced to the same tune. A Brown shirt killed by a communist/socialist was always illegal, but a communist/socialist killed by a brown shirt was always self defence and always legal. That's why the rule of law is so important, and that's why it shouldn't have exceptions for anyone, even policemen (arguments could be made for elected people as long as they are elected though).

dudefeliciano 1y ago
> the Nazis did manage to push a lot of pro-nazi judges everywhere Which is what republicans and Trump have been doing the past 10-15 years. Just need to look at how the supreme court is behaving as of late.

ghtbircshotbe 1y ago

This is a common thing to hear, but I'm not sure how true it is. It would be nice to hear from a historian, but Hitler and the Nazis did many things that were not legal in the early days. They did dodgy and possibly illegal things to give Hitler German citizenship so that he could run in German elections. He literally employed a private army which was committing violent acts across Germany. Not long after being appointed chancellor he personally ordered murders and assassinations including the night of long knives.

ofrzeta 1y ago

> (Edit: ChatGPT reminds me that Hitler's post-1933 actions were legal; the earlier (and failed) "Beer Hall Putsch" was illegal.) Looking back it seems crazy that he only got one year in jail for the failed Putsch.