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Apparently there are also countries demanding the opposite and saying they'll withdraw if Israel is excluded, including Germany: https://eurovisionfun.com/en/20
by petercooper 1y ago
Apparently there are also countries demanding the opposite and saying they'll withdraw if Israel is excluded, including Germany: https://eurovisionfun.com/en/2025/09/iceland-some-countries-demand-israels-participation-including-germany/ https://eurovisionfun.com/en/2025/09/iceland-some-countries-... (not the best source IMHO, but I did see it casually mentioned in a BBC News piece as well)
- parthdesai 1y agoGermany has gone from one extreme to other extreme
- danbruc 1y agoThe German policy of more or less unconditional support for Israel is plain stupid. This policy exists because of the horrors that Germans have inflicted upon Jews but it now supports similar [1] horrors inflicted by Israelis upon Palestinians. I can not wrap my head around that. If anything, Germany should try to stop Israel with all available means to protect them from themselves. Germany should do the same as Ireland and so should everyone else. [1] Feel free to mentally replace similar with any other word that you think more accurately compares the two scenarios.
- dfxm12 1y agoIt's frustrating because Israelis and Jews are distinct peoples. This unwavering support for Israel doesn't even necessarily help Jews.
- piltdownman 1y agoThe Ultra-Orthodox can't even join the IDF. The issue is that the US HR Bill passed which legally equated Anti-Zionism with Anti-Semitism, and the US control the narrative in the english-speaking world around the Genocide. It's Orwellian in the extreme. https://www.thefire.org/news/combat-anti-semitism-house-bill-chips-away-free-speech https://www.thefire.org/news/combat-anti-semitism-house-bill... https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/1/us-house-passes-controversial-bill-that-expands-definition-of-anti-semitism https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/5/1/us-house-passes-cont...
- clot27 1y agoconflating jews with israel is biggest anti semitic thing one can do
- hn_go_brrrrr 1y agoThis statement betrays a deep lack of imagination about other things one could do against Jews. Killing them, for instance, or putting them in concentration camps are both far worse than any association you might choose to make with Israel.
- piltdownman 1y agoIt's very easy to wrap your head around - Germany is Israel's main arms supplier after the US. Germany accounted for 30% of Israel's arms imports between 2019 and 2023. In 2023 it accounted for 47% of Israel's total imports of conventional arms. Between October 2023 and May 2025, Germany greenlighted the delivery of weapons and military equipment worth €485m to Israel They since stopped the export of weaponry 'used in gaza' but it's naive in the extreme to accept assurances from the incumbent Israeli government to the contrary. https://news.sky.com/story/germany-is-one-of-israels-strongest-allies-so-stopping-export-of-arms-that-could-be-used-in-gaza-is-huge-shift-13408611 https://news.sky.com/story/germany-is-one-of-israels-stronge... N.B. Israel continues to illegally carry weapons through Irish airspace, and kindly refers our government agency to El Al's Legal department on inquiry. https://www.ontheditch.com/israels-national-airline-department-transport/ https://www.ontheditch.com/israels-national-airline-departme...
- danbruc 1y agoThat does not seem like nearly enough money to make a bad policy decision because of the money and that policy is probably much older than the arms deals.
- alephnerd 1y ago> That does not seem like nearly enough money Because that's not the reason (Israel primarily imports weaponry and munitions from the US and India [0]). The issue is the other way around. A significant portion of Germany's ground AD and defensive systems are sourced from Israel- most notably the Arrow 3 missile shield [1] deal that recently went through. Germany is heavily dependent on Israeli cybersecurity companies as well [2]. Germany is also subsidizing Arrow 3 sales to Ukraine [3]. Protecting your nations citizens always trumps morality, and in Germany's case, it's become even more critical after what happened in Poland this week. [0] - https://oec.world/en/visualize/tree_map/hs17/import/isr/show/199301.199305.199306.199302.199303/2023 https://oec.world/en/visualize/tree_map/hs17/import/isr/show... [1] - https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2025/06/09/israel-enters-final-phase-to-deliver-arrow-3-missile-shield-to-germany/ https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2025/06/09/israel-... [2] - https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/germany-seeks-israeli-partnership-cyberdefence-plans-cyber-dome-2025-06-29/ https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/germany-s... [3] - https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/israel-sells-missiles-to-germany-as-ukraine-war-fuels-demand-for-weapons-b32b685d?gaa_at=eafs&gaa_n=ASWzDAjMWTMaqyTnW9sGUWDeYndDj3_dU158DX8N6ED161JPTXbjcK0QUwqK&gaa_ts=68c2d38d&gaa_sig=NlBM1BTsi6zhpH5eG4KZ7s-tGsiPd45EO2aPKS6di5b9IGvFStrG66lw8Rx-c1Ro-D-KAkz3cIEvP_d4rx5RiQ%3D%3D https://www.wsj.com/world/europe/israel-sells-missiles-to-ge...
- germandiago 1y ago> but it now supports similar [1] horrors inflicted by Israelis upon Palestinians I would say that Israel is historically worried about the fact that his enemies want it to make it disappear. There are many things to criticize from them but this is the basic premise.
- noboostforyou 1y agoDo you think that historical worry justifies the tens of thousands of children they are currently killing? https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2025/israel-gaza-war-children-death-toll/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/interactive/2025/israel...
- 0points 1y agoIt seems they no longer care if their actions make the general public sympathetic to this cause, which is rather troubling for a bystander.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- sirfz 1y agoI'd say the people that are historically and actively actually being disappeared are the Palestinians, the premise is that Israel since inception wants (edit: is) to eradicate Palestinians
- germandiago 1y agoIf they wanted that, it would have happened already.
- sirfz 1y agoThat's precisely why it's happening, unfortunately
- danbruc 1y ago
- catlikesshrimp 1y agoRemember there are are radical nationalist / racist / xenophobic groups in germany / anywhere. Such groups are so strong in Germany that Hitler used them to strenghten the power of his discourse. Recognizing Israel / the Jews are the ones now doing Genocide would *in the sight of the extremist groups* prove their belief that Hitler was right / the Jews are the devil. (I repeat, in their regard, not mine) Therefore, my opinion is that the official stance in Germany must be "historical responsability" mainly not for the sake of the Jews, but for the stability of the society.
- tdeck 1y agoDon't you think there's a risk that denying a genocide everyone can see with their own eyes will feed into antisemitic conspiracy theories?
- catlikesshrimp 1y agoYes, they are alreading sharpening their forks and oiling their torches. I think officially recognizing it ("Jews are bad") will drive normal people to don't consider them (the extremists / nazi) conspiracy nuts anymore, because of a "they / we were right all the time" discourse. I apologize for basically repeating myself. I just wanted to refer to the conspiracy theories you mentioned because calling them that is, ironically, constructive.
- csomar 1y agoCan’t get rid of your jews if there is no place to move them to since Auschwitz is no longer an option.
- zeristor 1y agoGermany also felt guilty about the invasion of Russia. I understand this to be one of the reasons why Germany was keen to buy Russian guess, to make amends. On the flip side Germany did a huge amount to bring solar power into large scale usage.
- lavapidgeon 1y agoThis is a very clear example of people who never live in Germany but do strong worded sentences in the internet.
- port11 1y agoHaving lived in Germany a long time, I think you might want to read the country's biggest media conglomerate's stance on Israel; and how that shapes public opinion.
- alborzb 1y agoIt's interesting as it causes a divide amongst EBU members for Eurovision - besides Ireland (in OP), Iceland ( https://www.ruv.is/english/2025-09-09-iceland-may-not-take-part-in-eurovision-if-israel-does-453021 https://www.ruv.is/english/2025-09-09-iceland-may-not-take-p... ) and Spain ( https://www.theolivepress.es/spain-news/2025/09/11/spain-threatens-to-boycott-next-years-eurovision-song-contest-if-israel-participate/ https://www.theolivepress.es/spain-news/2025/09/11/spain-thr... ) have also stated their intention to boycott if Israel participates.
- spwa4 1y agoSo this is interesting. Because Eurovision is of course just citizens, and punishing citizens for the actions of their state is considered racism. And Israel is hardly alone in having a conflict. The same could be said about the many universities. So do we now get to refuse to hire Afghans because of the Taliban too? Or Turkish citizens? Much the same principle, after all. These countries are at war and purposefully attacking large population groups. Or is this yet another kind of "only Israeli" get this treatment rule? Of course, in reality just about every muslim country I look up has conflicts with population groups in territory they claim. Morocco in Western Sahara. Algeria with the Tuareg (especially the non-muslim Tuareg). Tunisia is still in civil war and at war with it's own citizens. Libya has been caught driving black immigrants into the desert and abandoning them to die of thirst ... AND is at war with it's own citizens. Egypt and Egyptian Christians. Saudi Arabia is at war with it's own citizens ... Or you can go south, and well all know about Sudan. You can keep going until you arrive at Indonesia, even PNG. And of course, what makes it truly bad: Palestine is at war with it's own citizens. They're at war with Palestinian Christians (near extinct) or Palestinian Jews, who the Palestinians have hunted to extinction ... And plenty of non-Muslim countries do this. Russia (obviously, and not just Ukraine) for example, or China (the list is long. Nepal, Uyghurs, Mongols, ...). Myanmar. Thailand. Just about every even lightly authoritarian nation is at war with it's own citizens, either with groups of their own population, or just outright their own citizens (state vs anyone else). And we haven't even mentioned the more dangerous conflicts and countries like North Korea, or Iran. But of course, this only applies to Israel and Jews. Even that Palestinians do the same to their own population will not count. In war, nothing changes until BOTH parties genuinly want peace. Obviously Palestinians (justified or not) do not want peace. So stopping the fighting ... just isn't the solution, it will simply restart. So now it is justified to boycott muslims in general, and refuse to deal with them, because of what the states they belong to are doing? Glad we got this update.
- Simulacra 1y agoI may be a radical, but I think everyone should be allowed to participate, and if a country doesn't want to participate, so be it. The organizer should not be deciding which country attends in, which doesn't. OK fine, North Korea we can leave out.
- a_paddy 1y agoThere is precedent, Russia is currently suspended, also for committing war crimes.
- alkyon 1y agoOther precedent was South Africa, where cultural boycott contributed to dismantling of the apartheid regime. This could also work for Israel.
- piltdownman 1y agoNot to mention the fact that Ireland also has huge form in this area - having implemented a boycott of apartheid South Africa in 1987, becoming the first Western European state to do so. Ten young Dunnes Stores workers, aged between 17 and 24, refused to handle goods from apartheid South Africa because of how their government treated black people. This ended up with a strike lasting two years and nine months - unimaginable in the context of today's retail environments. https://mandate.ie/2024/07/the-day-10-workers-changed-the-world-the-dunnes-stores-anti-apartheid-strike/ https://mandate.ie/2024/07/the-day-10-workers-changed-the-wo...
- rsynnott 1y agoThe _word_ boycott (in its current meaning) also originates in Ireland: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Boycott#The_word_boycott https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Boycott#The_word_boyco...
- xdennis 1y agoRussia was suspended because of the invasion. That would mean that Gaza should be banned from Eurovision (which I support).