6 ms·

Why Apple Made Three iPhone 5 Models

32 points by Aloisius 14y ago

benguild 14y ago
Yeah. No matter what, you're screwed this time around. Verizon's version doesn't support simultaneous data and calling. PITA. AT&T doesn't support LTE when roaming except in Canada. PITA. International GSM versions can't get AT&T LTE in the US. PITA. The only plus side to anything is that if you switch to Verizon you can use some international LTE and get an international unlock after 60 days. However, in my case, switching to Verizon just for international LTE support is frivilous since I'd be paying more for less data on a Data Share plan versus keeping my "unlimited" plan + other grandfathered options. TL;DR — everyone is getting fucked by the iPhone 5 if you plan on using it in a different country at some point, or like simultaneous calling and data.
- Aloisius 14y ago
  According to http://mgalligan.com/post/31415410863/buying-an-iphone-5-dont-go-with-at-t http://mgalligan.com/post/31415410863/buying-an-iphone-5-don... simultaneous voice & data is possible on Verizon's network, but only with LTE.
  - shorttime 14y ago
    Yea I'm pretty sure with LTE that's possible. It's definitely not with 3G or below though. But overall, I've never been happy with any smartphone. I pay $80/month for unlimited data, 350 minutes, unlimited texts. After time, it always slows down, becomes buggy, bluetooth link cuts out, or the entire phone crashes. I don't know if it's designed to do this or it happens through the process of apps being updated and the phone becoming obsolete. This could probably be tested... if a phone was never updated, ever but that could probably lead to some security/privacy issues due to app bugs, os bugs, etc. Just seems like $80 is a lot to have this thing constantly bug up.
  - kyleslattery 14y ago
    Because the iPhone 5 doesn't have an extra antenna, it won't support simultaneous voice and data: http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/13/verizon-iphone-5-will-not-offer-simultaneous-voice-and-data/ http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/13/verizon-iphone-5-will-no...
  - RKearney 14y ago
    Until Verizon's network supports VoLTE, you can not talk and use data at the same time with the iPhone 5.
  - trout 14y ago
    I've got a thunderbolt on Verizon and I do 3G and voice as well as 4G and voice at the same time. Some googling seems to show that it uses two antennae to do this, but to me as an end user it works great.
- MBCook 14y ago
  And no one in the US supports the wide-band audio. According to some coverage it's likely no one will support it, because they are focusing on using audio over LTE for their wideband instead of the different codec on 3G that Apple supports (if I remember right). Too bad. I'd really love the better audio. I'll be upgrading, but I'm sticking with AT&T. The fact I can keep my old unlimited plan (from when I bought my 3G) and the simultaneous voice and data (which is really nice) means it's not worth switching.
omarqazi 14y ago
So the iPhone 5 on AT&T can't use LTE outside of the US because AT&T uses some LTE band nobody else uses. Bit of a bummer, but I wouldn't call it crippled since you can still use 3G voice and data pretty much anywhere in the world. International roaming is actually one of AT&T's few strengths. I'd be more upset if International data wasn't so expensive. At $300 / GB, turning LTE on overseas would just scare me. Hopefully they'll come out with a unified chipset in the future and prices for international data will go down.
- barista 14y ago
  I won't call it crippled either. You can make a call with it. Can't you? </sarcasm>
  - tedunangst 14y ago
    As someone who is going to be using AT&Ts network, I'd rather have an iPhone that works here than an iPhone that works in Europe. Also, I'm curious. Why is the iPhone, with three models, crippled, but the galaxy s3, with nine models, not crippled?
  - raldi 14y ago
    In 2012, "phone" no longer means "device primarily used to conduct voice calls". It means "pocket computer with wireless Internet connectivity".
Steko 14y ago
Minor point: not too many people switch mid year but for those that want to, instead of giving up and staying locked with one carrier you can... Break your plan early, switch carriers, and ebay the old phone. Assuming good condition you'll be out $100 max but you'll also have a brand new phone and warranty.
caf 14y ago
To me it looks like they've buried the lede here: What is oddly missing from all three phones is LTE support for a large portion of Western Europe, which uses LTE Band 7.
TechNewb 14y ago
Article is misleading, an iPhone 4s is also unble to be used on both GSM and CDMA because of firmware.
- thatjoshguy 14y ago
  iPhone 4s is unable to be used on both GSM and CDMA networks because of the carriers unwillingness to let 'foreign' devices onto their network.
- beagle3 14y ago
  My verizon iphone 4s works CDMA on verizon, and GSM everywhere outside the US (you can ask verizon to unlock it for use outside the us 60 days into your contract. you should, if you haven't yet)
  - TechNewb 14y ago
    Can you please share the documentation of that?
    - beagle3 14y ago
      First, you have to be in good payment standing on your plan, and a customer for at least 60 days. Assuming that's already the case: Call them up on 611, and say you're going to go abroad soon, and you would like to unlock your phone for non-US use. They will ask you to confirm a bunch of things, some sillier than others (That you know this does NOT give you a way out of your contract; that you may NOT use the phone to do anything that's illegal in the US, wherever you do it; I don't remember the whole thing). Then they say they're processing it, and will tell you that in a couple of hours, you should either log in to the itunes store on the phone, or do a sync with itunes to receive the new profile. After you do that, you restart your phone, and it will accept non-US sim cards. Things might have changed about the process since I've done it; I heard from some people that they had to log in to itunes with the new sim inside in order for it to be approved. The verizon person will guide you through the current requirements.
gnu8 14y ago
I expected a lot more interoperability between LTE devices and networks, something more akin to WiFi. Is there even a good technical reason why an LTE phone that supports AT&T's two channels cannot also support Verizon's five?
- omarqazi 14y ago
  Yes, the networks use different frequency bands. Ostensibly, nobody has yet developed a chip that works on both LTE bands. The iPhone 4S shipped with a chipset that worked with both Verizon and AT&T's 3G bands, so I'm sure somebody is working on the same for LTE. This is just an effect of the technology being newer.
robomartin 14y ago
iPhone 5: The biggest thing to ever happen to iPhone since iPhone. No, the biggest thing would have been stuff like swappable RF modules so I can keep the computer portion of the phone and get the RF module my carrier requires. The biggest thing would have been support for external memory cards (microSD would have been great). The biggest thing would have been ditching the 30 pin connector for a mini/micro USB connector. The biggest thing would have been allowing some access to the file system. The biggest thing would have been adding "guest" mode to the OS so you don't have to worry about access to your stuff when you hand the phone to someone else. There are a lot of "biggest things" that would have made iPhone 5 truly a revolutionary step in the history of iPhone. Longer, thinner and blah, blah, blah doesn't, in my not-so-humble opinion qualify. Most people I talk to have said "not interested". As a developer I'll have to buy one. No real choice there. We'll see what the average consumer does. The real question: Is the iPhone 5 enough of an improvement for the average person to ditch their 4S? I don't know. My rather limited sample came out on the side of "no".
- __abc 14y ago
  Historically, the answer will be yes. Apple launches a new model ever year the conversion rates from last years model holders to the new model are really high. This is even higher then conversions from consumers who bought two models ago to the new model. It's ridiculous (not that I think it is dumb, just that they have a consumer base/behavior like that). Additionally, I don't know if the general population would be on board with your feature list. For example, why would my mom, sister, wife, or grandma want a sd card? They all by the 64 gig device and that is more than enough. They access their photos on their iPad through photo stream, email, etc. I'm not even sure if they know what an SD card is. I hear you on the pin connector. But again, people will fork over the money to buy an adapter if need be. Most people aren't going to throw their phone out the window of a moving car because they have to buy an adapter .... Most. No idea why I need access to the file system. I can store any type of file I want and access it without any problems. It takes an app, but even my grandma knows how to do this. SO maybe if you elaborate on the problem the context of an average consumer might have regarding the file system, I would better understand. Who the hell are you share your phone with? Additionally, how often is that happening? Even if I had this I would never use it. So much damn work. Additionally, I'm usually standing right there when someone borrows my phone. I never hand it to a stranger and then wander off. Anywho. I can't argue that the changes are as revolutionary as the iPhone 1. However, the device got thinner, screen got bigger, physical design looks sweet, camera got better, software is getting better, and the device got faster. It's not curing cancer, but that is a damn good phone. I'm upgrading my 4S tonight. Given how much I use my phone I find it worth the couple hundred bucks. Especially since I can sell my 4S and drastically bring down my net out of pocket.
Ogre 14y ago
"LTE fragmentation means that AT&T customers using an iPhone 5 in Europe, for example, won’t be able to take advantage of LTE speeds while abroad and will instead get kicked down to the 3G network." How spoiled are people that they can carry a thing in their pocket that will let them access all the world's information, from a large portion of the world, and call it "crippled" because it's slower in some places? That's just the HN title though. The article is a pretty good breakdown of what you get from each version of the phone, and doesn't use the word "crippled" anywhere. Nor does it editorialize much at all.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]

32 points by Aloisius 14y ago

Yeah. No matter what, you're screwed this time around. Verizon's version doesn't support simultaneous data and calling. PITA. AT&T doesn't support LTE when roaming except in Canada. PITA. International GSM versions can't get AT&T LTE in the US. PITA. The only plus side to anything is that if you switch to Verizon you can use some international LTE and get an international unlock after 60 days. However, in my case, switching to Verizon just for international LTE support is frivilous since I'd be paying more for less data on a Data Share plan versus keeping my "unlimited" plan + other grandfathered options. TL;DR — everyone is getting fucked by the iPhone 5 if you plan on using it in a different country at some point, or like simultaneous calling and data.

Aloisius 14y ago
According to http://mgalligan.com/post/31415410863/buying-an-iphone-5-dont-go-with-at-t http://mgalligan.com/post/31415410863/buying-an-iphone-5-don... simultaneous voice & data is possible on Verizon's network, but only with LTE.
- shorttime 14y ago
  Yea I'm pretty sure with LTE that's possible. It's definitely not with 3G or below though. But overall, I've never been happy with any smartphone. I pay $80/month for unlimited data, 350 minutes, unlimited texts. After time, it always slows down, becomes buggy, bluetooth link cuts out, or the entire phone crashes. I don't know if it's designed to do this or it happens through the process of apps being updated and the phone becoming obsolete. This could probably be tested... if a phone was never updated, ever but that could probably lead to some security/privacy issues due to app bugs, os bugs, etc. Just seems like $80 is a lot to have this thing constantly bug up.
- kyleslattery 14y ago
  Because the iPhone 5 doesn't have an extra antenna, it won't support simultaneous voice and data: http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/13/verizon-iphone-5-will-not-offer-simultaneous-voice-and-data/ http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/13/verizon-iphone-5-will-no...
- RKearney 14y ago
  Until Verizon's network supports VoLTE, you can not talk and use data at the same time with the iPhone 5.
- trout 14y ago
  I've got a thunderbolt on Verizon and I do 3G and voice as well as 4G and voice at the same time. Some googling seems to show that it uses two antennae to do this, but to me as an end user it works great.
MBCook 14y ago
And no one in the US supports the wide-band audio. According to some coverage it's likely no one will support it, because they are focusing on using audio over LTE for their wideband instead of the different codec on 3G that Apple supports (if I remember right). Too bad. I'd really love the better audio. I'll be upgrading, but I'm sticking with AT&T. The fact I can keep my old unlimited plan (from when I bought my 3G) and the simultaneous voice and data (which is really nice) means it's not worth switching.

omarqazi 14y ago

So the iPhone 5 on AT&T can't use LTE outside of the US because AT&T uses some LTE band nobody else uses. Bit of a bummer, but I wouldn't call it crippled since you can still use 3G voice and data pretty much anywhere in the world. International roaming is actually one of AT&T's few strengths. I'd be more upset if International data wasn't so expensive. At $300 / GB, turning LTE on overseas would just scare me. Hopefully they'll come out with a unified chipset in the future and prices for international data will go down.

barista 14y ago
I won't call it crippled either. You can make a call with it. Can't you? </sarcasm>
- tedunangst 14y ago
  As someone who is going to be using AT&Ts network, I'd rather have an iPhone that works here than an iPhone that works in Europe. Also, I'm curious. Why is the iPhone, with three models, crippled, but the galaxy s3, with nine models, not crippled?
- raldi 14y ago
  In 2012, "phone" no longer means "device primarily used to conduct voice calls". It means "pocket computer with wireless Internet connectivity".

Steko 14y ago

Minor point: not too many people switch mid year but for those that want to, instead of giving up and staying locked with one carrier you can... Break your plan early, switch carriers, and ebay the old phone. Assuming good condition you'll be out $100 max but you'll also have a brand new phone and warranty.

caf 14y ago

To me it looks like they've buried the lede here: What is oddly missing from all three phones is LTE support for a large portion of Western Europe, which uses LTE Band 7.

TechNewb 14y ago

Article is misleading, an iPhone 4s is also unble to be used on both GSM and CDMA because of firmware.

thatjoshguy 14y ago
iPhone 4s is unable to be used on both GSM and CDMA networks because of the carriers unwillingness to let 'foreign' devices onto their network.
beagle3 14y ago
My verizon iphone 4s works CDMA on verizon, and GSM everywhere outside the US (you can ask verizon to unlock it for use outside the us 60 days into your contract. you should, if you haven't yet)
- TechNewb 14y ago
  Can you please share the documentation of that?
  - beagle3 14y ago
    First, you have to be in good payment standing on your plan, and a customer for at least 60 days. Assuming that's already the case: Call them up on 611, and say you're going to go abroad soon, and you would like to unlock your phone for non-US use. They will ask you to confirm a bunch of things, some sillier than others (That you know this does NOT give you a way out of your contract; that you may NOT use the phone to do anything that's illegal in the US, wherever you do it; I don't remember the whole thing). Then they say they're processing it, and will tell you that in a couple of hours, you should either log in to the itunes store on the phone, or do a sync with itunes to receive the new profile. After you do that, you restart your phone, and it will accept non-US sim cards. Things might have changed about the process since I've done it; I heard from some people that they had to log in to itunes with the new sim inside in order for it to be approved. The verizon person will guide you through the current requirements.

gnu8 14y ago

I expected a lot more interoperability between LTE devices and networks, something more akin to WiFi. Is there even a good technical reason why an LTE phone that supports AT&T's two channels cannot also support Verizon's five?

omarqazi 14y ago
Yes, the networks use different frequency bands. Ostensibly, nobody has yet developed a chip that works on both LTE bands. The iPhone 4S shipped with a chipset that worked with both Verizon and AT&T's 3G bands, so I'm sure somebody is working on the same for LTE. This is just an effect of the technology being newer.

robomartin 14y ago

iPhone 5: The biggest thing to ever happen to iPhone since iPhone. No, the biggest thing would have been stuff like swappable RF modules so I can keep the computer portion of the phone and get the RF module my carrier requires. The biggest thing would have been support for external memory cards (microSD would have been great). The biggest thing would have been ditching the 30 pin connector for a mini/micro USB connector. The biggest thing would have been allowing some access to the file system. The biggest thing would have been adding "guest" mode to the OS so you don't have to worry about access to your stuff when you hand the phone to someone else. There are a lot of "biggest things" that would have made iPhone 5 truly a revolutionary step in the history of iPhone. Longer, thinner and blah, blah, blah doesn't, in my not-so-humble opinion qualify. Most people I talk to have said "not interested". As a developer I'll have to buy one. No real choice there. We'll see what the average consumer does. The real question: Is the iPhone 5 enough of an improvement for the average person to ditch their 4S? I don't know. My rather limited sample came out on the side of "no".

__abc 14y ago
Historically, the answer will be yes. Apple launches a new model ever year the conversion rates from last years model holders to the new model are really high. This is even higher then conversions from consumers who bought two models ago to the new model. It's ridiculous (not that I think it is dumb, just that they have a consumer base/behavior like that). Additionally, I don't know if the general population would be on board with your feature list. For example, why would my mom, sister, wife, or grandma want a sd card? They all by the 64 gig device and that is more than enough. They access their photos on their iPad through photo stream, email, etc. I'm not even sure if they know what an SD card is. I hear you on the pin connector. But again, people will fork over the money to buy an adapter if need be. Most people aren't going to throw their phone out the window of a moving car because they have to buy an adapter .... Most. No idea why I need access to the file system. I can store any type of file I want and access it without any problems. It takes an app, but even my grandma knows how to do this. SO maybe if you elaborate on the problem the context of an average consumer might have regarding the file system, I would better understand. Who the hell are you share your phone with? Additionally, how often is that happening? Even if I had this I would never use it. So much damn work. Additionally, I'm usually standing right there when someone borrows my phone. I never hand it to a stranger and then wander off. Anywho. I can't argue that the changes are as revolutionary as the iPhone 1. However, the device got thinner, screen got bigger, physical design looks sweet, camera got better, software is getting better, and the device got faster. It's not curing cancer, but that is a damn good phone. I'm upgrading my 4S tonight. Given how much I use my phone I find it worth the couple hundred bucks. Especially since I can sell my 4S and drastically bring down my net out of pocket.

Ogre 14y ago

"LTE fragmentation means that AT&T customers using an iPhone 5 in Europe, for example, won’t be able to take advantage of LTE speeds while abroad and will instead get kicked down to the 3G network." How spoiled are people that they can carry a thing in their pocket that will let them access all the world's information, from a large portion of the world, and call it "crippled" because it's slower in some places? That's just the HN title though. The article is a pretty good breakdown of what you get from each version of the phone, and doesn't use the word "crippled" anywhere. Nor does it editorialize much at all.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]