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What freedom of speech? The "first world countries" in Europe are slowly turning up the surveillance state to not let people online if they don't provide their
by isaacremuant 1y ago
What freedom of speech? The "first world countries" in Europe are slowly turning up the surveillance state to not let people online if they don't provide their IDs, they want to surveil every private conversation you have at home, if it uses the internet in any way, they'd love banning encryption, VPNs, etc... but you have freedom of speech? Except when talking about thinks that are deemed "pro enemy" (Russia or whoever it is this time around).
Come on, we're living in extremely authoritian governments that pretend to be something else.
- ycombigators 1y agoDemocracy cannot survive unless we find a way to ensure we know when are listening to the people that are part of our demos and NOT people that are outside of it, actively trying to destroy it. We had freedom of speech in the west before the Internet. That speech was not anonymous.
- isaacremuant 1y agoHahaha. Fuck off with the "it's the enemy bullshit". You'll call people "russians" if they don't agree with your jingoism. You'll try and get people against wars fired. Post your name right now. Real name and address. If that's what you want, right?
- ycombigators 1y agoYou didn't address my point. Which is unsurprising.
- isaacremuant 1y agoI did. Your point puts national security of a boogeyman us vs them as paramount. Your point gives the authoritian the ability to use "the red scare" as tactic to ensure no subversives appear. No one to challenge their power. We must monitor all to find "the infiltrated enemy". Your bullshit is not new. It's been done all throughout history and it's always just an excuse to suppress threats to individual power. Political parties are proscribed because "they're working for foreign actors and we deem them to be treasonous".
- ycombigators 1y agoSubversives... ... you mean late night comedians I'm guessing?
- mkleczek 1y agoAnonymity is not a prerequisite to freedom of speech. Broken lives of people harassed by anonymous trolls on social media are the dark side of anonymity. Freedom must be accompanied by responsibility and accountability.
- isaacremuant 1y ago> Anonymity is not a prerequisite to freedom of speech. That's disingenous bullshit. From the likes of people who use their power imbalance to pretend their propaganda is truth and dissent is dangerous. "Freedom of speech is ok but what you're doing is different" is the first step > Broken lives of people harassed by anonymous trolls on social media are the dark side of anonymity. You only need to pay attention to history to see what political totalitarianism means when there's no anonymity. It's way worse than online trolls. > Freedom must be accompanied by responsibility and accountability. Said the dictator, who was accountable to no one. Those who hold the power shield themselves from accountability and want to use it as an excuse to prevent dissent.
- mkleczek 1y agoDemocracy for quite some time thrived in US (and for some shorter time in other western countries) even though there was no anonymity while free speech was guaranteed by the state. In other words: anonymity is not a solution for lack of free speech. I should be free to say whatever I want without being forced to hide behind a nickname. Secondly: I think you are happy to not being the target of online violence. I have experience with teens on the brink of suicide caused by it.
- isaacremuant 1y agoI have experience of people disappeared because of totalitarianism. Your teens on the brink of self harm are peanuts compared to state murder. Try some other shitty propaganda.
- ycombigators 1y ago