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There is research correlating autism and mothers taking certain medications (painkillers, antidepressants). Since autism is hereditary, there is a significant c
by kosma 1y ago
There is research correlating autism and mothers taking certain medications (painkillers, antidepressants). Since autism is hereditary, there is a significant chance that these mothers are autistic too. Autistic people have a vastly high risk of depression, and often have unusual pain thresholds, requiring more painkillers. I would not be surprised of the correlation was real, but the direction of action was reversed; after all, it's plausible that autism causes the need for taking more medication.
- jeffbee 1y ago[flagged]
- duskwuff 1y ago[flagged]
- perching_aix 1y agoAnd so what doesn't make sense to you about those two sentences?
- gpderetta 1y agoReread the parent comment.
- wizzwizz4 1y agoPolydactyly is both hereditary and acquired during development.
- adrr 1y agoSure it can. Type 2 diabetes is both hereditary and lifestyle/behavioral influenced . Same with cancer, if you have cancer in your family your risk of getting cancer is higher. I would say most medical issues are both. Heart disease, gout, obesity, hypertension,strokes,asthma etc.
- duskwuff 1y agoLet me put this a bit differently: Type 2 diabetes is both genetic and can be acquired during one's life (e.g. through bad dietary choices). But a man who develops diabetes does not acquire genetic T2D by doing so - he cannot pass it on directly to his children.
- fooker 1y agoYou could get a Nobel prize or two by proving this statement. How we pass on acquired traits to offspring is not well understood at all. We know there’s a mechanism, but not how it works or how selective it is.
- CamperBob2 1y agoSo having rehabilitated the Luddites, HN is now moving on to Lysenko. Peachy.
- fooker 1y agoYou not knowing something doesn’t make it not exist. https://www.cuimc.columbia.edu/news/study-shows-how-effects-starvation-can-be-passed-future-generations https://www.cuimc.columbia.edu/news/study-shows-how-effects-... https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4377509/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4377509/ https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-12-12/famine https://www.brown.edu/news/2016-12-12/famine
- CamperBob2 1y agoConfusing the effects of starvation with Lamarckian inheritance is a fundamental category error. If starvation affected every cell in your body except for the gametes, that would be worth investigating.
- fooker 1y ago> with Lamarckian inheritance is a fundamental category error Would you believe that things are more complex than neat categories discovered in 1850 that you learn in fifth grade? Starvation is just the most studied aspect of this as it is easier to find control groups. However, you could easily search and find others, which you don't seem to be willing to do for some reason. This is not groundbreaking research, this has been known for a while. The current focus is to understand possible non-genetic pathways for this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epigenetics
- VikingCoder 1y agoCheck out epigenetics. "Epigenetics is the study of heritable changes in gene expression that occur without altering the underlying DNA sequence. These changes, also known as epigenetic modifications, affect how genes are turned "on" or "off" and are influenced by factors like environment, lifestyle, and aging."
- knicholes 1y agoHimalayan rabbits having black fur where their skin is cold and white fur where it's warm is a useful and obvious example of this.
- Earw0rm 1y agoAre the imprinted patterns then inherited, though?
- knicholes 1y agoNo. Sounds like I was wrong earlier.
- duskwuff 1y agoThat's a separate effect, known as acromelanism, or "point coloration". It's the result of an enzyme which is inactivated by higher temperatures, not a genetic change - the extent of pointing can change over an animal's lifetime, and the specific pattern isn't inherited. (For instance, if you somehow convinced a cat with color pointing to wear a sweater, its fur would stay light under that sweater, but any offspring it had would not inherit that pattern.)
- malfist 1y agoA better example might be how some animals (turtles in particular) have their sex defined by their egg temperature
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- tracerbulletx 1y agoIt's literally almost always both.
- creatonez 1y agoThat's exactly what autism is established to be... it has some genetic factors but it develops in the womb.
- amanaplanacanal 1y agoYou can have a genetic tendency to a certain outcome which is exacerbated by environmental factors. This is very common.
- devwastaken 1y ago[flagged]
- wizzwizz4 1y agoYour first sentence is correct, but your second sentence is not.
- mschuster91 1y ago> there is no evidence of gene expression for autism. The fact that we haven't identified candidate genes for autism and a bunch of other mental health issues doesn't mean these aren't hereditary or have hereditary triggers that make outbreaks easier. > if anything it is epigenetic caused by environmental pollutants and hormone exposure Doubtful. The difference to older times is, we now properly diagnose mental health issues instead of just labeling affected people as "loons", locking them away in institutions or, like it happened with witch-burnings and in the NS Aktion T4, outright murder them.
- ricardobeat 1y agoYou don't have to identify the root cause for that though, all it takes is studying the prevalence of a disease across family trees, that would be evidence of genetic expression.
- wizzwizz4 1y agoAutism appears to be hereditary, but the eugenicists haven't identified a genetic component (nor have any other researchers, who are admittedly less motivated to find one). We're pretty sure that autism is a developmental condition, but the correlations with other things are… weird. (Off-hand: fœtal androgen and œstrogen levels, some chromosomal disorders, some mitochondrial disorders, a handful of rare single-point mutations, maternal autoantibodies, gut flora, something something oxidative stress (doesn't replicate, but keeps coming up).) Maybe they all tie into a "single cause" somehow, but… well, there's no single cause for eye colour (developmentally a much simpler trait), so the whole idea that autism is a deviation from the baseline, explicably attributable to a single factor, is somewhat of an article of faith.
- beefnugs 1y ago[flagged]
- gtowey 1y agoWith the current political climate, I think we are more likely to find the Health Department promoting cigarettes as a healthy way to relax.
- actionfromafar 1y agoOr at least take protection money for not talking down certain brands.
- smt88 1y agoI don't blame you for being too frustrated by RFK to look into him, but this isn't quite his brand of stupidity. He's obsessed with "pollutants" in the broadest possible sense. That's why he crusaded against environmental pollutors for most of his adult life. He also rejects germ theory in favor of the idea that disease is caused by environmental pollution getting into the body. That's why he supports a return to (his broken understanding) of "natural" living.
- steve1977 1y agoThis was my thought as well. I’m likely on the spectrum (as I have learned recently, because of my kids) and I would consider myself hypersensitive. To a variety of sensory inputs - noise, smell, touch, heat, cold, tickling and probably also pain. The latter being hard to quantify of course. But I could certainly imagine that a mother with autistic traits could be someone who takes painkillers more often than the average person.
- unyttigfjelltol 1y agoThat’s very interesting! I’ve been sleuthing for personal reasons and I’ve recently arrived at the central nervous system element called the nucleus of the solitary tract (NTS), which integrates sensory processes including pain reception. I’m tracing a particular activator of the mineralocorticoid receptors for which NTS has special relevance, but the end target overall seems to be mTOR in the NTS, which isn’t so niche and is studied in autism.
- elcritch 1y agoIt seems that higher sensitivity to pain could be a very plausible cause. I believe there's studies showing lowered (and altered) pain tolerance with autism. Though I'd expect that if aspirin did have an affect that it'd change the prevalence or severity of autism in children having genes related to autism. There'd be a first order correction fornthe likelihood that aspirin is causitive by controlling for increased ibuprofen and tylonol usage as well. The second order correction would be whether autistic people were more likely to use aspirin over ibuprofen or tylonol, etc.
- giardini 1y agoAspirin???!! Its not mentioned in the OP. No one here mentioned it. WTF???!
- elcritch 1y agoUgh yeah, s/aspirin/Tylenol/. My brain always wants to call Tylenol and acetaminophen as generic "aspirins" and it's a hard habit to break. Joys of having ADHD I didn't even notice the switch. Nevertheless, comparing the observed correlations of Tylenol with aspirin and ibuprofen would be the first thing to check. Seems unlikely to me that the OP's suggestion could be controlled for that way. I'll be curious if Kennedy's report checks those basic things.
- WarOnPrivacy 1y ago> Since autism is hereditary, there is a significant chance that these mothers are autistic too. Yep. Two of my 5 are clearly HFA (1 diagnosed) and another shows strong indications. My wife and I have numerous family members that are somewhere on the spectrum. It's how this works.
- flakeoil 1y agoHow can one know it is due to DNA or how the brain works versus learned behaviour? I suppose it is possible to learn different traits and behaviour from parents so that the offspring behave in an autistic way even if they are not "physically" autistic.
- throwuxiytayq 1y agoHeritability can be studied, you know.
- kelipso 1y agoIt's actually very difficult to prove that something is genetically heritable vs heritable through other means including diet, medicines, etc. Especially when you want to account for effects in the womb, where you can't do twin studies. Even things like height and IQ, it's not clear how the heritability is passed on, much less something as complicated as high functioning autism.
- throwuxiytayq 1y agoScience is difficult, yes. Otherwise, no. We know a lot and with high certainty. I think it’s harmful to pretend that reality is inscrutable and that science struggles to give answers. It’s fuel for the RFK Jr type of societal parasite.
- kelipso 1y agoPretending that we know a lot about something with high certainty so that you can get a one up on RFK Jr types is much more harmful, especially on the long term. The anti RFK Jr types end up being distrusted and put in the same bucket as the RFK Jr types for spreading misinformation.
- temptemptemp111 1y ago[dead]
- azinman2 1y agoAccording to my friend who is a geneticist, 30% of cases of autism can be found in DNA. Clearly not all cases are.
- ellisv 1y agoIt's important to note our understanding is far from complete. There may be more genes associated with autism than we currently know. So 30% of cases may have a known genetic factor but that doesn't mean 70% don't have a genetic component.
- azinman2 1y agoTrue. But we’ve also seen environmental correlations as well, as well as things like age of the father, etc.
- ellisv 1y agoThis is also explained as a genetic factor as chromosomal abnormalities and replication errors are more frequent although cumulative environmental exposures may also play a role.
- sheepybloke 1y agoThat's what our genetic councilor said as well. It's important to note autism is a spectrum and quite varied, some of it genetic and some of it related to other factors.
- elcritch 1y agoI've read some studies which suggest there's a variety of genes which are linked to autism as well as link to both autism and ADHD. I believe those genes are linked to how different brain circuits interact. It makes a lot of sense given with I've seen talked a lot about in autism and adhd groups, with some symptoms overlapping.
- matt-attack 1y ago
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- hbcondo714 1y ago> Since autism is hereditary Do you have a scientific source for this?
- jamedjo 1y agoTwin studies are a classic demonstration of this: comparing identical twins to non-identical twins lets us prove a genetic component. https://www.open.edu/openlearn/mod/oucontent/view.php?id=66946§ion=4.5 https://www.open.edu/openlearn/mod/oucontent/view.php?id=669...
- hbcondo714 1y agoThanks but this is only one study and they even conclude that some non-genetic factors may also contribute to causing autism There are many causes of autism. Research suggests that autism spectrum disorder (ASD) develops from a combination of: Genetic influences and Environmental influences, including social determinants Source: https://www.autismspeaks.org/what-causes-autism https://www.autismspeaks.org/what-causes-autism
- jamedjo 1y agoMy link isn't a study it's a layman's terms explanation, but there are lots of studies. Your link mentions a meta analysis of 7 studies concluding that up to 90% is genetic. Yes environmental factors are there too, otherwise it would be 100%, but there's enough evidence pointing to genetics that it is really disappointing when people try to find spurious links to false causes instead.
- skybrian 1y agoPossibly of interest: What heritability actually means https://dynomight.substack.com/p/heritable https://dynomight.substack.com/p/heritable > I couldn’t help but notice that there’s near-universal confusion about what “heritable” means. Partly, that’s because it’s a subtle concept. But it also seems relevant that almost all explanations of heritability are very, very confusing. For example, they say speaking Turkish isn’t heritable but speaking English is. Weird! > Heritability can be high even when genes have no direct causal effect. It can be low even when there is a strong direct effect. It changes when the environment changes. It even changes based on how you group people together. It can be larger than 100% or even undefined.
- SapporoChris 1y agoDo you have any links to the research to back you claims?
- cyanydeez 1y agotl;dr: Spurious correlation machines produces results. Pirates and Climate change surprisingly disagree.