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To talk about the software, I've been using Apple Maps in beta for the past couple of months, and having no transit directions while living in NYC is enough for

To talk about the software, I've been using Apple Maps in beta for the past couple of months, and having no transit directions while living in NYC is enough for me to consider a switch to android. Trying to take the subway to unfamiliar parts of the city forces me to use google maps in the browser. Addresses seem to be hit or miss -- I've often spent time searching for an establishment or address just to give up and use google maps in the browser. I've basically had to revert to how I got around the city prior to having a smartphone -- use my computer and remember how I need to get there before I leave. Apple Maps is potentially a huge fail for anyone living in a major city.

_rs 14y ago
Hopefully projects like this will fill the void. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/228865951/transit-app-for-ios-6-and-beyond http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/228865951/transit-app-fo...
- Spearchucker 14y ago
  Maps on my phone are crucial to me. The single most important feature is offline use - I often sit on the Underground (no Internet) going in the general direction of my meeting, but needing to know if/where I need to change lines, and then how to get from the tube station to the meeting location. So while this looks like it will fill a gap on iOS, it's something I'm unwilling to wait for.
mikek 14y ago
Hopefully Google releases a Google Maps app into the App Store, like they did with YouTube. Apple Maps looks like a major regression from Google Maps.
- brink 14y ago
  To me it would almost make sense for them to not add their google maps application so that it would make them, like mtalantikite consider switching to Android. I don't know why Google would have much of an incentive to improve iOS when it has it's own operating system to sell.
  - slykat 14y ago
    I think you are forgetting that Google doesn't sell its OS. The point of Android is to enable more eyeballs to their products since eyeballs = ad dollars. So Google will do whatever they can to get users on the Google platform (which is exactly why Google+ is great on iOS). Maps has a huge local revenue opportunity for Google. It has user intent, most of the searches are commercial, you know the user's tastes and hangouts (through past searches), and the user is addressable (since they are close to the item of interest). This means high CPC rates (or equivalent) if you can deliver a real ad product. Thus, I'd bet pretty strongly that a maps product will be coming to iOS since Google would hate to risk losing those valuable eyeballs.
  - juiceandjuice 14y ago
    Because they'd still get advertisement money from sponsored listings vs. no advertising money.
  - caycep 14y ago
    youtube app just came out, and g+ has been pretty spiffy..
- cheald 14y ago
  Would Apple even permit it? Last I'd heard they were pretty gung-ho on the "No apps that do the same thing as stock apps" thing.
  - MrScruff 14y ago
    I think they relaxed that restriction long ago, hence the variety of browsers, email clients etc available.
    - cheald 14y ago
      I was under the impression that things like browser apps are still just wrapping UIWebViews and such. I know this is the case for Chrome - the (heh) chrome is different, but the browser itself is the iOS stock. Is it a technical restriction rather than a philosophical one?
      - espes 14y ago
        Both. Apple has a restriction on 'executing' downloaded code yourself (javascript).
- spartango 14y ago
  Google has promised this already, and it should be out relatively soon. It's not clear what all will be in it, though. Apple Maps is a regression in certain areas (public transit, as noted above), and advances others (the turn-by-turn experience), so it's a mixed bag. At the end of the day, most of these things are reconciled through the app ecosystem: if you are heavily dependent on public transit, Google and other app providers support you well. If you're a driver, Apple and TomTom provide worthy solutions. And so on with walking and biking directions. We, as consumer, get choices and it's relatively easy to switch between them.
  - jwoah12 14y ago
    What is better about the iPhone's turn-by-turn? I've never used it, but I am really happy with Google's Navigation on my Galaxy Nexus. It's always been accurate and responsive, it starts up much quicker than the standalone GPS units I've seen (small sample size), and the voice sounds much more natural.
    - Tivs 14y ago
      It's the first time they've had it. There isn't turn-by-turn on the iPhone currently. But if they have issues finding addresses in general how good can the turn-by-turn really be?
  - 3JPLW 14y ago
    Do you have a source for Google's promise of a new iOS maps app? I can't find anything. That said, even if they do submit one immediately, I'm afraid Apple will tie it up in review for a month or two to allow their version to gain a userbase. I know if a Google version were available upon upgrade to iOS 6, I'd download it immediately. Transit directions are a must-have feature for me.
    - mikeevans 14y ago
      http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/06/google-maps-ios-app/ http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/06/google-maps-ios-app/
Steko 14y ago
On Anandtech's live blog it was said that the maps demoed did not match the maps in beta. I think they specifically said he checked and there was no Big Ben 2 days earlier on beta.
- mtalantikite 14y ago
  Agreed, the final version is likely to be better than the beta, but adding 3D flyovers of landmarks really doesn't help me in my day to day life living in NYC. I need in app transit directions, otherwise maps are largely useless. I also need correct search results. For example, searching for "Flatbush Farm" -- a bar/restaurant near my apartment in Brooklyn -- yields the correct establishment on Flatbush and 6th, as evidenced by the Yelp reviews, but drops a pin in Queens. I've reported many incorrect listings over the past couple of months and none of them have changed.
  - jesseendahl 14y ago
    You should check out iTrans NYC on the App Store. I have no relationship to the developer(s), but it's probably my favorite transit app, and I've used a lot of them. Unfortunately I only get to use it during visits to New York, since I live in the Bay Area.
pkulak 14y ago
After I played with the iOS 6 beta for a bit, and noticed the lack of transit and 100 other things, I got rid of my iPhone and bought an Android. Android maps are amazing, and I use it so much it makes up for the general lack of polish that you get with iOS. Though, to be fair, iOS maps have been getting better as it gets closer to release.
natesm 14y ago
Typing "21st and 6th" gives me an alert that says "no results found". I am about 500 feet from 21st and 6th. Other intersections have jumped me to Texas and South Carolina. I can't believe this is something they're actually going to release. I hope that it might be better on release, but it seems like the backend should be continually upgraded.
- striglia 14y ago
  Google has spent a long time pouring a ton of money and manpower into their geocoder and the data behind it. It's completely unsurprising that Apple is not able to match their quality. It will be an iterative process that improves as they get more usage data to leverage. That said, your example is pretty shocking considering Apple's historically stringent quality standards.
  - ajross 14y ago
    I feel dirty playing the J card, but... It this something that would have happened with Steve at the helm? I mean, the business case for moving off of your competitor's flagship map product is clear. You want to get them out of your product development cycle, you want to deny them revenue, you want to dilute their brand. I get that. But still, Apple is ultimately achieving this by pushing what seems to be universally regarded as an inferior product out to its customers. It's basically a downgrade. When has Apple ever done that before?
    - dman 14y ago
      Ping?
      - busyant 14y ago
        To use ajross's term, Ping wasn't a "downgrade". Ping was more of a lead zeppelin.
    - adpirz 14y ago
      MobileMe
sallen 14y ago
Traffic is one of the main things I use Google Maps for on my iPhone. How does the traffic in Apple Maps compare? I'd hate to lose that.
- mtalantikite 14y ago
  I can't say that I've used it much, but the traffic data doesn't seem to be as full in terms of coverage as Google Maps. I just did a side by side comparison of traffic in both Google and Apple Maps: Apple is reporting heavy traffic only on Flatbush, Atlantic, and the BQE (major traffic arteries for those not familiar with Brooklyn). Google is reporting what Apple has, plus traffic patterns on a lot of other local avenues (3rd, 4th, 5th, 7th, Vanderbilt, Fulton, Union St, etc).
- Aloisius 14y ago
  I believe they get their updates from TomTom. The routing around traffic was actually a bit better than Google's in San Francisco the few times I used it side-by-side.
xster 14y ago
I had iOS 6 and brought my phone to China. It just swapped to another provider (AutoNav) that's essentially like MapQuest 10 years ago.
slykat 14y ago
Apple has a Transit API which may help reduce the gap.
peterjmag 14y ago
Well, looks like I won't be upgrading to iOS 6 any time soon. I rely heavily on Google's transit directions when I'm visiting new cities.
dclowd9901 14y ago
Wow. Being a new resident to the Bay Area, this is a potential deal breaker for me, and I had no idea the public transit was stripped out. Granted most excursions don't necessitate the public transit directions in the Bay Area, it was amazing to have while traveling to new cities.
toddmorey 14y ago
Yeah, I feel like this is one of those situations where companies go to war and consumers lose. Apple didn't create their own Maps to disrupt the space or because they have the same passion for wayfinding that they have for music; they did it as a power play against Google.
- huxley 14y ago
  Mapping is a growing part of the iOS SDK, I can understand Apple not wanting to be dependent on Google for that, particularly after Google started demanding significantly increased fees for Google Maps API usage: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/20/technology/many-sites-chart-a-new-course-as-google-expands-fees.html http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/20/technology/many-sites-char... Google walked back some of the worst effects of the changes: http://googlegeodevelopers.blogspot.ca/2012/06/lower-pricing-and-simplified-limits.html http://googlegeodevelopers.blogspot.ca/2012/06/lower-pricing... but by then the damage had been done in terms of Apple's (and developers') perception of the Google API.
  - magicalist 14y ago
    That's the Javascript Maps API, first, and it only applies if you don't have an enterprise agreement anyways. You don't think Apple had a contract for mapping data independent of Google's pricing of their web API? (for developers, AFAIK there has been no cost for using Map Kit in iOS or a MapView in Android)
- user911302966 14y ago
  That's not exactly how capitalism works. Apple thought it would be beneficial to supply their own mapping software on their own device and OS. Google (I assume) still wants all of those millions of iOS user's data, so they will release their Google Maps app for iOS on the app store. Apple's mapping software already has a neat new feature with the 3-D thing. Now it's Google's turn to respond by matching that, or innovating. Repeat the cycle for the next feature disparity. It's a good thing.
- brandoncapecci 14y ago
  I disagree. Google had a monopoly on the maps market and was taking advantage of it. Apple's Maps app used vector images, brought 3d buildings to more cities, used higher quality textures, etc. They may have problems with it but I feel like the added enough innovation to force Google Maps to be better.
lnanek2 14y ago
To be fair, I was recently a little north of Atlanta and Google Maps had no idea about the bus system there. It knew the metro one, but not the one I needed to use to get to the metro one. Had to ask people advice to find a spot and then hang out half an hour because I hadn't known the schedule like I would with good maps support. So some people will have equal service.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- eavc 14y ago
  Atlanta has an abysmal public transit system, but Google Maps does know about the major bus system in town. It may not be complete, but I regularly see info for nearby bus stops in Google Now, for example.
tsieling 14y ago
As I understand it, other apps will be able to register with the maps service and add data to maps, like transit directions. In theory sounds great, it'll take a while to see how it shakes out which is a setback no matter how you slice it.
nachteilig 14y ago
I'm really looking forward to Google rolling out their own already-announced maps app on iOS for this reason (although I have to imagine your city has dedicated apps that do public transit already, as mine does). And as far as I know the maps app already used Apple's locations database, which was noticeably worse than Google's. I keep hoping that Apple will simply realize that location is not their strength, but so far this seems unlikely.
TheGateKeeper 14y ago
So let me get this straight. A single app on iOS, which doesn't live up to expectations or desires AND is still in BETA (re: unfinished, unready) and this makes you consider buying an entirely new phone? You sound like those soccer moms I make house calls for who just think it's easier to throw away a working system and buy something else.
- herval 14y ago
  Given it's getting released 7 days from now (and the version that comes with the GM, released today, is equally terrible), I'm, not sure it's gonna change that much before the release... (irrelevant fact: Maps is the MOST important app on the iPhone for me - after the browser, of course. I've put my life on its "hands" an infinite number of times...)
- steevdave 14y ago
  I'm on the fence myself. And yeah, when the most used app is the maps for transit directions it does leave a bad taste to go from something that worked great (most of the time) to something that doesn't work for your needs at all. Am I still able to take phone calls? Sure, as long as I'm not at the office though I blame that more on AT&T and working right near the river walk in San Antonio, but the local bus company has said their maps addon won't be out until October at the earliest, March of 2013 at the latest. And how many people have switched to Mac due to an inferior product feeling? Sure you can still use the computer but if one of the main purposes of having it doesn't work for your needs, why keep using it?
- mtalantikite 14y ago
  Yes, that's correct. Out of curiosity, do you live in NYC? The subway is part of the life blood of this city, and not being able to navigate from A -> B using maps is a major loss. Normal situational example: I'm in a neighborhood, say Fort Greene, and I'm meeting a friend for dinner at a restaurant I've never heard of in the East Village. First, I need to be able to find that restaurant by searching for it in Maps -- this largely doesn't work anymore. I often get results that are totally incorrect. But say I do find the location, I then need to figure out how to get there from a neighborhood I don't actively live in. Do I take the A train and transfer to the F and walk from the lower east side? Maybe it's faster to walk to the Q and get off at Union Square. Or maybe the manhattan bridge is under construction, and it actually would be faster to take the G to north Brooklyn and transfer to the L. This subway system is so massive that even native New Yorkers get turned around and need directions. If you don't actively live in NYC I think it might be hard to realize how significant losing transit directions is, not to mention useful location search.
jesseendahl 14y ago
Try iTrans NYC. It's incredible. http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/itrans-nyc-subway/id283492923?mt=8 http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/itrans-nyc-subway/id283492923...
gonzo 14y ago
apple has a strategy here, which is to allow regional 'providers' of directions to have apps on the phone. Google could be one such provider, if they want to be.
kyro 14y ago
HopStop is the app you're looking for. I just moved to Brooklyn and was recommended the app by someone who's been here only a few months. It gives ridiculously thorough directions, and has an offline transit map you can use while you're on the subway.
dhimes 14y ago
Google maps in the browser works great for me, even in areas remote like Englewood, TN. No app needed IMHO. Remember: When Steve Jobs was first defending the 30% app store cut he said something to the effect that it wouldn't matter in the long run because everybody was using web apps anyway.
josephlord 14y ago
In London and probably many other places around the World Google has only fairly recently started offering public transport directions (if they offer them at all) so I'm not sure the loss is that great. There are plenty of apps available that offer this. The people for whom this is a big issue are a fairly small proportion of the global population. Basically those in the US who live in major cities and are users of the transit system. In San Diego and New York this is a big issue and those are centres of the HN readership and probably also the tech media which might be important but the practical impact of this limitation may be limited.
- ripperdoc 14y ago
  I have used Google Maps for public transport very actively in multiple cities around the world, and I can't imagine living without it. Stockholm, Singapore, London, Tokyo all have it with Google. And I'd bet that a majority of smartphone users in the world use public transport, not cars, as primary method of getting around.
archagon 14y ago
I agree with you in principle, but in practice, when I was visiting New York in July, I got much better results by using an external app rather than Google Maps. ("NYC Subway", I think it was called.) Specifically, Google's directions often had multiple transfers and didn't mention any alternate routes, whereas the app gave me the route with fewest transfers and showed all the other lines going there, in case you missed the first train. I think this is why Apple's plan to relegate public transport directions to external apps might be a good idea: there's no way a single company -- even one the size of even Google! -- can keep track of all the minutiae involved in planning routes for every public transport system around the world, whereas app makers can. Even today, every public transit system that I've been on has one or more apps, so I doubt uptake will be a problem. And with the new APIs in iOS6, it should be much easier to get directions via external apps, since they show up in a list right in the Maps app. Oh, and the app worked offline, which as you might know is mighty helpful in large parts of the subway. :)
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
jaxn 14y ago
Just as a counter: I have also been using it for a few months, but I am not a transit user. I feel the routes have been great and it has been a big addition to my phone.

_rs 14y ago

Hopefully projects like this will fill the void. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/228865951/transit-app-for-ios-6-and-beyond http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/228865951/transit-app-fo...

Spearchucker 14y ago
Maps on my phone are crucial to me. The single most important feature is offline use - I often sit on the Underground (no Internet) going in the general direction of my meeting, but needing to know if/where I need to change lines, and then how to get from the tube station to the meeting location. So while this looks like it will fill a gap on iOS, it's something I'm unwilling to wait for.

mikek 14y ago

Hopefully Google releases a Google Maps app into the App Store, like they did with YouTube. Apple Maps looks like a major regression from Google Maps.

brink 14y ago
To me it would almost make sense for them to not add their google maps application so that it would make them, like mtalantikite consider switching to Android. I don't know why Google would have much of an incentive to improve iOS when it has it's own operating system to sell.
- slykat 14y ago
  I think you are forgetting that Google doesn't sell its OS. The point of Android is to enable more eyeballs to their products since eyeballs = ad dollars. So Google will do whatever they can to get users on the Google platform (which is exactly why Google+ is great on iOS). Maps has a huge local revenue opportunity for Google. It has user intent, most of the searches are commercial, you know the user's tastes and hangouts (through past searches), and the user is addressable (since they are close to the item of interest). This means high CPC rates (or equivalent) if you can deliver a real ad product. Thus, I'd bet pretty strongly that a maps product will be coming to iOS since Google would hate to risk losing those valuable eyeballs.
- juiceandjuice 14y ago
  Because they'd still get advertisement money from sponsored listings vs. no advertising money.
- caycep 14y ago
  youtube app just came out, and g+ has been pretty spiffy..
cheald 14y ago
Would Apple even permit it? Last I'd heard they were pretty gung-ho on the "No apps that do the same thing as stock apps" thing.
- MrScruff 14y ago
  I think they relaxed that restriction long ago, hence the variety of browsers, email clients etc available.
  - cheald 14y ago
    I was under the impression that things like browser apps are still just wrapping UIWebViews and such. I know this is the case for Chrome - the (heh) chrome is different, but the browser itself is the iOS stock. Is it a technical restriction rather than a philosophical one?
    - espes 14y ago
      Both. Apple has a restriction on 'executing' downloaded code yourself (javascript).
spartango 14y ago
Google has promised this already, and it should be out relatively soon. It's not clear what all will be in it, though. Apple Maps is a regression in certain areas (public transit, as noted above), and advances others (the turn-by-turn experience), so it's a mixed bag. At the end of the day, most of these things are reconciled through the app ecosystem: if you are heavily dependent on public transit, Google and other app providers support you well. If you're a driver, Apple and TomTom provide worthy solutions. And so on with walking and biking directions. We, as consumer, get choices and it's relatively easy to switch between them.
- jwoah12 14y ago
  What is better about the iPhone's turn-by-turn? I've never used it, but I am really happy with Google's Navigation on my Galaxy Nexus. It's always been accurate and responsive, it starts up much quicker than the standalone GPS units I've seen (small sample size), and the voice sounds much more natural.
  - Tivs 14y ago
    It's the first time they've had it. There isn't turn-by-turn on the iPhone currently. But if they have issues finding addresses in general how good can the turn-by-turn really be?
- 3JPLW 14y ago
  Do you have a source for Google's promise of a new iOS maps app? I can't find anything. That said, even if they do submit one immediately, I'm afraid Apple will tie it up in review for a month or two to allow their version to gain a userbase. I know if a Google version were available upon upgrade to iOS 6, I'd download it immediately. Transit directions are a must-have feature for me.
  - mikeevans 14y ago
    http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/06/google-maps-ios-app/ http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2012/06/google-maps-ios-app/

Steko 14y ago

On Anandtech's live blog it was said that the maps demoed did not match the maps in beta. I think they specifically said he checked and there was no Big Ben 2 days earlier on beta.

mtalantikite 14y ago
Agreed, the final version is likely to be better than the beta, but adding 3D flyovers of landmarks really doesn't help me in my day to day life living in NYC. I need in app transit directions, otherwise maps are largely useless. I also need correct search results. For example, searching for "Flatbush Farm" -- a bar/restaurant near my apartment in Brooklyn -- yields the correct establishment on Flatbush and 6th, as evidenced by the Yelp reviews, but drops a pin in Queens. I've reported many incorrect listings over the past couple of months and none of them have changed.
- jesseendahl 14y ago
  You should check out iTrans NYC on the App Store. I have no relationship to the developer(s), but it's probably my favorite transit app, and I've used a lot of them. Unfortunately I only get to use it during visits to New York, since I live in the Bay Area.

pkulak 14y ago

After I played with the iOS 6 beta for a bit, and noticed the lack of transit and 100 other things, I got rid of my iPhone and bought an Android. Android maps are amazing, and I use it so much it makes up for the general lack of polish that you get with iOS. Though, to be fair, iOS maps have been getting better as it gets closer to release.

natesm 14y ago

Typing "21st and 6th" gives me an alert that says "no results found". I am about 500 feet from 21st and 6th. Other intersections have jumped me to Texas and South Carolina. I can't believe this is something they're actually going to release. I hope that it might be better on release, but it seems like the backend should be continually upgraded.

striglia 14y ago
Google has spent a long time pouring a ton of money and manpower into their geocoder and the data behind it. It's completely unsurprising that Apple is not able to match their quality. It will be an iterative process that improves as they get more usage data to leverage. That said, your example is pretty shocking considering Apple's historically stringent quality standards.
- ajross 14y ago
  I feel dirty playing the J card, but... It this something that would have happened with Steve at the helm? I mean, the business case for moving off of your competitor's flagship map product is clear. You want to get them out of your product development cycle, you want to deny them revenue, you want to dilute their brand. I get that. But still, Apple is ultimately achieving this by pushing what seems to be universally regarded as an inferior product out to its customers. It's basically a downgrade. When has Apple ever done that before?
  - dman 14y ago
    Ping?
    - busyant 14y ago
      To use ajross's term, Ping wasn't a "downgrade". Ping was more of a lead zeppelin.
  - adpirz 14y ago
    MobileMe

sallen 14y ago

Traffic is one of the main things I use Google Maps for on my iPhone. How does the traffic in Apple Maps compare? I'd hate to lose that.

mtalantikite 14y ago
I can't say that I've used it much, but the traffic data doesn't seem to be as full in terms of coverage as Google Maps. I just did a side by side comparison of traffic in both Google and Apple Maps: Apple is reporting heavy traffic only on Flatbush, Atlantic, and the BQE (major traffic arteries for those not familiar with Brooklyn). Google is reporting what Apple has, plus traffic patterns on a lot of other local avenues (3rd, 4th, 5th, 7th, Vanderbilt, Fulton, Union St, etc).
Aloisius 14y ago
I believe they get their updates from TomTom. The routing around traffic was actually a bit better than Google's in San Francisco the few times I used it side-by-side.

xster 14y ago

I had iOS 6 and brought my phone to China. It just swapped to another provider (AutoNav) that's essentially like MapQuest 10 years ago.

slykat 14y ago

Apple has a Transit API which may help reduce the gap.

peterjmag 14y ago

Well, looks like I won't be upgrading to iOS 6 any time soon. I rely heavily on Google's transit directions when I'm visiting new cities.

dclowd9901 14y ago

Wow. Being a new resident to the Bay Area, this is a potential deal breaker for me, and I had no idea the public transit was stripped out. Granted most excursions don't necessitate the public transit directions in the Bay Area, it was amazing to have while traveling to new cities.

toddmorey 14y ago

Yeah, I feel like this is one of those situations where companies go to war and consumers lose. Apple didn't create their own Maps to disrupt the space or because they have the same passion for wayfinding that they have for music; they did it as a power play against Google.

huxley 14y ago
Mapping is a growing part of the iOS SDK, I can understand Apple not wanting to be dependent on Google for that, particularly after Google started demanding significantly increased fees for Google Maps API usage: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/20/technology/many-sites-chart-a-new-course-as-google-expands-fees.html http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/20/technology/many-sites-char... Google walked back some of the worst effects of the changes: http://googlegeodevelopers.blogspot.ca/2012/06/lower-pricing-and-simplified-limits.html http://googlegeodevelopers.blogspot.ca/2012/06/lower-pricing... but by then the damage had been done in terms of Apple's (and developers') perception of the Google API.
- magicalist 14y ago
  That's the Javascript Maps API, first, and it only applies if you don't have an enterprise agreement anyways. You don't think Apple had a contract for mapping data independent of Google's pricing of their web API? (for developers, AFAIK there has been no cost for using Map Kit in iOS or a MapView in Android)
user911302966 14y ago
That's not exactly how capitalism works. Apple thought it would be beneficial to supply their own mapping software on their own device and OS. Google (I assume) still wants all of those millions of iOS user's data, so they will release their Google Maps app for iOS on the app store. Apple's mapping software already has a neat new feature with the 3-D thing. Now it's Google's turn to respond by matching that, or innovating. Repeat the cycle for the next feature disparity. It's a good thing.
brandoncapecci 14y ago
I disagree. Google had a monopoly on the maps market and was taking advantage of it. Apple's Maps app used vector images, brought 3d buildings to more cities, used higher quality textures, etc. They may have problems with it but I feel like the added enough innovation to force Google Maps to be better.

lnanek2 14y ago

To be fair, I was recently a little north of Atlanta and Google Maps had no idea about the bus system there. It knew the metro one, but not the one I needed to use to get to the metro one. Had to ask people advice to find a spot and then hang out half an hour because I hadn't known the schedule like I would with good maps support. So some people will have equal service.

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
eavc 14y ago
Atlanta has an abysmal public transit system, but Google Maps does know about the major bus system in town. It may not be complete, but I regularly see info for nearby bus stops in Google Now, for example.

tsieling 14y ago

As I understand it, other apps will be able to register with the maps service and add data to maps, like transit directions. In theory sounds great, it'll take a while to see how it shakes out which is a setback no matter how you slice it.

nachteilig 14y ago

I'm really looking forward to Google rolling out their own already-announced maps app on iOS for this reason (although I have to imagine your city has dedicated apps that do public transit already, as mine does). And as far as I know the maps app already used Apple's locations database, which was noticeably worse than Google's. I keep hoping that Apple will simply realize that location is not their strength, but so far this seems unlikely.

TheGateKeeper 14y ago

So let me get this straight. A single app on iOS, which doesn't live up to expectations or desires AND is still in BETA (re: unfinished, unready) and this makes you consider buying an entirely new phone? You sound like those soccer moms I make house calls for who just think it's easier to throw away a working system and buy something else.

herval 14y ago
Given it's getting released 7 days from now (and the version that comes with the GM, released today, is equally terrible), I'm, not sure it's gonna change that much before the release... (irrelevant fact: Maps is the MOST important app on the iPhone for me - after the browser, of course. I've put my life on its "hands" an infinite number of times...)
steevdave 14y ago
I'm on the fence myself. And yeah, when the most used app is the maps for transit directions it does leave a bad taste to go from something that worked great (most of the time) to something that doesn't work for your needs at all. Am I still able to take phone calls? Sure, as long as I'm not at the office though I blame that more on AT&T and working right near the river walk in San Antonio, but the local bus company has said their maps addon won't be out until October at the earliest, March of 2013 at the latest. And how many people have switched to Mac due to an inferior product feeling? Sure you can still use the computer but if one of the main purposes of having it doesn't work for your needs, why keep using it?
mtalantikite 14y ago
Yes, that's correct. Out of curiosity, do you live in NYC? The subway is part of the life blood of this city, and not being able to navigate from A -> B using maps is a major loss. Normal situational example: I'm in a neighborhood, say Fort Greene, and I'm meeting a friend for dinner at a restaurant I've never heard of in the East Village. First, I need to be able to find that restaurant by searching for it in Maps -- this largely doesn't work anymore. I often get results that are totally incorrect. But say I do find the location, I then need to figure out how to get there from a neighborhood I don't actively live in. Do I take the A train and transfer to the F and walk from the lower east side? Maybe it's faster to walk to the Q and get off at Union Square. Or maybe the manhattan bridge is under construction, and it actually would be faster to take the G to north Brooklyn and transfer to the L. This subway system is so massive that even native New Yorkers get turned around and need directions. If you don't actively live in NYC I think it might be hard to realize how significant losing transit directions is, not to mention useful location search.

jesseendahl 14y ago

Try iTrans NYC. It's incredible. http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/itrans-nyc-subway/id283492923?mt=8 http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/itrans-nyc-subway/id283492923...

gonzo 14y ago

apple has a strategy here, which is to allow regional 'providers' of directions to have apps on the phone. Google could be one such provider, if they want to be.

kyro 14y ago

HopStop is the app you're looking for. I just moved to Brooklyn and was recommended the app by someone who's been here only a few months. It gives ridiculously thorough directions, and has an offline transit map you can use while you're on the subway.

dhimes 14y ago

Google maps in the browser works great for me, even in areas remote like Englewood, TN. No app needed IMHO. Remember: When Steve Jobs was first defending the 30% app store cut he said something to the effect that it wouldn't matter in the long run because everybody was using web apps anyway.

josephlord 14y ago

In London and probably many other places around the World Google has only fairly recently started offering public transport directions (if they offer them at all) so I'm not sure the loss is that great. There are plenty of apps available that offer this. The people for whom this is a big issue are a fairly small proportion of the global population. Basically those in the US who live in major cities and are users of the transit system. In San Diego and New York this is a big issue and those are centres of the HN readership and probably also the tech media which might be important but the practical impact of this limitation may be limited.

ripperdoc 14y ago
I have used Google Maps for public transport very actively in multiple cities around the world, and I can't imagine living without it. Stockholm, Singapore, London, Tokyo all have it with Google. And I'd bet that a majority of smartphone users in the world use public transport, not cars, as primary method of getting around.

archagon 14y ago

I agree with you in principle, but in practice, when I was visiting New York in July, I got much better results by using an external app rather than Google Maps. ("NYC Subway", I think it was called.) Specifically, Google's directions often had multiple transfers and didn't mention any alternate routes, whereas the app gave me the route with fewest transfers and showed all the other lines going there, in case you missed the first train. I think this is why Apple's plan to relegate public transport directions to external apps might be a good idea: there's no way a single company -- even one the size of even Google! -- can keep track of all the minutiae involved in planning routes for every public transport system around the world, whereas app makers can. Even today, every public transit system that I've been on has one or more apps, so I doubt uptake will be a problem. And with the new APIs in iOS6, it should be much easier to get directions via external apps, since they show up in a list right in the Maps app. Oh, and the app worked offline, which as you might know is mighty helpful in large parts of the subway. :)

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jaxn 14y ago

Just as a counter: I have also been using it for a few months, but I am not a transit user. I feel the routes have been great and it has been a big addition to my phone.