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Apple is actually far worse at protecting your privacy than Google. On iOS, you cannot install any apps without an Apple Account, and even some preinstalled ap

by cnst 1y ago

Apple is actually far worse at protecting your privacy than Google. On iOS, you cannot install any apps without an Apple Account, and even some preinstalled apps (like Pages, Numbers, Keynote, GarageBand, iMovie) cannot be used before you assign them to an Apple Account. On Android, you can install any app from any third-party store without having any accounts. There's a store called Aurora Store that even lets you install apps from Google's Play Store without an account as well, so, you can even install all the mainstream apps, all without any accounts.

vlovich123 1y ago
> On Android, you can install any app from any third-party store without having any accounts. There's a store called Aurora Store that even lets you install apps from golgle's Pay Store without an account as well. I thought Google recently announced changes to this requiring a developer account to side load.
- cnst 1y ago
  Yes, Google did announce of the plans, but those changes aren't active yet, and they plan to start enforcing them in only several APAC countries where sideloading is far too popular and gets abused far too much. Hopefully, they'll see just how ineffective their measures are, and abandon before applying the plans to the rest of the world.
  - Yokolos 1y ago
    The unspoken part is, now that the functionality exists, it will be rolled out in more and more countries because it allows governments to directly control what apps users have access to. My response to Chat Control in the EU, if all efforts to stop it were to fail, was always "well, I have an Android, so I'll just install whatever app that isn't backdoored". But if Chat Control passes, this exact functionality will eventually be used to ensure that I can only use backdoored apps.
  - hellojesus 1y ago
    > where sideloading is far too popular and gets abused far too much. Why do we consider user installation of software abuse? Plenty of people install software from non-play repositories simply to prevent Google from getting data about their app profile.
    - cnst 1y ago
      The issue I spoke of, is not by the user, but by the fraudsters tricking people into installing malicious apps. I disagree that such protections (at the expense of the power users) are necessary, but, OTOH, you cannot just ignore such issue existing in the first place, because it does exist, and Google already does have the tools to combat it (by scanning all apps regardless of origin, and blocking malicious ones).
  - vrighter 1y ago
    There is no way to abuse it "too much". In fact there is no way to abuse it at all. "Sideloading software" means "installing software on my own damn machine". You can't abuse installing software on your own machine.
Nevermark 1y ago
That's one point of privacy. Meanwhile, they protect vast amounts of your data with encryption, especially if you opt in to the most protection. I don't have any wish to promote Apple, but those are not comparable. Even though I have hated Apple's closed App Store policy.
- eptcyka 1y ago
  What do you mean by your data being protected by vast amounts of encryption? Can you verify those claims beyond trusting what Apple tells you? Isn’t the commenter above insinuating that a targeted individual can be compromised anyway?
  - theshrike79 1y ago
    The amount of money you can get for a iPhone 0day confirms it. If they were playing fast and loose with cryptography and encryption, we'd have a lot more exploits in the open.
    - eptcyka 1y ago
      What do you mean by that? I don't think this follows at all.
      - theshrike79 1y ago
        If iPhones had flaws in the encryption or security, they WOULD be exploited and monetised. A zero day remote attack on an iOS device is worth so much money that you have to be _really_ ethical as a hacker not to sell it and report it to Apple for a small reward instead. The last time one was deployed "publicly" was against Jeff Bezos (or his wife) - one of the top10 richest people in the world anyway. And then it was patched for everyone.
        const_cast 1y ago
        Apple owns the code and all it's visibility - you're not allowed to see it. They don't need a 0 day to compromise your device, they can just choose to do it at any point. You're simply trusting they don't.
close04 1y ago
> Apple is actually far worse at protecting your privacy than Google. On iOS, you cannot install any apps without an Apple Account How did you decide that this one thing alone makes Apple's entire privacy approach far worse than Google's? Everything else doesn't matter anymore?
- cnst 1y ago
  What else could possibly matter if your entire identity is always exposed on every iOS device? I can't really think of anything worse as far as privacy is concerned. Can you?
jimjambw 1y ago
That is indeed one area of privacy but I wouldn’t say that Apple is far worse. There is countless number of examples where this just simply isn’t true. Also regarding the App Store, you don’t have to enter a credit card, you can make an account with a new email address.
- cnst 1y ago
  What's worse than the inability to NOT have a permanent standardised real-name identifier on your device at all times and on all devices? Apple has really questionable security as well. There's lots of people who have reported Apple randomly asking for Apple Account passwords all of a sudden in popups, on both iOS and macOS, the same way as malware would; or forcing password resets every day or every week. BTW, do you know how many customer accounts did Apple terminate in 2024? It's 128'961'839 — nearly 129 million customer accounts terminated in just one year.

by cnst 1y ago

vlovich123 1y ago

> On Android, you can install any app from any third-party store without having any accounts. There's a store called Aurora Store that even lets you install apps from golgle's Pay Store without an account as well. I thought Google recently announced changes to this requiring a developer account to side load.

cnst 1y ago
Yes, Google did announce of the plans, but those changes aren't active yet, and they plan to start enforcing them in only several APAC countries where sideloading is far too popular and gets abused far too much. Hopefully, they'll see just how ineffective their measures are, and abandon before applying the plans to the rest of the world.
- Yokolos 1y ago
  The unspoken part is, now that the functionality exists, it will be rolled out in more and more countries because it allows governments to directly control what apps users have access to. My response to Chat Control in the EU, if all efforts to stop it were to fail, was always "well, I have an Android, so I'll just install whatever app that isn't backdoored". But if Chat Control passes, this exact functionality will eventually be used to ensure that I can only use backdoored apps.
- hellojesus 1y ago
  > where sideloading is far too popular and gets abused far too much. Why do we consider user installation of software abuse? Plenty of people install software from non-play repositories simply to prevent Google from getting data about their app profile.
  - cnst 1y ago
    The issue I spoke of, is not by the user, but by the fraudsters tricking people into installing malicious apps. I disagree that such protections (at the expense of the power users) are necessary, but, OTOH, you cannot just ignore such issue existing in the first place, because it does exist, and Google already does have the tools to combat it (by scanning all apps regardless of origin, and blocking malicious ones).
- vrighter 1y ago
  There is no way to abuse it "too much". In fact there is no way to abuse it at all. "Sideloading software" means "installing software on my own damn machine". You can't abuse installing software on your own machine.

Nevermark 1y ago

That's one point of privacy. Meanwhile, they protect vast amounts of your data with encryption, especially if you opt in to the most protection. I don't have any wish to promote Apple, but those are not comparable. Even though I have hated Apple's closed App Store policy.

eptcyka 1y ago
What do you mean by your data being protected by vast amounts of encryption? Can you verify those claims beyond trusting what Apple tells you? Isn’t the commenter above insinuating that a targeted individual can be compromised anyway?
- theshrike79 1y ago
  The amount of money you can get for a iPhone 0day confirms it. If they were playing fast and loose with cryptography and encryption, we'd have a lot more exploits in the open.
  - eptcyka 1y ago
    What do you mean by that? I don't think this follows at all.
    - theshrike79 1y ago
      If iPhones had flaws in the encryption or security, they WOULD be exploited and monetised. A zero day remote attack on an iOS device is worth so much money that you have to be _really_ ethical as a hacker not to sell it and report it to Apple for a small reward instead. The last time one was deployed "publicly" was against Jeff Bezos (or his wife) - one of the top10 richest people in the world anyway. And then it was patched for everyone.
      - const_cast 1y ago
        Apple owns the code and all it's visibility - you're not allowed to see it. They don't need a 0 day to compromise your device, they can just choose to do it at any point. You're simply trusting they don't.

close04 1y ago

> Apple is actually far worse at protecting your privacy than Google. On iOS, you cannot install any apps without an Apple Account How did you decide that this one thing alone makes Apple's entire privacy approach far worse than Google's? Everything else doesn't matter anymore?

cnst 1y ago
What else could possibly matter if your entire identity is always exposed on every iOS device? I can't really think of anything worse as far as privacy is concerned. Can you?

jimjambw 1y ago

That is indeed one area of privacy but I wouldn’t say that Apple is far worse. There is countless number of examples where this just simply isn’t true. Also regarding the App Store, you don’t have to enter a credit card, you can make an account with a new email address.

cnst 1y ago
What's worse than the inability to NOT have a permanent standardised real-name identifier on your device at all times and on all devices? Apple has really questionable security as well. There's lots of people who have reported Apple randomly asking for Apple Account passwords all of a sudden in popups, on both iOS and macOS, the same way as malware would; or forcing password resets every day or every week. BTW, do you know how many customer accounts did Apple terminate in 2024? It's 128'961'839 — nearly 129 million customer accounts terminated in just one year.