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As much I loved this show growing up, an interesting thing about South Park is that they essentially defined the alt right (in the sense of a disenfranchised yo

by dmazin 1y ago

As much I loved this show growing up, an interesting thing about South Park is that they essentially defined the alt right (in the sense of a disenfranchised young man, often lashing out at marginalized groups and political correctness etc). Am I wrong or did there use to be an article called “South Park conservative” that basically described what eventually became “alt-right”? Edit: found it at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Park_Republican https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Park_Republican

righthand 1y ago
You aren’t wrong that there is/was a group of people that consider themselves South Park Conservative but the creators reject the notion that South Park is specifically liberal or conservative, because their intent is to parody any people they can. The creators dislike political correctness but they also dislike the forceful nature of conservatives applying their beliefs on other people. Read the South Park wikipedia page, it explains it pretty well. Insinuating that South Park conservatives evolved into the alt-right is doing a lot of heavy lifting. Trey and Matt didn’t invent disliking political correctness.
- elefanten 1y ago
  I concur with this take. Like many facets of culture, some people/groups will project what they want onto a given cultural entity (South Park, in this case), but that doesn’t mean one should assume they speak for it. For example, the “men’s rights activists” group appropriated the idea of “the red pill” from The Matrix. They certainly differ wildly in worldview from the Wachowski siblings.
- ChocolateGod 1y ago
  Disliking political correctness isn't even limited to the right on the political scale. Bill Maher has spoken out against it for example.
  - JustExAWS 1y ago
    I consider myself liberal on most issues - strong social safety, universal healthcare , pro vax, strong separation between church and state, and hate the demonization of other. But this is political correctness gone crazy. https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/08/25/politics/democrats-gender-nonbinary-charter https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/08/25/politics/democrats-gender... I as a Black guy was also put off by the forced indoctrination that BigTech did post 2020 (when I worked there) with all of the “ally ship”, “DEI” crap I had to endure. I just wanted to do my job, get my money, get my RSUs and bounce after 4 years.
    - ChocolateGod 1y ago
      I too believe in universal healthcare and welfare social nets to catch people who fall, but think we've focussed too much on "feelings" over facts or people wanting to score "social justice" points that don't do anything to fix the ills of society. Here's another example of political correctness going too far, this time related to tech. https://www.aswf.io/inclusive-language-guide/ https://www.aswf.io/inclusive-language-guide/ Apparently "native support" is offensive.
    - mock-possum 1y ago
      How is this political correctness? If the legal language mandates an equal split between men and women, where could that possibly leave non-binary people, other than without representation, right? I’m curious especially as a black guy, why this wouldn’t land for you. Imagine a legal body obligated to be composed of equal representation, racially, that explicitly requires white, brown, red, and yellow members - but doesn’t mention black. That hardly sounds fair, does it? So why deride efforts to institutionalize inclusivity, integration, and equal representation as ‘crazy?’
      - JustExAWS 1y ago
        It was a “policy” decision that had nothing to do with the law. I would think it was just as crazy if the committee had language around they must have an equal number of Black and White members and if one person was a biracial … If they had a committee focused on women’s health issues surrounding pregnancy and childbirth, should they include transgender women? What happens in the case where they want equal representation if my mom had a Black father and White mother and my dad had an Hispanic father and Japanese mother? But from a real politick angle, this was dumb and cringy knowing the mood of the majority of Americans. The job is to win elections. Bill Clinton invented the “Sister Souljah” moment and Obama followed suit by distancing himself from the Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson wing of the party. A lot of moderate Democrats and Republicans who have no issue respecting anyone for whatever life they decide to live, find that the left has gone too far. As much as I distrust the police and the entire justice system for instance, I thought the phrase “defund the police” went too far and I understood the point they were making underneath. It’s the same with enforced (he/him) labels on everyone and having to be really sure you aren’t accused of being some type of “ist” because you only speak in “heteronormative terms”. If (hypothetical) you want to call out your preferred pronouns, go for it and I’ll respect them.
patates 1y ago
A comedy show is just a comedy show. We're all responsible for who we become. If some purposefully terrible animated pixels inspire me to be a disgusting person, that's on me. If I play a shooting game and end up hurting someone, that's on me too (or my parents, if I'm young!). And if I spend too much time on HN, thinking AI is garbage, and then lose my job because I fell behind, that's also on me! (As well as starting to write my own comedy here on HN, knowing exactly what I'm getting into!)
- 01HNNWZ0MV43FF 1y ago
  If something in the water makes a million people into disgusting mass shooters, we should look into it
  - patates 1y ago
    > If something in the water makes a million people into disgusting mass shooters, we should look into it You're using a completely made-up extreme example to make your point, but we're surrounded by real-world examples of free speech being heavily impacted. We don't need to invent scenarios.
JustExAWS 1y ago
They had an episode mocking Al Gore about climate change and then did an episode years later where they basically admitted they were wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ManBearPig https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ManBearPig More to the point, you haven’t heard about their current season’s Trump episode? The alt right aren’t exactly deep thinkers. It’s just like the police glorifying the Punisher. https://www.newsweek.com/punisher-police-blue-lives-matter-skull-logo-1449272 https://www.newsweek.com/punisher-police-blue-lives-matter-s... Or MAGA conservatives playing “Born in the USA” without listening to the lyrics. South Park mocks everyone. https://www.salon.com/2017/09/15/why-south-park-is-better-armed-than-anyone-to-fight-the-alt-right/ https://www.salon.com/2017/09/15/why-south-park-is-better-ar... The “alt-right” have always been part of America or have you never heard of Jim Crow and segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever”?
- bigstrat2003 1y ago
  > They had an episode mocking Al Gore about climate change and then did an episode years later where they basically admitted they were wrong. Eh, I wouldn't say that. Nor would I say they were really taking a stand on climate change in the first place. They just thought it would be funny to have Al Gore tilting at windmills (and indeed it was), and then thought it would be funny to have him proven right (and indeed it was). One of the things I appreciate about Trey and Matt is that they do what they think is funny first and foremost, rather than try to make the show a mouthpiece for their beliefs as many creators do.
  - JustExAWS 1y ago
    They were definitely as it’s climate change skeptics and changed their minds. They admitted as much.
  - baobabKoodaa 1y ago
    They have publicly said it was about climate change.

by dmazin 1y ago

righthand 1y ago

You aren’t wrong that there is/was a group of people that consider themselves South Park Conservative but the creators reject the notion that South Park is specifically liberal or conservative, because their intent is to parody any people they can. The creators dislike political correctness but they also dislike the forceful nature of conservatives applying their beliefs on other people. Read the South Park wikipedia page, it explains it pretty well. Insinuating that South Park conservatives evolved into the alt-right is doing a lot of heavy lifting. Trey and Matt didn’t invent disliking political correctness.

elefanten 1y ago
I concur with this take. Like many facets of culture, some people/groups will project what they want onto a given cultural entity (South Park, in this case), but that doesn’t mean one should assume they speak for it. For example, the “men’s rights activists” group appropriated the idea of “the red pill” from The Matrix. They certainly differ wildly in worldview from the Wachowski siblings.
ChocolateGod 1y ago
Disliking political correctness isn't even limited to the right on the political scale. Bill Maher has spoken out against it for example.
- JustExAWS 1y ago
  I consider myself liberal on most issues - strong social safety, universal healthcare , pro vax, strong separation between church and state, and hate the demonization of other. But this is political correctness gone crazy. https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/08/25/politics/democrats-gender-nonbinary-charter https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/08/25/politics/democrats-gender... I as a Black guy was also put off by the forced indoctrination that BigTech did post 2020 (when I worked there) with all of the “ally ship”, “DEI” crap I had to endure. I just wanted to do my job, get my money, get my RSUs and bounce after 4 years.
  - ChocolateGod 1y ago
    I too believe in universal healthcare and welfare social nets to catch people who fall, but think we've focussed too much on "feelings" over facts or people wanting to score "social justice" points that don't do anything to fix the ills of society. Here's another example of political correctness going too far, this time related to tech. https://www.aswf.io/inclusive-language-guide/ https://www.aswf.io/inclusive-language-guide/ Apparently "native support" is offensive.
  - mock-possum 1y ago
    How is this political correctness? If the legal language mandates an equal split between men and women, where could that possibly leave non-binary people, other than without representation, right? I’m curious especially as a black guy, why this wouldn’t land for you. Imagine a legal body obligated to be composed of equal representation, racially, that explicitly requires white, brown, red, and yellow members - but doesn’t mention black. That hardly sounds fair, does it? So why deride efforts to institutionalize inclusivity, integration, and equal representation as ‘crazy?’
    - JustExAWS 1y ago
      It was a “policy” decision that had nothing to do with the law. I would think it was just as crazy if the committee had language around they must have an equal number of Black and White members and if one person was a biracial … If they had a committee focused on women’s health issues surrounding pregnancy and childbirth, should they include transgender women? What happens in the case where they want equal representation if my mom had a Black father and White mother and my dad had an Hispanic father and Japanese mother? But from a real politick angle, this was dumb and cringy knowing the mood of the majority of Americans. The job is to win elections. Bill Clinton invented the “Sister Souljah” moment and Obama followed suit by distancing himself from the Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson wing of the party. A lot of moderate Democrats and Republicans who have no issue respecting anyone for whatever life they decide to live, find that the left has gone too far. As much as I distrust the police and the entire justice system for instance, I thought the phrase “defund the police” went too far and I understood the point they were making underneath. It’s the same with enforced (he/him) labels on everyone and having to be really sure you aren’t accused of being some type of “ist” because you only speak in “heteronormative terms”. If (hypothetical) you want to call out your preferred pronouns, go for it and I’ll respect them.

patates 1y ago

A comedy show is just a comedy show. We're all responsible for who we become. If some purposefully terrible animated pixels inspire me to be a disgusting person, that's on me. If I play a shooting game and end up hurting someone, that's on me too (or my parents, if I'm young!). And if I spend too much time on HN, thinking AI is garbage, and then lose my job because I fell behind, that's also on me! (As well as starting to write my own comedy here on HN, knowing exactly what I'm getting into!)

01HNNWZ0MV43FF 1y ago
If something in the water makes a million people into disgusting mass shooters, we should look into it
- patates 1y ago
  > If something in the water makes a million people into disgusting mass shooters, we should look into it You're using a completely made-up extreme example to make your point, but we're surrounded by real-world examples of free speech being heavily impacted. We don't need to invent scenarios.

JustExAWS 1y ago

They had an episode mocking Al Gore about climate change and then did an episode years later where they basically admitted they were wrong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ManBearPig https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ManBearPig More to the point, you haven’t heard about their current season’s Trump episode? The alt right aren’t exactly deep thinkers. It’s just like the police glorifying the Punisher. https://www.newsweek.com/punisher-police-blue-lives-matter-skull-logo-1449272 https://www.newsweek.com/punisher-police-blue-lives-matter-s... Or MAGA conservatives playing “Born in the USA” without listening to the lyrics. South Park mocks everyone. https://www.salon.com/2017/09/15/why-south-park-is-better-armed-than-anyone-to-fight-the-alt-right/ https://www.salon.com/2017/09/15/why-south-park-is-better-ar... The “alt-right” have always been part of America or have you never heard of Jim Crow and segregation today, segregation tomorrow, segregation forever”?

bigstrat2003 1y ago
> They had an episode mocking Al Gore about climate change and then did an episode years later where they basically admitted they were wrong. Eh, I wouldn't say that. Nor would I say they were really taking a stand on climate change in the first place. They just thought it would be funny to have Al Gore tilting at windmills (and indeed it was), and then thought it would be funny to have him proven right (and indeed it was). One of the things I appreciate about Trey and Matt is that they do what they think is funny first and foremost, rather than try to make the show a mouthpiece for their beliefs as many creators do.
- JustExAWS 1y ago
  They were definitely as it’s climate change skeptics and changed their minds. They admitted as much.
- baobabKoodaa 1y ago
  They have publicly said it was about climate change.