14 ms·

One thing I, as an entrepreneur, wish more designers knew: I can't do everything, and I have to make tradeoffs based on cost-benefit analyses, and you will infl

One thing I, as an entrepreneur, wish more designers knew: I can't do everything, and I have to make tradeoffs based on cost-benefit analyses, and you will influence me more if you speak in that language. All but one of these 29 things (in fact, there are 32) are additional things this guy thinks I should spend my limited resources on.

posabsolute 14y ago
Agreed, I think lot fo the stuff here, it's his job to educate others about it.
- saraid216 14y ago
  Maybe he should write a blog post about it and put it on HN.
ender7 14y ago
All too often, UI people end up being marginalized because management doesn't support them. Unless you just want "a new coat of paint" a good UX design will require some hard changes and product realignments. If the CEO is not interested in taking part in that conversation then you'll never be able to build a good product.
- true_religion 14y ago
  It depends.... in an early stage startup, you're still tossing around ideas and trying to find what fits with your target market. In that stage, you can't just contract out UX to a designer. You'll burn up all your runway doing so, as you iterate. In my opinion its better to do UX internally, and coordinate with your designer for stylistic changes.
- timr 14y ago
  All too often, "UX Designers" end up marginalized because they're wankers - people who don't code and don't design, but want to get right in the middle of things and fling around opinions. Especially dangerous are the representatives of this breed who want to "manage process" as a way of "designing the product". Hiring that kind of person is a great way to get a useless bureaucrat on your team. There are good designers who specialize in user experience, but those people are also good at marketable skills like graphic design, coding or statistics. Everyone on the team is responsible for good user experience. The existence of a person who does nothing more than "UX" is a process smell.
  - dos1 14y ago
    Yes! Totally agree! There should never be a person whose sole job is "UX". I've encountered many of these people and have never seen one add value to a project. As a further aside, I also despise "information architectures" which these UX people always want to hammer out. To me, information architecture is a buzzword and total crap. I want to see high fidelity design comps. No more Omnigraffle low fi wireframes. (And especially no Omnigraffle wireframes as a deliverable to developers to code real UIs!)
    - utopkara 14y ago
      A good UX designer doesn't linger around after doing the job. Their utility drops drastically after the initial design. If they do have to stay, then they haven't done a good job of communicating the key points and observations.
      - ahmadss 14y ago
        A good UX designer SHOULD stick around because their utility after the initial design is to conduct usability tests, user research, and user feedback to make sure initial design decisions were sound and that the experience that actual users and customers have align with the goals of the business/organization (ie - conversion rates, profitability, ease of navigation, etc). Ultimately, the UX lead helps with product decisions by leveraging said user feedback to suggest incremental changes to the product. If they simply leave after the designs are "done" and never touch the product or app again, then their utility is marginal to an organization.
        utopkara 14y ago
        "stick around ... to conduct usability tests, user research, and user feedback" is exactly the pitfall that UX falls into when it fails. We've seen it happen so many times, and en masse. This process-driven design fails, because it tries to put the designer in the middle of development, while taking away the responsibility for good design. It is attractive, because the UX designer can blame the users' "unexpected" behavior. It is attractive, because it exchanges the experience, with experiment. If the design is incomplete, it is incomplete, period. If the users have to be observed, let it be done, the development can wait. There is nothing worse than a designer who makes blind guesses about the design hoping that some miracle during the "usability test" will reveal a beautiful solution.
- malachismith 14y ago
  Actually... most often UI people end up marginalized because they think their ideas and their needs are more important than they really are. Designers are, in general, their own worst enemies.
  - woah 14y ago
    Interesting statement- any more concrete examples?
- prodigal_erik 14y ago
  "Never build a good product" is too strong. We as hackers have quite a few exceptionally powerful tools with terrible UIs (e.g., emacs) and it only really hinders the earliest portion of one's career before climbing the learning curve. Consumer stuff has a tendency to over-optimize for approachability, which my get you eyeballs but not dedicated power users whose lives revolve around tools.
JonLim 14y ago
While I agree with you, I think you have to approach these 29 things as a helping hand for when you're deciding to use those limited resources. After all, a solid UX from the start will make it far easier to build and find success than having to re-invent the wheel (your product) later on in the cycle just to save some time and money at the start. My personal opinion, of course.
inkaudio 14y ago
I've learned not to work with entrepreneurs who do not understand the value of design and user experience. There are plenty of entrepreneurs who understand the value of ux/ui. My job is to design an a app that is not a pain to use, not explain cost-benefit of this. On a side note, the op is wrong when he writes "Bring in the UX designer before you’ve attempted any UI work." Yes you want to do UX first, but UI and UX are inseparable, because from the user perspective, the user interface(UI) always has a bearing on the user experience (UX). The UX should dictate the UI, but a good UX designer will always design the UI.
- ezl 14y ago
  Its not a question of understanding that those have value. the original post is just saying that there are more things that require attention than he can address. All startups work with constraints. For some startups design & UX are less important than for others. Products CAN succeed with crap UX (though it can severely penalize the outcome). Products CAN NOT succeed without _product_. So if an entrepreneur has to pick between a rails developer and a front end dev, in some cases he has to pick the backend guy. Rock, Entrepreneur, Hard Place
  - adrianhoward 14y ago
    So if an entrepreneur has to pick between a rails developer and a front end dev, in some cases he has to pick the backend guy. Which is indicative of the problem - UX is not just about the front end stuff it's about helping define what product to build. Y'know all of that "Get out of the building" stuff that Steve Blank goes on about? The whole validating that you're actually really solving somebodies problem? The UX world has a phrase for that. We call it "generative user research". We have a whole stack of useful toys in our toy box for helping folk do that well. We've already made, and learned from, the mistakes that I see folk in the lean startup world making. I keep encountering companies that are just throwing money away building stuff too early, when a half dozen five minute conversations with some actual users would help them figure out what the right thing to build is. The model of having the UX person in "control" sucks. They should be a peer team member not at the top of the hierarchy. But the value they bring is a lot more than just making-the-product-work-nicer. The real value, especially in early stage startups, is helping figure-out-what-product-to-build.
utopkara 14y ago
You need to be convinced that a designer is needed in order to pay for it, and you may not need one: If you trust that your product is designed not according to the convenience of the underlying technology (and the computation device) but to match the goals of the [put your target audience here] #1 user Jane (age 21, last year in college, started thinking about her finances, has classes all day, needs to straighten up GPA before graduation, good at math and office software, shares apartment with 2 other people, uses to phone for IM and instagram), and #2 user Hillary (age 58, manager in a paper company, both kids graduated from college, has meetings throughout the week, 5 weeks vacation, heavily depends on her phone for calendar and email).
pumblechook 14y ago
As Nielsen said, the ultimate goal of usability is cash. Unfortunately, this article comes off more as a designer rant, as if startups should invest in usability just because it somehow makes the world a better place. When, in fact, the positive ROI of usability improvement has been established for awhile: http://www.useit.com/alertbox/roi.html http://www.useit.com/alertbox/roi.html A good UX guy will realize this and design to the situation, rather than preach some esoteric heuristics.
csmeder 14y ago
"Designing for quality will always be more expensive. It's not about expense. It's about the return on the investment." -Jared Spool You have to take a look at your competition. If a high quality experience doesn't matter then yes don't do the 29 things. However, remember "Design and UX is the new IP" - Ron Conway And remember Paul Graham has said "always run uphill". He meant that when he could solve either a regular problem or a hard problem at Viaweb he'd always solve the harder problem as if he found it hard, his competitors would find it almost impossible. So you can use UX and Design as your "barrier to entry"/"hard problem" amongst your competition. If you are solving some other non UX hard problem, then have a mediocre user experience if it makes sense.

posabsolute 14y ago

Agreed, I think lot fo the stuff here, it's his job to educate others about it.

saraid216 14y ago
Maybe he should write a blog post about it and put it on HN.

ender7 14y ago

All too often, UI people end up being marginalized because management doesn't support them. Unless you just want "a new coat of paint" a good UX design will require some hard changes and product realignments. If the CEO is not interested in taking part in that conversation then you'll never be able to build a good product.

true_religion 14y ago
It depends.... in an early stage startup, you're still tossing around ideas and trying to find what fits with your target market. In that stage, you can't just contract out UX to a designer. You'll burn up all your runway doing so, as you iterate. In my opinion its better to do UX internally, and coordinate with your designer for stylistic changes.
timr 14y ago
All too often, "UX Designers" end up marginalized because they're wankers - people who don't code and don't design, but want to get right in the middle of things and fling around opinions. Especially dangerous are the representatives of this breed who want to "manage process" as a way of "designing the product". Hiring that kind of person is a great way to get a useless bureaucrat on your team. There are good designers who specialize in user experience, but those people are also good at marketable skills like graphic design, coding or statistics. Everyone on the team is responsible for good user experience. The existence of a person who does nothing more than "UX" is a process smell.
- dos1 14y ago
  Yes! Totally agree! There should never be a person whose sole job is "UX". I've encountered many of these people and have never seen one add value to a project. As a further aside, I also despise "information architectures" which these UX people always want to hammer out. To me, information architecture is a buzzword and total crap. I want to see high fidelity design comps. No more Omnigraffle low fi wireframes. (And especially no Omnigraffle wireframes as a deliverable to developers to code real UIs!)
  - utopkara 14y ago
    A good UX designer doesn't linger around after doing the job. Their utility drops drastically after the initial design. If they do have to stay, then they haven't done a good job of communicating the key points and observations.
    - ahmadss 14y ago
      A good UX designer SHOULD stick around because their utility after the initial design is to conduct usability tests, user research, and user feedback to make sure initial design decisions were sound and that the experience that actual users and customers have align with the goals of the business/organization (ie - conversion rates, profitability, ease of navigation, etc). Ultimately, the UX lead helps with product decisions by leveraging said user feedback to suggest incremental changes to the product. If they simply leave after the designs are "done" and never touch the product or app again, then their utility is marginal to an organization.
      - utopkara 14y ago
        "stick around ... to conduct usability tests, user research, and user feedback" is exactly the pitfall that UX falls into when it fails. We've seen it happen so many times, and en masse. This process-driven design fails, because it tries to put the designer in the middle of development, while taking away the responsibility for good design. It is attractive, because the UX designer can blame the users' "unexpected" behavior. It is attractive, because it exchanges the experience, with experiment. If the design is incomplete, it is incomplete, period. If the users have to be observed, let it be done, the development can wait. There is nothing worse than a designer who makes blind guesses about the design hoping that some miracle during the "usability test" will reveal a beautiful solution.
malachismith 14y ago
Actually... most often UI people end up marginalized because they think their ideas and their needs are more important than they really are. Designers are, in general, their own worst enemies.
- woah 14y ago
  Interesting statement- any more concrete examples?
prodigal_erik 14y ago
"Never build a good product" is too strong. We as hackers have quite a few exceptionally powerful tools with terrible UIs (e.g., emacs) and it only really hinders the earliest portion of one's career before climbing the learning curve. Consumer stuff has a tendency to over-optimize for approachability, which my get you eyeballs but not dedicated power users whose lives revolve around tools.

JonLim 14y ago

While I agree with you, I think you have to approach these 29 things as a helping hand for when you're deciding to use those limited resources. After all, a solid UX from the start will make it far easier to build and find success than having to re-invent the wheel (your product) later on in the cycle just to save some time and money at the start. My personal opinion, of course.

inkaudio 14y ago

I've learned not to work with entrepreneurs who do not understand the value of design and user experience. There are plenty of entrepreneurs who understand the value of ux/ui. My job is to design an a app that is not a pain to use, not explain cost-benefit of this. On a side note, the op is wrong when he writes "Bring in the UX designer before you’ve attempted any UI work." Yes you want to do UX first, but UI and UX are inseparable, because from the user perspective, the user interface(UI) always has a bearing on the user experience (UX). The UX should dictate the UI, but a good UX designer will always design the UI.

ezl 14y ago
Its not a question of understanding that those have value. the original post is just saying that there are more things that require attention than he can address. All startups work with constraints. For some startups design & UX are less important than for others. Products CAN succeed with crap UX (though it can severely penalize the outcome). Products CAN NOT succeed without _product_. So if an entrepreneur has to pick between a rails developer and a front end dev, in some cases he has to pick the backend guy. Rock, Entrepreneur, Hard Place
- adrianhoward 14y ago
  So if an entrepreneur has to pick between a rails developer and a front end dev, in some cases he has to pick the backend guy. Which is indicative of the problem - UX is not just about the front end stuff it's about helping define what product to build. Y'know all of that "Get out of the building" stuff that Steve Blank goes on about? The whole validating that you're actually really solving somebodies problem? The UX world has a phrase for that. We call it "generative user research". We have a whole stack of useful toys in our toy box for helping folk do that well. We've already made, and learned from, the mistakes that I see folk in the lean startup world making. I keep encountering companies that are just throwing money away building stuff too early, when a half dozen five minute conversations with some actual users would help them figure out what the right thing to build is. The model of having the UX person in "control" sucks. They should be a peer team member not at the top of the hierarchy. But the value they bring is a lot more than just making-the-product-work-nicer. The real value, especially in early stage startups, is helping figure-out-what-product-to-build.

utopkara 14y ago

You need to be convinced that a designer is needed in order to pay for it, and you may not need one: If you trust that your product is designed not according to the convenience of the underlying technology (and the computation device) but to match the goals of the [put your target audience here] #1 user Jane (age 21, last year in college, started thinking about her finances, has classes all day, needs to straighten up GPA before graduation, good at math and office software, shares apartment with 2 other people, uses to phone for IM and instagram), and #2 user Hillary (age 58, manager in a paper company, both kids graduated from college, has meetings throughout the week, 5 weeks vacation, heavily depends on her phone for calendar and email).

pumblechook 14y ago

As Nielsen said, the ultimate goal of usability is cash. Unfortunately, this article comes off more as a designer rant, as if startups should invest in usability just because it somehow makes the world a better place. When, in fact, the positive ROI of usability improvement has been established for awhile: http://www.useit.com/alertbox/roi.html http://www.useit.com/alertbox/roi.html A good UX guy will realize this and design to the situation, rather than preach some esoteric heuristics.

csmeder 14y ago

"Designing for quality will always be more expensive. It's not about expense. It's about the return on the investment." -Jared Spool You have to take a look at your competition. If a high quality experience doesn't matter then yes don't do the 29 things. However, remember "Design and UX is the new IP" - Ron Conway And remember Paul Graham has said "always run uphill". He meant that when he could solve either a regular problem or a hard problem at Viaweb he'd always solve the harder problem as if he found it hard, his competitors would find it almost impossible. So you can use UX and Design as your "barrier to entry"/"hard problem" amongst your competition. If you are solving some other non UX hard problem, then have a mediocre user experience if it makes sense.