5 ms·

Okay, now do cities. DC is not a state.

by bagels 1y ago

pixl97 1y ago
They don't want to do that because they'd have to admit that Marksville LA has about twice the violent crime rate.
- gottorf 1y ago
  I have no problem admitting that other cities have higher violent crime rates, though I have no particular knowledge of Marksville, LA. I'm not sure why you would suggest that. I would approve of stronger efforts of curbing violent crime in those places, as well. I feel terribly for the innocents who live in those cities, as much as do for those in DC.
gottorf 1y ago
Sure. At a rate of 26.6 homicides per 100k as of the conclusion of 2024, it would belong in the top 10 most murderous cities in the US, and would appear to fall in the top 100 in the world. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. There are a handful of other American cities with worse crime, so we should give DC a pass? Constitutionally it belongs to the federal government, which devolved some level of home rule to the local government starting about 50 years ago. The evidence seems clear that local authorities aren't doing the job well.
- johnbellone 1y ago
  When you don't give the local authorities the money and autonomy to do so it should not be a surprise that they cannot effectively do their duty. When you take a look at the trend of the data over time it doesn't tell a story of crime that isn't being managed. It may not be as quick or as thorough, but it has been downward trending.
  - gottorf 1y ago
    > When you don't give the local authorities the money and autonomy to do so DC spent over $26k per resident, well above the overall US federal budget of roughly $20k per person. And the DC budget doesn't even have to account for a globe-spanning military! What autonomy is it lacking that it can't put repeat violent offenders behind bars? > When you take a look at the trend of the data over time it doesn't tell a story of crime that isn't being managed. It may not be as quick or as thorough, but it has been downward trending. Outside of six whole years, the homicide rate in DC hasn't been under 20/100k in 50 years. "Downward trending" from 80 in 1990 to 20s now is great in isolation, but terrible when you realize that places like Paris and London are in the low single digits.
    - johnbellone 1y ago
      Perhaps it is worth going to actually read some of the limitations (representation, budget, taxation) of what the government of DC is actually capable of doing versus doing a simple straight line math exercise. Crime is a problem, but taken within context it isn't anywhere near as bad as Baltimore or Philadelphia. You keep citing the homicide rate but do not consider the geography and constraints of the capital region, i.e., some of the crime and violent offenders are from non-residents. You can't simply compare it to a city like London or Paris for many reasons.
      - gottorf 1y ago
        > Crime is a problem, but taken within context it isn't anywhere near as bad as Baltimore or Philadelphia. Baltimore and Philly are worse, yes. That's little reprieve for the average Joe living in DC surrounded by disorder. DC, being exclusively federal territory, has the unique legal situation where the president could deploy the National Guard for policing. > You keep citing the homicide rate but do not consider the geography and constraints of the capital region, i.e., some of the crime and violent offenders are from non-residents. You can't simply compare it to a city like London or Paris for many reasons. I don't understand your line of reasoning. Do you care to clarify? Neither London, nor Paris, nor any other city in this country are islands where entry and exit are controlled. Some American cities with really bad crime, like St. Louis or Philly, abut state lines and likely get a lot of cross-state criminal traffic as well.
- FireBeyond 1y ago
  I wonder if the fact that of the top ten murderous states, nine of them are run by Republicans has anything to do with the fact that Trump hasn't even vaguely hinted at National Guard deployments there.
  - gottorf 1y ago
    It's probably more the fact that DC constitutionally belongs to the federal government, so it's a lot easier for Trump to unilaterally deploy the National Guard there.
    - FireBeyond 1y ago
      He didn’t seem to have any problem doing so in California… And then last time anyone wanted him to deploy them in DC he apparently couldn’t because the mayor didn’t allow him to… It’s got near zero to do with that.
- seanmcdirmid 1y ago
  How is it compared to New Orleans (34.7) since you mentioned Louisiana? Or Baltimore (58.3 WTF???) which is next door?
woodpanel 1y ago
Sure thing. Here is the list of the top-20 murder-rated cities in the US: St. Louis, MO – Mayor Cara Spencer (DNC), DNC rule 76 years. Baltimore, MD – Mayor Brandon Scott (DNC), DNC rule 56 years. New Orleans, LA – Mayor LaToya Cantrell (DNC), DNC rule 153 years. Detroit, MI – Mayor Mike Duggan (ex DNC), DNC rule 63 years Cleveland, OH – Mayor Justin Bibb (DNC), DNC rule 35 years Las Vegas, NV – Mayor Carolyn Goodman (Husband of ex-DNC mayor), DNC rule 82 years Kansas City, MO – Mayor Quinton Lucas (DNC), DNC rule 34 years Memphis, TN – Mayor Paul Young (DNC), DNC rule 53 years. Newark, NJ – Mayor Ras Baraka (DNC), DNC rule 72 years. Chicago, IL – Mayor Brandon Johnson (DNC), DNC rule 94 years. Cincinnati, OH – Mayor Aftab Pureval (DNC), DNC rule 41 years Philadelphia, PA – Mayor Cherelle Parker (DNC), DNC rule 74 years Milwaukee, WI – Mayor Cavalier Johnson (DNC), DNC rule 65 years Tulsa, OK – Mayor Monroe Nichols (DNC), only outlier in this list with significant non-DNC mayors Pittsburgh, PA – Mayor Ed Gainey (DNC), DNC rule 91 years Indianapolis, IN – Mayor Joe Hogsett (DNC), DNC rule 9 years. Louisville, KY – Mayor Craig Greenberg (DNC), DNC rule 56 years Oakland, CA – Mayor Sheng Thao (DNC), DNC rule 48 years Washington, D.C. – Mayor Muriel Bowser (DNC), DNC rule 64 years Atlanta, GA – Mayor Andre Dickens (DNC), DNC rule 164 years
- righthand 1y ago
  The DNC doesn’t “rule” over cities. Mayors are not DNC representatives or federally aligned. This is a disingenuous report with no sources and should be held with Extreme skepticism.
  - 55555 1y ago
    Obviously you’re right but my god that is a very troubling coincidence…
    - righthand 1y ago
      You honestly believe murder rate is higher in cities because the mayor is a Democrat? Or are cities with Democrat mayors much larger and diverse than Republic mayor cities? Do you think the people in Democrat cities vote in a Democrat mayor because they want more murder? You can read a million different things from a list of items with similar attributes. Especially one compiled without sources or any context of the regions of the US.

Okay, now do cities. DC is not a state.

by bagels 1y ago

Okay, now do cities. DC is not a state.

pixl97 1y ago

They don't want to do that because they'd have to admit that Marksville LA has about twice the violent crime rate.

gottorf 1y ago
I have no problem admitting that other cities have higher violent crime rates, though I have no particular knowledge of Marksville, LA. I'm not sure why you would suggest that. I would approve of stronger efforts of curbing violent crime in those places, as well. I feel terribly for the innocents who live in those cities, as much as do for those in DC.

gottorf 1y ago

Sure. At a rate of 26.6 homicides per 100k as of the conclusion of 2024, it would belong in the top 10 most murderous cities in the US, and would appear to fall in the top 100 in the world. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make. There are a handful of other American cities with worse crime, so we should give DC a pass? Constitutionally it belongs to the federal government, which devolved some level of home rule to the local government starting about 50 years ago. The evidence seems clear that local authorities aren't doing the job well.

johnbellone 1y ago
When you don't give the local authorities the money and autonomy to do so it should not be a surprise that they cannot effectively do their duty. When you take a look at the trend of the data over time it doesn't tell a story of crime that isn't being managed. It may not be as quick or as thorough, but it has been downward trending.
- gottorf 1y ago
  > When you don't give the local authorities the money and autonomy to do so DC spent over $26k per resident, well above the overall US federal budget of roughly $20k per person. And the DC budget doesn't even have to account for a globe-spanning military! What autonomy is it lacking that it can't put repeat violent offenders behind bars? > When you take a look at the trend of the data over time it doesn't tell a story of crime that isn't being managed. It may not be as quick or as thorough, but it has been downward trending. Outside of six whole years, the homicide rate in DC hasn't been under 20/100k in 50 years. "Downward trending" from 80 in 1990 to 20s now is great in isolation, but terrible when you realize that places like Paris and London are in the low single digits.
  - johnbellone 1y ago
    Perhaps it is worth going to actually read some of the limitations (representation, budget, taxation) of what the government of DC is actually capable of doing versus doing a simple straight line math exercise. Crime is a problem, but taken within context it isn't anywhere near as bad as Baltimore or Philadelphia. You keep citing the homicide rate but do not consider the geography and constraints of the capital region, i.e., some of the crime and violent offenders are from non-residents. You can't simply compare it to a city like London or Paris for many reasons.
    - gottorf 1y ago
      > Crime is a problem, but taken within context it isn't anywhere near as bad as Baltimore or Philadelphia. Baltimore and Philly are worse, yes. That's little reprieve for the average Joe living in DC surrounded by disorder. DC, being exclusively federal territory, has the unique legal situation where the president could deploy the National Guard for policing. > You keep citing the homicide rate but do not consider the geography and constraints of the capital region, i.e., some of the crime and violent offenders are from non-residents. You can't simply compare it to a city like London or Paris for many reasons. I don't understand your line of reasoning. Do you care to clarify? Neither London, nor Paris, nor any other city in this country are islands where entry and exit are controlled. Some American cities with really bad crime, like St. Louis or Philly, abut state lines and likely get a lot of cross-state criminal traffic as well.
FireBeyond 1y ago
I wonder if the fact that of the top ten murderous states, nine of them are run by Republicans has anything to do with the fact that Trump hasn't even vaguely hinted at National Guard deployments there.
- gottorf 1y ago
  It's probably more the fact that DC constitutionally belongs to the federal government, so it's a lot easier for Trump to unilaterally deploy the National Guard there.
  - FireBeyond 1y ago
    He didn’t seem to have any problem doing so in California… And then last time anyone wanted him to deploy them in DC he apparently couldn’t because the mayor didn’t allow him to… It’s got near zero to do with that.
seanmcdirmid 1y ago
How is it compared to New Orleans (34.7) since you mentioned Louisiana? Or Baltimore (58.3 WTF???) which is next door?

woodpanel 1y ago

Sure thing. Here is the list of the top-20 murder-rated cities in the US: St. Louis, MO – Mayor Cara Spencer (DNC), DNC rule 76 years. Baltimore, MD – Mayor Brandon Scott (DNC), DNC rule 56 years. New Orleans, LA – Mayor LaToya Cantrell (DNC), DNC rule 153 years. Detroit, MI – Mayor Mike Duggan (ex DNC), DNC rule 63 years Cleveland, OH – Mayor Justin Bibb (DNC), DNC rule 35 years Las Vegas, NV – Mayor Carolyn Goodman (Husband of ex-DNC mayor), DNC rule 82 years Kansas City, MO – Mayor Quinton Lucas (DNC), DNC rule 34 years Memphis, TN – Mayor Paul Young (DNC), DNC rule 53 years. Newark, NJ – Mayor Ras Baraka (DNC), DNC rule 72 years. Chicago, IL – Mayor Brandon Johnson (DNC), DNC rule 94 years. Cincinnati, OH – Mayor Aftab Pureval (DNC), DNC rule 41 years Philadelphia, PA – Mayor Cherelle Parker (DNC), DNC rule 74 years Milwaukee, WI – Mayor Cavalier Johnson (DNC), DNC rule 65 years Tulsa, OK – Mayor Monroe Nichols (DNC), only outlier in this list with significant non-DNC mayors Pittsburgh, PA – Mayor Ed Gainey (DNC), DNC rule 91 years Indianapolis, IN – Mayor Joe Hogsett (DNC), DNC rule 9 years. Louisville, KY – Mayor Craig Greenberg (DNC), DNC rule 56 years Oakland, CA – Mayor Sheng Thao (DNC), DNC rule 48 years Washington, D.C. – Mayor Muriel Bowser (DNC), DNC rule 64 years Atlanta, GA – Mayor Andre Dickens (DNC), DNC rule 164 years

righthand 1y ago
The DNC doesn’t “rule” over cities. Mayors are not DNC representatives or federally aligned. This is a disingenuous report with no sources and should be held with Extreme skepticism.
- 55555 1y ago
  Obviously you’re right but my god that is a very troubling coincidence…
  - righthand 1y ago
    You honestly believe murder rate is higher in cities because the mayor is a Democrat? Or are cities with Democrat mayors much larger and diverse than Republic mayor cities? Do you think the people in Democrat cities vote in a Democrat mayor because they want more murder? You can read a million different things from a list of items with similar attributes. Especially one compiled without sources or any context of the regions of the US.