5 ms·

I mean I would hardly blame the specific model, Anthropic has a specific mention in their system prompts on trump winning. For some reason llms get confused wit

I mean I would hardly blame the specific model, Anthropic has a specific mention in their system prompts on trump winning. For some reason llms get confused with this one.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
jari_mustonen 1y ago
It's the political bias in the training material. No surprise there.
- regularfry 1y ago
  More likely is that there's a lot of source material having to very stridently assert that Trump didn't win in 2020, and it's generalising to a later year. That's not political bias.
  - ben_w 1y ago
    It's also extremely weird that Trump did win in 2024. If I'd been in a coma from Jan 1 2024 to today, and woke up to people saying Trump was president again, I'd think they were pulling my leg or testing my brain function to see if I'd become gullible.
    - cpursley 1y ago
      You’re in a bubble. It was no surprise to folks who touch grass on the regular.
      - ben_w 1y ago
        > You’re in a bubble. Sure, all I have to go on from the other side of the Atlantic is the internet. So in that regard, kinda like the AI. One of the big surprises from the POV of me in Jan 2024, is that I would have anticipated Trump being in prison and not even available as an option for the Republican party to select as a candidate for office, and that even if he had not gone to jail that the Republicans would not want someone who behaved as he did on Jan 6 2021.
        OldfieldFund 1y ago
        you can run for presidency from prison :)
        exasperaited 1y ago
        And he would have. And might have won. Because his I'm-the-most-innocent-persecuted-person messaging was clearly landing. I am surprised the grandparent poster didn't think Trump's win was at least entirely possible in January 2024, and I am on the same side of the Atlantic. All the indicators were in place. There was basically no chance he'd actually be in prison by November anyway, because he was doing something else extremely successfully: delaying court cases by playing off his obligations to each of them. Back then I thought his chances of winning were above 60%, and the betting markets were never ever really in favour of him losing.
        username332211 1y ago
        I'm pretty sure you are completely correct on the last part. Nobody in Republican management wanted a second Trump term. If the candidate wasn't Trump, Republicans would have had a guaranteed victory. Imagine that infamous debate, but with some 50-year-old youngster facing Joe Biden. It's the White House that wanted Trump to be candidate. They played Republican primary voters like a fiddle by launching a barrage of transparently political prosecutions just as Republican primaries were starting. And then they still lost the general election.
        FrustratedMonky 1y ago
        You think the Democratic White House, manipulated Republicans into Voting for Trump. So it is the Democrats fault we have Trump??? Next Level Cope.
        9rx 1y ago
        > You think the Democratic White House, manipulated Republicans into Voting for Trump. Yes, that is what he thinks. Did you not read the comment? It is, like, uh, right there... He also explained his reasoning: If Trump didn't win the party race, a more compelling option (the so-called "50-year-old youngster") would have instead, which he claims would have guaranteed a Republican win. In other words, what he is saying that the White House was banking on Trump losing the presidency.
      - FrustratedMonky 1y ago
        [flagged]
        collingreen 1y ago
        I've been surprised by a lot of the values that have been put aside for the elections recently, especially when so many of them were yelled about so loudly in the past few elections (not limited to one side but from my perspective one side does seem more severe). It's also been really interesting to watch a bunch of formerly non partisan values become polarizing like rule of law, integrity, corruption, decorum, body autonomy, the constitution, the national debt, global alliances, sexual assault, "family values", and "the American Dream" tm. There has always been this (baffling, to me) concept that most folks vote for a candidate "while holding their nose" but it seems like the proportions are getting wildly out of whack. The pile of bad smells grows tall and the exchange rate seems quite bad. The 2020s have taught me a lot about the reality of civics and what it looks like to try to govern a giant group of strangers. I'm grateful to have lived in the US during a period of stability and safety and (some) shared values. My optimism for retaining that and preventing decline, however, is running very dry.
        9rx 1y ago
        > it is a surprise how many people in the country are supporters of pedophilia. Do you mean ephebophilia? There is no prominent pedophilia movement. The Epstein saga, which is presumably at least somewhat related to what you are referring to, is clearly centred around "almost adults". Assuming that is what you meant, I don't see what is surprising about it. A revolt to the "Teen Mom", "16 and Pregnant" movement was inevitable. People are increasingly growning tired of being shamed for having children.
        FrustratedMonky 1y ago
        I was just referring to the predominant number of cases where Church officials, and Republicans are caught in under-age scandals. It seems like it is coming out of the shadows now, and Republicans are just openly going with it, they like em young and illegal. Epstein is just the case where the 'right' bothered keeping up tabs on it, so now they are clutching their pearls.
    - bavell 1y ago
      Unfortunately, it was predictable given the other "choices"
    - exasperaited 1y ago
      It's not extremely weird at all. I, a British liberal leftie who considers this win one of the signs of the coming apocalypse, can tell you why: Charlie Kirk may be an odious little man but he ran an exceptional ground game, Trump fully captured the Libertarian Party (and amazingly delivered on a promise to them), Trump was well-advised by his son to campaign on Tiktok, etc. etc. Basically what happened is the 2024 version of the "fifty state strategy", except instead of states, they identified micro-communities, particularly among the extremely online, and crafted messages for each of those. Many of which are actually inconsistent -- their messaging to muslim and jewish communities was inconsistent, their messaging to spanish-speaking communities was inconsistent with their mainstream message etc. And then a lot of money was pushed into a few battleground states by Musk's operation. It was a highly technical, broad-spectrum win, built on relentless messaging about persecution etc., and he had the advantage of running against someone he could stereotype very successfully to his base and whose candidacy was late. Another way to look at why it is not extremely weird, is to look at history. Plenty of examples of jailed or exiled monarchs returning to power, failed coup leaders having another go, criminalised leaders returning to elected office, etc., etc. Once it was clear Trump still retained control over the GOP in 2022, his re-election became at least quite likely.
quatonion 1y ago
I think models generally have cognitive dissonance regarding world politics. They are also always constantly shocked when you tell them what date it is, and go very quiet.
- DoctorOetker 1y ago
  can you give some guidelines to achieve the quiting down? they emit less tokens afterward?
diggan 1y ago
I noticed the same when asking various LLMs to summarize and explaining some "Presidential Actions" (from https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/), most of them answer "This is just theoretical, since no such executive actions actually exists, but assuming something like that would happen in the future, it would mean ..." while a few has returned something like "This fictional executive action would be illegal so I cannot summarize the content", even when I provide direct links and they fetch the content themselves. Not exactly sure why that is.

I mean I would hardly blame the specific model, Anthropic has a specific mention in their system prompts on trump winning. For some reason llms get confused with this one.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

jari_mustonen 1y ago

It's the political bias in the training material. No surprise there.

regularfry 1y ago
More likely is that there's a lot of source material having to very stridently assert that Trump didn't win in 2020, and it's generalising to a later year. That's not political bias.
- ben_w 1y ago
  It's also extremely weird that Trump did win in 2024. If I'd been in a coma from Jan 1 2024 to today, and woke up to people saying Trump was president again, I'd think they were pulling my leg or testing my brain function to see if I'd become gullible.
  - cpursley 1y ago
    You’re in a bubble. It was no surprise to folks who touch grass on the regular.
    - ben_w 1y ago
      > You’re in a bubble. Sure, all I have to go on from the other side of the Atlantic is the internet. So in that regard, kinda like the AI. One of the big surprises from the POV of me in Jan 2024, is that I would have anticipated Trump being in prison and not even available as an option for the Republican party to select as a candidate for office, and that even if he had not gone to jail that the Republicans would not want someone who behaved as he did on Jan 6 2021.
      - OldfieldFund 1y ago
        you can run for presidency from prison :)
        exasperaited 1y ago
        And he would have. And might have won. Because his I'm-the-most-innocent-persecuted-person messaging was clearly landing. I am surprised the grandparent poster didn't think Trump's win was at least entirely possible in January 2024, and I am on the same side of the Atlantic. All the indicators were in place. There was basically no chance he'd actually be in prison by November anyway, because he was doing something else extremely successfully: delaying court cases by playing off his obligations to each of them. Back then I thought his chances of winning were above 60%, and the betting markets were never ever really in favour of him losing.
      - username332211 1y ago
        I'm pretty sure you are completely correct on the last part. Nobody in Republican management wanted a second Trump term. If the candidate wasn't Trump, Republicans would have had a guaranteed victory. Imagine that infamous debate, but with some 50-year-old youngster facing Joe Biden. It's the White House that wanted Trump to be candidate. They played Republican primary voters like a fiddle by launching a barrage of transparently political prosecutions just as Republican primaries were starting. And then they still lost the general election.
        FrustratedMonky 1y ago
        You think the Democratic White House, manipulated Republicans into Voting for Trump. So it is the Democrats fault we have Trump??? Next Level Cope.
        9rx 1y ago
        > You think the Democratic White House, manipulated Republicans into Voting for Trump. Yes, that is what he thinks. Did you not read the comment? It is, like, uh, right there... He also explained his reasoning: If Trump didn't win the party race, a more compelling option (the so-called "50-year-old youngster") would have instead, which he claims would have guaranteed a Republican win. In other words, what he is saying that the White House was banking on Trump losing the presidency.
    - FrustratedMonky 1y ago
      [flagged]
      - collingreen 1y ago
        I've been surprised by a lot of the values that have been put aside for the elections recently, especially when so many of them were yelled about so loudly in the past few elections (not limited to one side but from my perspective one side does seem more severe). It's also been really interesting to watch a bunch of formerly non partisan values become polarizing like rule of law, integrity, corruption, decorum, body autonomy, the constitution, the national debt, global alliances, sexual assault, "family values", and "the American Dream" tm. There has always been this (baffling, to me) concept that most folks vote for a candidate "while holding their nose" but it seems like the proportions are getting wildly out of whack. The pile of bad smells grows tall and the exchange rate seems quite bad. The 2020s have taught me a lot about the reality of civics and what it looks like to try to govern a giant group of strangers. I'm grateful to have lived in the US during a period of stability and safety and (some) shared values. My optimism for retaining that and preventing decline, however, is running very dry.
      - 9rx 1y ago
        > it is a surprise how many people in the country are supporters of pedophilia. Do you mean ephebophilia? There is no prominent pedophilia movement. The Epstein saga, which is presumably at least somewhat related to what you are referring to, is clearly centred around "almost adults". Assuming that is what you meant, I don't see what is surprising about it. A revolt to the "Teen Mom", "16 and Pregnant" movement was inevitable. People are increasingly growning tired of being shamed for having children.
        FrustratedMonky 1y ago
        I was just referring to the predominant number of cases where Church officials, and Republicans are caught in under-age scandals. It seems like it is coming out of the shadows now, and Republicans are just openly going with it, they like em young and illegal. Epstein is just the case where the 'right' bothered keeping up tabs on it, so now they are clutching their pearls.
  - bavell 1y ago
    Unfortunately, it was predictable given the other "choices"
  - exasperaited 1y ago
    It's not extremely weird at all. I, a British liberal leftie who considers this win one of the signs of the coming apocalypse, can tell you why: Charlie Kirk may be an odious little man but he ran an exceptional ground game, Trump fully captured the Libertarian Party (and amazingly delivered on a promise to them), Trump was well-advised by his son to campaign on Tiktok, etc. etc. Basically what happened is the 2024 version of the "fifty state strategy", except instead of states, they identified micro-communities, particularly among the extremely online, and crafted messages for each of those. Many of which are actually inconsistent -- their messaging to muslim and jewish communities was inconsistent, their messaging to spanish-speaking communities was inconsistent with their mainstream message etc. And then a lot of money was pushed into a few battleground states by Musk's operation. It was a highly technical, broad-spectrum win, built on relentless messaging about persecution etc., and he had the advantage of running against someone he could stereotype very successfully to his base and whose candidacy was late. Another way to look at why it is not extremely weird, is to look at history. Plenty of examples of jailed or exiled monarchs returning to power, failed coup leaders having another go, criminalised leaders returning to elected office, etc., etc. Once it was clear Trump still retained control over the GOP in 2022, his re-election became at least quite likely.

quatonion 1y ago

I think models generally have cognitive dissonance regarding world politics. They are also always constantly shocked when you tell them what date it is, and go very quiet.

DoctorOetker 1y ago
can you give some guidelines to achieve the quiting down? they emit less tokens afterward?

diggan 1y ago

I noticed the same when asking various LLMs to summarize and explaining some "Presidential Actions" (from https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/), most of them answer "This is just theoretical, since no such executive actions actually exists, but assuming something like that would happen in the future, it would mean ..." while a few has returned something like "This fictional executive action would be illegal so I cannot summarize the content", even when I provide direct links and they fetch the content themselves. Not exactly sure why that is.