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This is just continuing a disturbing trend of lawfare, censorship, and constitutional violations from Brazil’s top courts. Whether it is Trump doing it or Brazi

This is just continuing a disturbing trend of lawfare, censorship, and constitutional violations from Brazil’s top courts. Whether it is Trump doing it or Brazil’s courts, targeting political rivals this way is corrupt and can destabilize society.

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mitchbob 1y ago
If Bolsonaro was responsible for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_January_Bras%C3%ADlia_attacks https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_January_Bras%C3%ADlia_attack... how should a democratic society respond?
- matheusmoreira 1y ago
  Brazil is not a democratic society, it's a dictatorship of the judiciary. Not a single brazilian voted for these judge-kings who also legislate and execute. That "attack" was directly caused by the "activism" of these judge-kings on the eve of the 2022 election. They engaged in blatantly unconstitutional political censorship and disproportionately targeted Bolsonaro and his supporters. Journalists and online influencers were forced to seek political asylum in other countries. It wasn't enough to make a mockery out of our constitution, they also had to brag about it in public. They actually went to public events to showboat about their accomplishments. "We defeated Bolsonarism!" -- Barroso, an "impartial" supreme court judge-king.
  - henry2023 1y ago
    Perhaps you forgot to answer the question.
    - matheusmoreira 1y ago
      There's no point in answering a question whose premises are invalid. The question was predicated on Bolsonaro being responsible for it. He wasn't. He straight up tried to stop those people. There were lots of protests prior to that so called "attack". I saw him trying to call them all off. Numerous times. People protested anyway. Because they understood that Brazil was not a democracy. He is a coward. He did literally nothing while the judge-kings were silencing his supporters with no due process. While people were going to jail in order to protect everything he came to represent, he was in the USA enjoying a vacation as if nothing was happening. He betrayed every single person who ever supported him from the very beginning. And yet people are still assembling in the streets to protest the political unelected supreme court. Whatever Bolsonaro may or may not have started, it's bigger than him now. His current usefulness is limited to the fact Trump apparently likes him enough to sanction the brazilian despots who are persecuting him.
      - lesuorac 1y ago
        > Whatever Bolsonaro may or may not have started, it's bigger than him now. I mean, it's a pretty big deal if he started it or not. Punish crimes or take the laws off the books. https://web.archive.org/web/20230108201723/https://www.businessinsider.com/brazil-bolsonaro-backing-capitol-riot-inspired-coup-former-leaders-warn-2021-9 https://web.archive.org/web/20230108201723/https://www.busin...
        matheusmoreira 1y ago
        There are no laws against protests or the questioning of voting machines in Brazil. Quite the contrary, our constitution is quite explicit in defending political freedom of expression. What are you supposed to do when the supreme court starts violating the law and the constitution? Who are you supposed to turn to? Their abuses started in 2019 with a "fake news" censorship inquisition and by 2021 they were disproportionately censoring Bolsonaro and his supporters for "fake news". Suddenly everything they said was "fake news", even provably true statements. People started to understand the court answered to no one and had itself launched a silent coup against brazilian institutions. That's the "countercoup" messaging in the article you cited. If I had to point out someone as the "mastermind" of all this, I would say it was the supreme court. Society is merely trying to react to their profoundly destabilizing actions. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44748869 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44748869 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39966382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39966382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36543423 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36543423
Daishiman 1y ago
What's the part about this that's lawfare?
- matheusmoreira 1y ago
  The part where the current president's former lawyer is one of the "impartial" judge-kings involved in the case. "We defeated Bolsonarism!" -- Barroso, one of the judge-kings. Is further proof necessary?
  - Daishiman 1y ago
    Yeah, you'll need more than that because the results of the investigations so far are pretty coherent with Bolsonaro's beliefs in democracy as well as all the people who surrounded him.
    - matheusmoreira 1y ago
      I wasn't condemning the investigations into Bolsonaro's affairs at all. I was condemning the court that's judging him. I have no doubt his sentence has already been decided regardless of evidence.
  - nemesisithetic 1y ago
    Proof of what? That your political position is "rambling incoherence"?
    - matheusmoreira 1y ago
      I merely pointed out the painfully obvious impartiality of the court. Nothing incoherent about it. Bolsonaro's guilt has already been decided, they're just going through the motions. Gotta look like a democracy.

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mitchbob 1y ago

If Bolsonaro was responsible for https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_January_Bras%C3%ADlia_attacks https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_January_Bras%C3%ADlia_attack... how should a democratic society respond?

matheusmoreira 1y ago
Brazil is not a democratic society, it's a dictatorship of the judiciary. Not a single brazilian voted for these judge-kings who also legislate and execute. That "attack" was directly caused by the "activism" of these judge-kings on the eve of the 2022 election. They engaged in blatantly unconstitutional political censorship and disproportionately targeted Bolsonaro and his supporters. Journalists and online influencers were forced to seek political asylum in other countries. It wasn't enough to make a mockery out of our constitution, they also had to brag about it in public. They actually went to public events to showboat about their accomplishments. "We defeated Bolsonarism!" -- Barroso, an "impartial" supreme court judge-king.
- henry2023 1y ago
  Perhaps you forgot to answer the question.
  - matheusmoreira 1y ago
    There's no point in answering a question whose premises are invalid. The question was predicated on Bolsonaro being responsible for it. He wasn't. He straight up tried to stop those people. There were lots of protests prior to that so called "attack". I saw him trying to call them all off. Numerous times. People protested anyway. Because they understood that Brazil was not a democracy. He is a coward. He did literally nothing while the judge-kings were silencing his supporters with no due process. While people were going to jail in order to protect everything he came to represent, he was in the USA enjoying a vacation as if nothing was happening. He betrayed every single person who ever supported him from the very beginning. And yet people are still assembling in the streets to protest the political unelected supreme court. Whatever Bolsonaro may or may not have started, it's bigger than him now. His current usefulness is limited to the fact Trump apparently likes him enough to sanction the brazilian despots who are persecuting him.
    - lesuorac 1y ago
      > Whatever Bolsonaro may or may not have started, it's bigger than him now. I mean, it's a pretty big deal if he started it or not. Punish crimes or take the laws off the books. https://web.archive.org/web/20230108201723/https://www.businessinsider.com/brazil-bolsonaro-backing-capitol-riot-inspired-coup-former-leaders-warn-2021-9 https://web.archive.org/web/20230108201723/https://www.busin...
      - matheusmoreira 1y ago
        There are no laws against protests or the questioning of voting machines in Brazil. Quite the contrary, our constitution is quite explicit in defending political freedom of expression. What are you supposed to do when the supreme court starts violating the law and the constitution? Who are you supposed to turn to? Their abuses started in 2019 with a "fake news" censorship inquisition and by 2021 they were disproportionately censoring Bolsonaro and his supporters for "fake news". Suddenly everything they said was "fake news", even provably true statements. People started to understand the court answered to no one and had itself launched a silent coup against brazilian institutions. That's the "countercoup" messaging in the article you cited. If I had to point out someone as the "mastermind" of all this, I would say it was the supreme court. Society is merely trying to react to their profoundly destabilizing actions. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44748869 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44748869 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39966382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39966382 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36543423 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36543423

Daishiman 1y ago

What's the part about this that's lawfare?

matheusmoreira 1y ago
The part where the current president's former lawyer is one of the "impartial" judge-kings involved in the case. "We defeated Bolsonarism!" -- Barroso, one of the judge-kings. Is further proof necessary?
- Daishiman 1y ago
  Yeah, you'll need more than that because the results of the investigations so far are pretty coherent with Bolsonaro's beliefs in democracy as well as all the people who surrounded him.
  - matheusmoreira 1y ago
    I wasn't condemning the investigations into Bolsonaro's affairs at all. I was condemning the court that's judging him. I have no doubt his sentence has already been decided regardless of evidence.
- nemesisithetic 1y ago
  Proof of what? That your political position is "rambling incoherence"?
  - matheusmoreira 1y ago
    I merely pointed out the painfully obvious impartiality of the court. Nothing incoherent about it. Bolsonaro's guilt has already been decided, they're just going through the motions. Gotta look like a democracy.