4 ms·

Java is more akin to the Corolla. Utterly insipid (by design), lacking in refinements compared to competitors like the Mazda3, and made for people who just see

Java is more akin to the Corolla. Utterly insipid (by design), lacking in refinements compared to competitors like the Mazda3, and made for people who just see it as a way to get from point A to point B. PHP is the Hyundai Elantra of programming. It used to be popular because of low adoption costs but was the butt of jokes for a long time because of its questionable design and poor reliability. But like the Elantra, it has come a long way and is actually decent these days.

Freedom2 1y ago
Modern Java is quite good these days, no? Type inference, fibers, text blocks, records... I agree if we were talking about Java 8 (and I have no doubt a lot of people are still unfortunately using that), but I wouldn't mind a modern Java setup as much as I would have in the past.
- dionian 1y ago
  The JVM and its ecosystem are the best thing about the Java platform. Not the language, i dont even use it anymore and i am nearly 100% JVM based. But even then its still not horrible. it's just that there are better options like Scala.
- perching_aix 1y ago
  Pretty funny you mention Java 8 as a negative example, I remember it being widely heralded as a step in the right direction that was a long time coming and a breath of fresh air.
  - CamouflagedKiwi 1y ago
    I think they just mean that newer versions are further steps in that direction, not that Java 8 was a step the wrong way.
  - earnestinger 1y ago
    Yup. Java 1.8 is humongous leap to the right direction.
catigula 1y ago
This is very ignorant of a modern Corolla in a lot of ways. As an example, since 2023, the standard base level Corolla has an automated suite of driving assistance technologies that blow away anything Mazda offers even at their highest level of expense. There is only one car that passed testing for automatic emergency braking from 62mph to a dead-stop (future standard) - the Toyota Corolla.
- maxerickson 1y ago
  The sibling comment is defending what Java has grown into also.
- kube-system 1y ago
  The modern Corolla, like most competitive cars, is a good, safe, high-quality, reliable car. These qualities aren't at odds with being "insipid". The Corolla interior feels utilitarian, its features are spartan, and the driving dynamics are... behaved. It does exactly what a transportation device needs to do, and it does them quite well. However, neither excitement nor flavor were in the design criteria.
  - catigula 1y ago
    The characterization was still incorrect. The Corolla has better implementations of modern features than the Mazda3, it's simply not as flashy.
    - kube-system 1y ago
      The word "insipid" doesn't really have anything to do with being a "good implementation" or not.
      - catigula 1y ago
        Right, which is why you're focusing on it rather than the two other claims made. >lacking in refinements compared to competitors like the Mazda3, and made for people who just see it as a way to get from point A to point B. Of course, I also disagree that it is insipid, that's also inaccurate vis-a-vis modern Toyota, but that's a different discussion.
Reubachi 1y ago
Great analogy, horrible example in the analogy heh. (Hate to nitpick) Of the two, Mazda3 would be the "less frills, cheaper, works", especially in 2025. I also don't recall a period of lack of trust for corolla due to design/repair ability; My great uncle always talks about his "first real, new car" being a 69 corolla that was a workhorse. That paved the way for the JP takeover by the late 80s.
antisthenes 1y ago
You are great with analogies. Can you tell me which car is Python, so I can add it to my shopping list?
- addaon 1y ago
  > Can you tell me which car is Python, so I can add it to my shopping list? The Hummer H3. When the Hummer came out it did a few things exceptionally well — better than anything else — although there were plenty of areas (speed, aesthetics) where it was crap. It was popular, so they made a later version riding on the name that was incompatible with the original mission, hoping that the folks who had aspired to the first version would continue along; and somehow it worked.
- culopatin 1y ago
  A Mercedes Benz sprinter. It’s being used for everything. From simple delivery to nerdy camping. Not the fastest, but has loads of modularity and can work as a daily, work truck or leisure.
  - tstenner 1y ago
    I'd say the sprinter is more like Fortran. You use it when you need to move around lots of stuff and although it's quite fast on its own, you would drive it neither for fun nor when you only have a few things to move around.
slt2021 1y ago
Java is more like Ford F-150 than Corolla
smrtinsert 1y ago
Java is more like the Honda. It's literally everywhere, ultra reliable, sufficiently boring technology that people can't stand to look at it because it simply makes no statement about anything, and despite all attempts to replace it or dethrone it, it continues to excel and grow.
Grazester 1y ago
Long gone are Days that the Corolla was bare bones and even then it was better than what the Mazda 323 had to offer
- linkage 1y ago
  I drove a 2009 Corolla SE for 3 years of my life. Its _only_ redeeming quality was that maintenance and repair bills were minimal. Besides that, it was sluggish on the highway, handled like a shopping cart, unstable at 140 km/h, and had an interior that would never let you forget that you’re poor. Toyota is incapable of making a fun car - it’s just not in their DNA. That’s why all of their current sports cars are made by other companies (Subaru and BMW).

Freedom2 1y ago

Modern Java is quite good these days, no? Type inference, fibers, text blocks, records... I agree if we were talking about Java 8 (and I have no doubt a lot of people are still unfortunately using that), but I wouldn't mind a modern Java setup as much as I would have in the past.

dionian 1y ago
The JVM and its ecosystem are the best thing about the Java platform. Not the language, i dont even use it anymore and i am nearly 100% JVM based. But even then its still not horrible. it's just that there are better options like Scala.
perching_aix 1y ago
Pretty funny you mention Java 8 as a negative example, I remember it being widely heralded as a step in the right direction that was a long time coming and a breath of fresh air.
- CamouflagedKiwi 1y ago
  I think they just mean that newer versions are further steps in that direction, not that Java 8 was a step the wrong way.
- earnestinger 1y ago
  Yup. Java 1.8 is humongous leap to the right direction.

catigula 1y ago

This is very ignorant of a modern Corolla in a lot of ways. As an example, since 2023, the standard base level Corolla has an automated suite of driving assistance technologies that blow away anything Mazda offers even at their highest level of expense. There is only one car that passed testing for automatic emergency braking from 62mph to a dead-stop (future standard) - the Toyota Corolla.

maxerickson 1y ago
The sibling comment is defending what Java has grown into also.
kube-system 1y ago
The modern Corolla, like most competitive cars, is a good, safe, high-quality, reliable car. These qualities aren't at odds with being "insipid". The Corolla interior feels utilitarian, its features are spartan, and the driving dynamics are... behaved. It does exactly what a transportation device needs to do, and it does them quite well. However, neither excitement nor flavor were in the design criteria.
- catigula 1y ago
  The characterization was still incorrect. The Corolla has better implementations of modern features than the Mazda3, it's simply not as flashy.
  - kube-system 1y ago
    The word "insipid" doesn't really have anything to do with being a "good implementation" or not.
    - catigula 1y ago
      Right, which is why you're focusing on it rather than the two other claims made. >lacking in refinements compared to competitors like the Mazda3, and made for people who just see it as a way to get from point A to point B. Of course, I also disagree that it is insipid, that's also inaccurate vis-a-vis modern Toyota, but that's a different discussion.

Reubachi 1y ago

Great analogy, horrible example in the analogy heh. (Hate to nitpick) Of the two, Mazda3 would be the "less frills, cheaper, works", especially in 2025. I also don't recall a period of lack of trust for corolla due to design/repair ability; My great uncle always talks about his "first real, new car" being a 69 corolla that was a workhorse. That paved the way for the JP takeover by the late 80s.

antisthenes 1y ago

You are great with analogies. Can you tell me which car is Python, so I can add it to my shopping list?

addaon 1y ago
> Can you tell me which car is Python, so I can add it to my shopping list? The Hummer H3. When the Hummer came out it did a few things exceptionally well — better than anything else — although there were plenty of areas (speed, aesthetics) where it was crap. It was popular, so they made a later version riding on the name that was incompatible with the original mission, hoping that the folks who had aspired to the first version would continue along; and somehow it worked.
culopatin 1y ago
A Mercedes Benz sprinter. It’s being used for everything. From simple delivery to nerdy camping. Not the fastest, but has loads of modularity and can work as a daily, work truck or leisure.
- tstenner 1y ago
  I'd say the sprinter is more like Fortran. You use it when you need to move around lots of stuff and although it's quite fast on its own, you would drive it neither for fun nor when you only have a few things to move around.

slt2021 1y ago

Java is more like Ford F-150 than Corolla

smrtinsert 1y ago

Java is more like the Honda. It's literally everywhere, ultra reliable, sufficiently boring technology that people can't stand to look at it because it simply makes no statement about anything, and despite all attempts to replace it or dethrone it, it continues to excel and grow.

Grazester 1y ago

Long gone are Days that the Corolla was bare bones and even then it was better than what the Mazda 323 had to offer

linkage 1y ago
I drove a 2009 Corolla SE for 3 years of my life. Its _only_ redeeming quality was that maintenance and repair bills were minimal. Besides that, it was sluggish on the highway, handled like a shopping cart, unstable at 140 km/h, and had an interior that would never let you forget that you’re poor. Toyota is incapable of making a fun car - it’s just not in their DNA. That’s why all of their current sports cars are made by other companies (Subaru and BMW).