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My experience with AI seems to be totally different than for most people. As an example, the other day asks chatgpt to write a configuration file for SQL fluff

My experience with AI seems to be totally different than for most people. As an example, the other day asks chatgpt to write a configuration file for SQL fluff that formatted the code as an example that I provided. It proceeded to invent all the SQL fluff rules. And the ones that were actual rules were useless for the actual format that I wanted. I get it, SQLFluff rules are really confusing, but that's why I asked for help. I know how to code python I don't need AI to write code that then I will need to review

troupo 1y ago
> My experience with AI seems to be totally different than for most people. It's not different from most people. Everyone runs into AI bullshit. However, hype and new tech optimism overrides everything.
- danielbln 1y ago
  Or, you know, there are different ways of using these tools. Slapping something into ChatGPT is one way, though maybe not the most efficient way of getting value out of these tools.
  - gonzalohm 1y ago
    So what should I have done differently? If I have to spend 1 hour to setup the AI tools then I'm not saving any time
    - danielbln 1y ago
      Using an agentic coding assistant would be the first step (there are many, Cline, Claude Code, Gemini CLI and various others) as those can traverse the code base, execute tests, run queries or web search and feed the outputs back into itself to validate correctness of whatever the agent has created/done. You won't need to set up this stuff for an hour every time, you set it up once and then you just give it commands. The skill ceiling is deceptive, it feels very low at first (after all, it's just natural language, right?) but getting an intuition for where these tools work best and where they break down, how to task them, what to include in the instructions, it takes a bit of using them first. That said, if you're a code maximalist, if you get most enjoyment out of hand crafting code or of you don't feel comfortable communicating effectively or delegating work, then maybe these tools aren't for you. At this point in time I'm also pretty much over proselytizing anyone, I get a TON of value out of this stuff, but everbody has to find their own workflows.
      - gonzalohm 1y ago
        How would adding my codebase help when I literally was starting from scratch and that's why I needed the configuration file?
  - troupo 1y ago
    > Or, you know, there are different ways of using these tools. There aren't. Every new "one true way of doing it" that changes every few days runs into these problems.
    - danielbln 1y ago
      Every iteration of the tools improves the output quality, many of the problems from a year ago are not problems today.
      - troupo 1y ago
        And new problems appear. This remains a fact of life: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44702776 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44702776
        danielbln 1y ago
        Definitely, but isn't that progress? We solve problems and new problems appear, which we also solve. Rinse and repeat until the sun blows up.
        troupo 1y ago
        > Definitely, but isn't that progress? That is beside the point of the original comment > We solve problems and new problems appear, which we also solve. In AI space these are not new problems. These are the same "let's try this new magic incantation agains a non-deterministic black box".
        danielbln 1y ago
        Ok man, you do you. I'm over here making food use of this tooling, but it's not for everyone. Agree to disagree.
        troupo 1y ago
scotty79 1y ago
I think that's a very common experience when you try to make it write niche stuff. It just makes everything up wholesale. If you on the other hand wanted to write a react app ...
- gonzalohm 1y ago
  But then I may as well have the AI say no, I don't know how to do that, here are some useful resources. Instead of misleading me and making me waste my time figuring out why the code doesn't work
  - PessimalDecimal 1y ago
    Maybe that idea has probably been considered (a lot) and never implemented because the can't tell?
  - scotty79 1y ago
    We might get there at some point. But it's not natural for this technology. It wasn't trained to recognize what it does and doesn't know. But I'm hopeful. It was terrible at doing math as well and it's getting significantly better with just more effort. It might be hard to tune it though so that AI won't claim that it doesn't know something when it does, by error, or just because it doesn't like you. It's not uncommon for a student to say they don't know something they actually do when they are questioned.
theshrike79 1y ago
There was a post somewhere that said if an AI invents a method or rule for something, it actually should be there. =) It's a statistical prediction machine and it says your library should have a do_foo function. Is there a reason why it doesn't have one?

troupo 1y ago

> My experience with AI seems to be totally different than for most people. It's not different from most people. Everyone runs into AI bullshit. However, hype and new tech optimism overrides everything.

danielbln 1y ago
Or, you know, there are different ways of using these tools. Slapping something into ChatGPT is one way, though maybe not the most efficient way of getting value out of these tools.
- gonzalohm 1y ago
  So what should I have done differently? If I have to spend 1 hour to setup the AI tools then I'm not saving any time
  - danielbln 1y ago
    Using an agentic coding assistant would be the first step (there are many, Cline, Claude Code, Gemini CLI and various others) as those can traverse the code base, execute tests, run queries or web search and feed the outputs back into itself to validate correctness of whatever the agent has created/done. You won't need to set up this stuff for an hour every time, you set it up once and then you just give it commands. The skill ceiling is deceptive, it feels very low at first (after all, it's just natural language, right?) but getting an intuition for where these tools work best and where they break down, how to task them, what to include in the instructions, it takes a bit of using them first. That said, if you're a code maximalist, if you get most enjoyment out of hand crafting code or of you don't feel comfortable communicating effectively or delegating work, then maybe these tools aren't for you. At this point in time I'm also pretty much over proselytizing anyone, I get a TON of value out of this stuff, but everbody has to find their own workflows.
    - gonzalohm 1y ago
      How would adding my codebase help when I literally was starting from scratch and that's why I needed the configuration file?
- troupo 1y ago
  > Or, you know, there are different ways of using these tools. There aren't. Every new "one true way of doing it" that changes every few days runs into these problems.
  - danielbln 1y ago
    Every iteration of the tools improves the output quality, many of the problems from a year ago are not problems today.
    - troupo 1y ago
      And new problems appear. This remains a fact of life: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44702776 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44702776
      - danielbln 1y ago
        Definitely, but isn't that progress? We solve problems and new problems appear, which we also solve. Rinse and repeat until the sun blows up.
        troupo 1y ago
        > Definitely, but isn't that progress? That is beside the point of the original comment > We solve problems and new problems appear, which we also solve. In AI space these are not new problems. These are the same "let's try this new magic incantation agains a non-deterministic black box".
        danielbln 1y ago
        Ok man, you do you. I'm over here making food use of this tooling, but it's not for everyone. Agree to disagree.
        troupo 1y ago

scotty79 1y ago

I think that's a very common experience when you try to make it write niche stuff. It just makes everything up wholesale. If you on the other hand wanted to write a react app ...

gonzalohm 1y ago
But then I may as well have the AI say no, I don't know how to do that, here are some useful resources. Instead of misleading me and making me waste my time figuring out why the code doesn't work
- PessimalDecimal 1y ago
  Maybe that idea has probably been considered (a lot) and never implemented because the can't tell?
- scotty79 1y ago
  We might get there at some point. But it's not natural for this technology. It wasn't trained to recognize what it does and doesn't know. But I'm hopeful. It was terrible at doing math as well and it's getting significantly better with just more effort. It might be hard to tune it though so that AI won't claim that it doesn't know something when it does, by error, or just because it doesn't like you. It's not uncommon for a student to say they don't know something they actually do when they are questioned.

theshrike79 1y ago

There was a post somewhere that said if an AI invents a method or rule for something, it actually should be there. =) It's a statistical prediction machine and it says your library should have a do_foo function. Is there a reason why it doesn't have one?