4 ms·

I'm happy to let people think that AI does not yield productivity gains. There is no point engaging on this topic, so I will just outwork/outperform them.

kubb 1y ago
Good luck getting paid more for your improved performance :D
- stronglikedan 1y ago
  No one gets paid more to get the same job done, unless you count free time as compensation.
- some_random 1y ago
  If they're right in their belief that AI usage leads to significantly more performance, their compensation is that they will keep their job.
  - bluefirebrand 1y ago
    "You get to keep your job" is the worst consolation prize I can imagine
- nayshins 1y ago
  I get paid a lot already.
  - kubb 1y ago
    Then enjoy demonstrating your AI-supercharged productivity advantage over your inferior peers, I think they'll love that.
    - nayshins 1y ago
      Turns out that I spend a lot of my spare time teaching others how to use them effectively. My goal is to help as many people become experts at this as I can.
hooverd 1y ago
Crazy how productivity gains just lead to more work for you.
- stronglikedan 1y ago
  Crazy how people would let their managers know they could get more done, instead of getting the same amount done quicker and having more free time.
  - gishglish 1y ago
    If I was genuinely getting more free time, I’d be more amenable to this line of thought, but RTO put the nail in that coffin.
- bluefirebrand 1y ago
  This is actually worth talking about imo There is nothing in it for me, if I am more productive but earn the same and don't get any more time off Why should I bother at that point?
  - cableshaft 1y ago
    Relevant Office Space movie scene: https://youtu.be/to_e1N4xovQ?si=V6EVep8WqJ8zWisG https://youtu.be/to_e1N4xovQ?si=V6EVep8WqJ8zWisG
    - bluefirebrand 1y ago
      Yep, I'm ready to be management
  - CharlesW 1y ago
    The question is what happens when you're half as productive as everyone around you.
    - bluefirebrand 1y ago
troupo 1y ago
> I'm happy to let people think that AI does not yield productivity gains. vs. --- start quote --- In a randomised controlled trial – the first of its kind – experienced computer programmers could use AI tools to help them write code. --- end quote --- Your quote is very representative of the magical wishful thinking most people have about AI: https://dmitriid.com/everything-around-llms-is-still-magical-and-wishful-thinking https://dmitriid.com/everything-around-llms-is-still-magical...
- refulgentis 1y ago
  (not op) Gosh, I was conflicted, then you pulled out that sentence and I was convinced. :) Alternatively: When faced with a contradiction, first, check your premises. I don't want to belabor the point too much, there's little common ground if we're at all or nothing thinking - "the study proved AI is net-negative because of this pull quote" isn't discussion.
- simonw 1y ago
  "Your quote is very representative of the magical wishful thinking most people have about AI" Your comment here is very representative of how quickly people who are AI skeptics will jump on anything that supports their skepticism.
  - ofjcihen 1y ago
    I don’t think the snark is warranted here. The person you’re responding to is linking an article dealing with that issue and the title is what they mentioned. Edit: SimonW? Really? I didn’t see the name but I didn’t expect you to be like that.
    - refulgentis 1y ago
      Not OP, not sure what you mean but curious. - Snark? - Is "the issue" that anyone who claims any productivity gain is using magical thinking? - How does the linked article "deal with" "the issue"? - What title did they mention? - What did they link to that has that title? > Edit: SimonW? Really? I didn’t see the name but I didn’t expect you to be like that. Like what? I think you're getting a bit emotional & personal here, I don't read anything remotely inappropriate into Simon's comment. Been here 15 years. OP's was odd for HN in that it admits 0 argument: if you think you have productivity gains, it's magical thinking.
gishglish 1y ago
> so I will just outwork/outperform them. At the game of producing garbage slop? Probably yeah.
quxbar 1y ago
I now have the pleasure of giving exercises to candidates where they are explicitly allowed to use any AI or autocomplete that they want, but it's one of those tricky real-world problems where you'll only get yourself into trouble if you only follow the model's suggestions. It really separates the builders from the bureaucrats far more effectively than seeing who can whiteboard or leetcode.
- yomismoaqui 1y ago
  That's really interesting... can you give more details about the problem you are using? This sounds like in there will be a race between this kind of booby trap tests and AIs learning them.
  - gritzko 1y ago
    Long-tail problems are not reiterated in the dataset. Making LLM remember that can be difficult.
- elpakal 1y ago
  Some code challenge platforms allow for seeing how often someone pasted things in. That's been interesting.
- arealaccount 1y ago
  Interesting, care to elaborate? Or this is a carefully guarded secret?
  - raydev 1y ago
    Not sharing what our coding questions are, but we also allow LLMs now. Interviewees choice to do so. In quite a few interviews in the last year I have come away convinced that they would have performed far better if they had relied on their own knowledge/experience exclusively. Fumbling with windows/tabs, not quite reading what they are copying, if I ask why they chose something, some of them would fold immediately and opt for something way better or more sensible, implying they would have known what to do had they bothered to actually think for a moment. I put down "no hire" for all of them of course.
Lionga 1y ago
If you are so happy to let people think that AI does not yield productivity gains, why comment here? How exactly did you outperform? Show, don't talk.
- nayshins 1y ago
  I rolled out a migration to 60+ backends by using Claude code to manage it in the background. Simultaneously, I worked on other features while keeping my usual meeting load. I have more commits and releases per week than I have had in my whole career, which is objectively more productive.
  - bluefirebrand 1y ago
    If you are producing much lower quality then no, it is not objectively more productive
    - nayshins 1y ago
      If you find yourself working at the same place as me, feel free to judge my work, but until then, enjoy speculating.
  - ajaisjdh 1y ago
    > I rolled out a migration to 60+ backends How is anyone supposed to understand what this means? Given the ambiguity in your description and lack of actual code it’s hard to take you seriously.
    - seszett 1y ago
      Sometimes when I read such meaningless things my first reaction is to feel like I'm too ignorant to understand what the person says. But then when I really think about it usually they're just bullshitting out being purposefully vague, using terms that don't mean anything precise in order to avoid actual criticism.
  - dkn 1y ago
haswell 1y ago
The issue I have with comments like this one is the one-dimensional notion of value described as "productivity gains" for a single person. There are many things in this world that could be fairly described as "more productive" or "faster" than the norm, yet few people would argue that it makes those things a net benefit. You can lie and cheat your way to success, and that tends to be successful too. There are good reasons society frowns on this. To me, focusing only on "I'm more productive" while ignoring the systemic and societal factors impacted by that "productivity" is completely missing the forest for the trees. The fact that you further feel that there isn't even a point in engaging on the topic is disturbing considering those ignored factors.
masfuerte 1y ago
Yet here you are, engaging.
- nayshins 1y ago
  the art of the bait
skeeter2020 1y ago
>> so I will just outwork/outperform them. actually based on your own admission this is not what you're doing...
throwawayqqq11 1y ago
Green or naturally grown brown field projects? People who boast about AI enhanced productivity seem to always forget to mention.
thefz 1y ago
Until you will not have access to it and be outperformed by people used to thinking every day.
archagon 1y ago
Uh, and who are you, exactly?

kubb 1y ago

Good luck getting paid more for your improved performance :D

stronglikedan 1y ago
No one gets paid more to get the same job done, unless you count free time as compensation.
some_random 1y ago
If they're right in their belief that AI usage leads to significantly more performance, their compensation is that they will keep their job.
- bluefirebrand 1y ago
  "You get to keep your job" is the worst consolation prize I can imagine
nayshins 1y ago
I get paid a lot already.
- kubb 1y ago
  Then enjoy demonstrating your AI-supercharged productivity advantage over your inferior peers, I think they'll love that.
  - nayshins 1y ago
    Turns out that I spend a lot of my spare time teaching others how to use them effectively. My goal is to help as many people become experts at this as I can.

hooverd 1y ago

Crazy how productivity gains just lead to more work for you.

stronglikedan 1y ago
Crazy how people would let their managers know they could get more done, instead of getting the same amount done quicker and having more free time.
- gishglish 1y ago
  If I was genuinely getting more free time, I’d be more amenable to this line of thought, but RTO put the nail in that coffin.
bluefirebrand 1y ago
This is actually worth talking about imo There is nothing in it for me, if I am more productive but earn the same and don't get any more time off Why should I bother at that point?
- cableshaft 1y ago
  Relevant Office Space movie scene: https://youtu.be/to_e1N4xovQ?si=V6EVep8WqJ8zWisG https://youtu.be/to_e1N4xovQ?si=V6EVep8WqJ8zWisG
  - bluefirebrand 1y ago
    Yep, I'm ready to be management
- CharlesW 1y ago
  The question is what happens when you're half as productive as everyone around you.
  - bluefirebrand 1y ago

troupo 1y ago

> I'm happy to let people think that AI does not yield productivity gains. vs. --- start quote --- In a randomised controlled trial – the first of its kind – experienced computer programmers could use AI tools to help them write code. --- end quote --- Your quote is very representative of the magical wishful thinking most people have about AI: https://dmitriid.com/everything-around-llms-is-still-magical-and-wishful-thinking https://dmitriid.com/everything-around-llms-is-still-magical...

refulgentis 1y ago
(not op) Gosh, I was conflicted, then you pulled out that sentence and I was convinced. :) Alternatively: When faced with a contradiction, first, check your premises. I don't want to belabor the point too much, there's little common ground if we're at all or nothing thinking - "the study proved AI is net-negative because of this pull quote" isn't discussion.
simonw 1y ago
"Your quote is very representative of the magical wishful thinking most people have about AI" Your comment here is very representative of how quickly people who are AI skeptics will jump on anything that supports their skepticism.
- ofjcihen 1y ago
  I don’t think the snark is warranted here. The person you’re responding to is linking an article dealing with that issue and the title is what they mentioned. Edit: SimonW? Really? I didn’t see the name but I didn’t expect you to be like that.
  - refulgentis 1y ago
    Not OP, not sure what you mean but curious. - Snark? - Is "the issue" that anyone who claims any productivity gain is using magical thinking? - How does the linked article "deal with" "the issue"? - What title did they mention? - What did they link to that has that title? > Edit: SimonW? Really? I didn’t see the name but I didn’t expect you to be like that. Like what? I think you're getting a bit emotional & personal here, I don't read anything remotely inappropriate into Simon's comment. Been here 15 years. OP's was odd for HN in that it admits 0 argument: if you think you have productivity gains, it's magical thinking.

gishglish 1y ago

> so I will just outwork/outperform them. At the game of producing garbage slop? Probably yeah.

quxbar 1y ago

I now have the pleasure of giving exercises to candidates where they are explicitly allowed to use any AI or autocomplete that they want, but it's one of those tricky real-world problems where you'll only get yourself into trouble if you only follow the model's suggestions. It really separates the builders from the bureaucrats far more effectively than seeing who can whiteboard or leetcode.

yomismoaqui 1y ago
That's really interesting... can you give more details about the problem you are using? This sounds like in there will be a race between this kind of booby trap tests and AIs learning them.
- gritzko 1y ago
  Long-tail problems are not reiterated in the dataset. Making LLM remember that can be difficult.
elpakal 1y ago
Some code challenge platforms allow for seeing how often someone pasted things in. That's been interesting.
arealaccount 1y ago
Interesting, care to elaborate? Or this is a carefully guarded secret?
- raydev 1y ago
  Not sharing what our coding questions are, but we also allow LLMs now. Interviewees choice to do so. In quite a few interviews in the last year I have come away convinced that they would have performed far better if they had relied on their own knowledge/experience exclusively. Fumbling with windows/tabs, not quite reading what they are copying, if I ask why they chose something, some of them would fold immediately and opt for something way better or more sensible, implying they would have known what to do had they bothered to actually think for a moment. I put down "no hire" for all of them of course.

Lionga 1y ago

If you are so happy to let people think that AI does not yield productivity gains, why comment here? How exactly did you outperform? Show, don't talk.

nayshins 1y ago
I rolled out a migration to 60+ backends by using Claude code to manage it in the background. Simultaneously, I worked on other features while keeping my usual meeting load. I have more commits and releases per week than I have had in my whole career, which is objectively more productive.
- bluefirebrand 1y ago
  If you are producing much lower quality then no, it is not objectively more productive
  - nayshins 1y ago
    If you find yourself working at the same place as me, feel free to judge my work, but until then, enjoy speculating.
- ajaisjdh 1y ago
  > I rolled out a migration to 60+ backends How is anyone supposed to understand what this means? Given the ambiguity in your description and lack of actual code it’s hard to take you seriously.
  - seszett 1y ago
    Sometimes when I read such meaningless things my first reaction is to feel like I'm too ignorant to understand what the person says. But then when I really think about it usually they're just bullshitting out being purposefully vague, using terms that don't mean anything precise in order to avoid actual criticism.
- dkn 1y ago

haswell 1y ago

The issue I have with comments like this one is the one-dimensional notion of value described as "productivity gains" for a single person. There are many things in this world that could be fairly described as "more productive" or "faster" than the norm, yet few people would argue that it makes those things a net benefit. You can lie and cheat your way to success, and that tends to be successful too. There are good reasons society frowns on this. To me, focusing only on "I'm more productive" while ignoring the systemic and societal factors impacted by that "productivity" is completely missing the forest for the trees. The fact that you further feel that there isn't even a point in engaging on the topic is disturbing considering those ignored factors.

masfuerte 1y ago

Yet here you are, engaging.

nayshins 1y ago
the art of the bait

skeeter2020 1y ago

>> so I will just outwork/outperform them. actually based on your own admission this is not what you're doing...

throwawayqqq11 1y ago

Green or naturally grown brown field projects? People who boast about AI enhanced productivity seem to always forget to mention.

thefz 1y ago

Until you will not have access to it and be outperformed by people used to thinking every day.

archagon 1y ago

Uh, and who are you, exactly?