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Weird. Most cooking is about temperature control. Funny thing to ban the technique which is so effective.

by 0cf8612b2e1e 1y ago

tptacek 1y ago
That a sous vide rack of ribs could win a competition to me speaks to the artificiality of competition BBQ.
- sumeno 1y ago
  A car could win a bike race too
  - 0cf8612b2e1e 1y ago
    I naively thought it was about delivering the best plate of food, regardless of equipment and technique. A “rib” competition, not a “smoker” competition.
- kasey_junk 1y ago
  Yes? It lowers the degree of difficulty tremendously. And most people, even bbq judges, probably can’t taste the difference between a sous vide with smoke finish and a full smoker preparation. But bbq competitions are about making the best ribs the same way car racing is about going around an oval the fastest. Equipment rules matter more than bare outcomes.
  - tptacek 1y ago
    I get what you're saying but I don't just mean that it's unsporting or defeats the purpose of the conversation, but rather that it suggests the outcomes are judged on a rubric that doesn't capture what makes extremely good BBQ good, but rather basic textural and visual things. Like, Green Street in Chicago is, IIRC, combi-cooked before it's smoked; it's also just OK.
    - kasey_junk 1y ago
      I think we probably disagree on the impact of the sous vide preparation then. Green street is just ok for lots of reasons. I don’t think the sous vide is one of them.
      - tptacek 1y ago
        Interesting. You've had sous vide BBQ where you were like, "this is as good as anything I've ever had"?
        kasey_junk 1y ago
        Yes. By people who compete in bbq competitions. I’d also argue that most smoker designs are a matter of tradition and competition rules, not outcomes.
    - cogman10 1y ago
      Food judging will always be subjective. Famously wine tasting is mostly just pretentious bunk. That's why silly things like plating often matter more in a restaurant than actual taste.
      - deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
      - computably 1y ago
        IIRC, wine tasting isn't bunk, wine pricing is. People can tell the differences between wines, and reasonably reliably if they are trained, but those differences (and the tasters' preferences) have weak/no correlations with $$$.
        cogman10 1y ago
        Not as much as you'd think. In this article [1], one expert failed to identify that a white wine dyed red was the same. They used different descriptors for the same wine. And none of this should be too surprising. Our brains are complex things that like to hallucinate details. If you tell someone a bottle of wine cost $1000, their brain will happily invent reasons why it's one of the best wines they've tasted. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-tasting-junk-science-analysis https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-ta...
- BuyMyBitcoins 1y ago
  If they’re trying to measure skill, I can understand the rationale. The competition is more of a spectacle than an attempt at finding the most reliable and best tasting rib making process. Imagine a glassblowing competition where participants were judged on how consistently they could make a certain piece. The people using moulds would end up winning, and they would do so with a fraction of the skill and effort.
- spiralcoaster 1y ago
  You are really this shocked that some competitions ban certain methods of achieving the goal? Are you shocked that traditional wood chopping competitions ban chainsaws?
  - tptacek 1y ago
    No, my surprise has nothing to do with fairness and everything to do with how unlikely I feel it is that circulated ribs would hold up to ribs smoked end-to-end. But people downthread with more information disagree, so...
0_____0 1y ago
I wonder if it's banned simply because it doesn't feel enough like BBQ. Similar to why FIA banned CVTs in racing. It's kind of arbitrary but also I get it. Racing and BBQ have culture behind them, and dare I say 'vibes' that their practitioners will want to retain.
- 0cf8612b2e1e 1y ago
  I would be a bit disappointed if I went to a BBQ and saw them pull up a big tub of water in which they dumped the meat. My caveman brain wants to see fire.

Weird. Most cooking is about temperature control. Funny thing to ban the technique which is so effective.

tptacek 1y ago

That a sous vide rack of ribs could win a competition to me speaks to the artificiality of competition BBQ.

sumeno 1y ago
A car could win a bike race too
- 0cf8612b2e1e 1y ago
  I naively thought it was about delivering the best plate of food, regardless of equipment and technique. A “rib” competition, not a “smoker” competition.
kasey_junk 1y ago
Yes? It lowers the degree of difficulty tremendously. And most people, even bbq judges, probably can’t taste the difference between a sous vide with smoke finish and a full smoker preparation. But bbq competitions are about making the best ribs the same way car racing is about going around an oval the fastest. Equipment rules matter more than bare outcomes.
- tptacek 1y ago
  I get what you're saying but I don't just mean that it's unsporting or defeats the purpose of the conversation, but rather that it suggests the outcomes are judged on a rubric that doesn't capture what makes extremely good BBQ good, but rather basic textural and visual things. Like, Green Street in Chicago is, IIRC, combi-cooked before it's smoked; it's also just OK.
  - kasey_junk 1y ago
    I think we probably disagree on the impact of the sous vide preparation then. Green street is just ok for lots of reasons. I don’t think the sous vide is one of them.
    - tptacek 1y ago
      Interesting. You've had sous vide BBQ where you were like, "this is as good as anything I've ever had"?
      - kasey_junk 1y ago
        Yes. By people who compete in bbq competitions. I’d also argue that most smoker designs are a matter of tradition and competition rules, not outcomes.
  - cogman10 1y ago
    Food judging will always be subjective. Famously wine tasting is mostly just pretentious bunk. That's why silly things like plating often matter more in a restaurant than actual taste.
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
    - computably 1y ago
      IIRC, wine tasting isn't bunk, wine pricing is. People can tell the differences between wines, and reasonably reliably if they are trained, but those differences (and the tasters' preferences) have weak/no correlations with $$$.
      - cogman10 1y ago
        Not as much as you'd think. In this article [1], one expert failed to identify that a white wine dyed red was the same. They used different descriptors for the same wine. And none of this should be too surprising. Our brains are complex things that like to hallucinate details. If you tell someone a bottle of wine cost $1000, their brain will happily invent reasons why it's one of the best wines they've tasted. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-tasting-junk-science-analysis https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2013/jun/23/wine-ta...
BuyMyBitcoins 1y ago
If they’re trying to measure skill, I can understand the rationale. The competition is more of a spectacle than an attempt at finding the most reliable and best tasting rib making process. Imagine a glassblowing competition where participants were judged on how consistently they could make a certain piece. The people using moulds would end up winning, and they would do so with a fraction of the skill and effort.
spiralcoaster 1y ago
You are really this shocked that some competitions ban certain methods of achieving the goal? Are you shocked that traditional wood chopping competitions ban chainsaws?
- tptacek 1y ago
  No, my surprise has nothing to do with fairness and everything to do with how unlikely I feel it is that circulated ribs would hold up to ribs smoked end-to-end. But people downthread with more information disagree, so...

0_____0 1y ago

I wonder if it's banned simply because it doesn't feel enough like BBQ. Similar to why FIA banned CVTs in racing. It's kind of arbitrary but also I get it. Racing and BBQ have culture behind them, and dare I say 'vibes' that their practitioners will want to retain.

0cf8612b2e1e 1y ago
I would be a bit disappointed if I went to a BBQ and saw them pull up a big tub of water in which they dumped the meat. My caveman brain wants to see fire.