4 ms·

If the sabotage proceeds, effects will be felt by nautical, aviation, agriculture, commerce, water management, hydroelectric, and on and on. Weather is critica

If the sabotage proceeds, effects will be felt by nautical, aviation, agriculture, commerce, water management, hydroelectric, and on and on. Weather is critical infrastructure for everything like roads and power. It can't be replaced by privatization. It's another attack from within.

arm32 1y ago
> It's another attack from within. So, Wednesday?
- Applejinx 1y ago
  Yup. I concur, it'll be because they expect sabotage.
ToucanLoucan 1y ago
You're not wrong, but their idiotic ideas having catastrophic effects hasn't stopped them doing anything yet. Probably because none of them have a clue what they're doing.
- imoverclocked 1y ago
  That's open to interpretation; Obviously, someone has a clue since it's part of a plan. It may just be that the people who have no clue are put there to make following the plan easier.
  - brokencode 1y ago
    Just because they have a plan, doesn’t mean they have a clue. Their reasoning for this could be as simple as “government bad”. Just look at the wild abandon with which DOGE has gone about its cuts. They literally fired the experts who inspect our nuclear arsenal, then had to scramble to hire them back because you know.. it’s literally nuclear bombs we’re talking about.
    - imoverclocked 1y ago
      They have caused a lot of mayhem for federal employees. They have suppressed a ton of information and research. They have kept a significant amount of the public in the dark about their actions. Yeah, they have done things we would both deem as "dumb" but their internal motive is what decides whether or not they have a clue. Furthering our motives has nothing to do with that.
  - kingkawn 1y ago
    If the plan is “break things” it does not imply any underlying of understanding, both of the things in question or even how to effectively break them
- babypuncher 1y ago
  They know exactly what they're doing. The billionaire class are bilking the country for every cent its worth, and when everything finally crumbles they will move to the next country with a stable middle class and start the process all over again. They do not care about these consequences because they have enough resources at their disposal to protect themselves while everyone else suffers.
  - rjbwork 1y ago
    Leveraged buying/private equity play at the scale of the nation state.
  - consumer451 1y ago
    That is one possibility. Another is that many people truly believe in the religion whose mantra is "all government is bad, and the market always knows best." This was once convenient propaganda for those who wanted lower taxes and less regulation of their businesses. Now the propaganda has been repeated for so long that many have forgotten it was propaganda, and believe that it is actually true. As I grow older, it gets easier for me to accept that most often the world is not a vast organized conspiracy, it's just really stupid. Though in current times, it does appear to be both of those things at once.
    - babypuncher 1y ago
      I know there are people who genuinely believe that, but it would be naive to think that is 100% organic and isn't something corporations and the super-wealthy are holding a megaphone up to because it just so happens to suit their interests.
      - consumer451 1y ago
        I was mostly thinking... the super-wealthy are the ones who forgot that it was just propaganda, and started to really believe it.
_heimdall 1y ago
Aren't the problems you point to just business justification for companies offering this service for a fee rather than subsidizing the fees with federal debt?
- joezydeco 1y ago
  I've seen this repeated many times but I have yet to see anyone mention, by name, which paid weather service is selling a feed with the same level of service and coverage as the NWS/NOAA. Anyone?
  - imglorp 1y ago
    Only NWS has a vast network of sensors: river gauges (with USGS), doppler radars, satellites, airport AOS automated observation systems, etc etc. to support the mission. Most of the privates are just repackaging their feeds and data. So if you kill NOAA they will have to start almost from scratch.
  - dingnuts 1y ago
    In my experience, having used several paid weather APIs for hobby crap, the NWS ones are generally the worst in every way. They're slower, harder to query, the documentation is worse, and they have less data available because the others buy data from private weather stations and re bundle it in addition to pre processing and repackaging the Federal data into better formats on your behalf I say this as a NOAA lover; the government just isn't good at building APIs.
  - _heimdall 1y ago
    Well you're describing the chicken and egg problem. If there is high demand for this data a company would fill that niche, but they would have no reason to until the free data is gone. I also think this chain of comments is a bit off the rails of my original point (maybe my fault). It honestly doesn't matter if there is pain to be felt by removing government services, we spend entirely too much money and any solution to that will hurt. If we are only willing to remove spending that hurts little to no one we might as well throw in the towel already, we'll never cut spending with that as a gate.
appreciatorBus 1y ago
If weather info is that valuable to so many private interests, wouldn't the public get a better deal by insisting that private interests pay market prices (to the public service provider) for that info? We commonly assume that a publicly owned service serves the public good by giving away the service for free, but this assumes the public's only role is as passive consumer, whose sole interest is seeing the price as low as possible, if not $0 However the public is also the owner and as owners of the service, we are arguably being taking advantage of by private interests who take the free data, only to turn around and create private value with it.
- ViscountPenguin 1y ago
  I mean, there's a relatively famous mechanism for garnering a portion of all private value produced by such a thing.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    I know, I know! ... is it tariffs? Because then China and Mexico will pay them!
- spankalee 1y ago
  Like roads, parks, postal service, police, fire fighting, education, sewers, etc., the government is allowed to provide public goods. We don't have to live in a Libertarian dystopia.
- rconti 1y ago
  Maybe the public would get a better deal fiscally. Would having to change APIs every 17 months as providers change their terms, constantly having to deal with breaking changes, etc, etc, etc be a "better deal"? There's an advantage in stability, and that's one thing governments typically provide. Yes, you can argue "a private provider could provide stability... for a fee". Which works great until it turns out even the fee isn't enough to keep them around. And you have to switch providers. Again.
- Theodores 1y ago
Alupis 1y ago
> It's another attack from within. The amount of fearmongering and scaremongering in this thread is literally off the charts. No, the weather service isn't being shut down... one private organization decides to charge for API access (you know, to make money) and immediately you folks go straight into sabotage and end-of-the-world conspiracy theories. It took me all of 3 seconds to find several mentions to the big ooga-booga, "project 2025". The article is literally about a private organization and you folks go right into the conspiracies... it's exhausting. At this point, I think I have to assume some of you actually enjoy being afraid. Some sort of coping mechanism for losing an election and not getting your way for 4 years...
- Spooky23 1y ago
  Accuweather spent a lot of money lobbying to charge for NWS data years ago. It’s not exactly a secret or a conspiracy to assume they wouldn’t like to replace free weather data with their own subscriptions.
  - Alupis 1y ago
    So what does a private organization deciding to charge for their own API access have to do with the government??? Get your weather data from NWS if you want... serving an API to anyone/everyone costs money, and AccuWeather apparently decided enough was enough. AccuWeather has no obligation to give you free resources. Same as Reddit, same as Twitter, same as so many companies before them. Oh no, that's right. It must be a conspiracy to end the world! Here's the actual NWS API[1], you know... the free one that's not going away nor is charging for access. [1] https://www.weather.gov/documentation/services-web-api https://www.weather.gov/documentation/services-web-api
    - macintux 1y ago
      > the free one that's not going away nor is charging for access. Care to make a wager? I'll gladly/sadly wager $100 with some broker that the NWS weather data will no longer be freely available by July 1 2026.
    - 1y ago

arm32 1y ago

> It's another attack from within. So, Wednesday?

Applejinx 1y ago
Yup. I concur, it'll be because they expect sabotage.

ToucanLoucan 1y ago

You're not wrong, but their idiotic ideas having catastrophic effects hasn't stopped them doing anything yet. Probably because none of them have a clue what they're doing.

imoverclocked 1y ago
That's open to interpretation; Obviously, someone has a clue since it's part of a plan. It may just be that the people who have no clue are put there to make following the plan easier.
- brokencode 1y ago
  Just because they have a plan, doesn’t mean they have a clue. Their reasoning for this could be as simple as “government bad”. Just look at the wild abandon with which DOGE has gone about its cuts. They literally fired the experts who inspect our nuclear arsenal, then had to scramble to hire them back because you know.. it’s literally nuclear bombs we’re talking about.
  - imoverclocked 1y ago
    They have caused a lot of mayhem for federal employees. They have suppressed a ton of information and research. They have kept a significant amount of the public in the dark about their actions. Yeah, they have done things we would both deem as "dumb" but their internal motive is what decides whether or not they have a clue. Furthering our motives has nothing to do with that.
- kingkawn 1y ago
  If the plan is “break things” it does not imply any underlying of understanding, both of the things in question or even how to effectively break them
babypuncher 1y ago
They know exactly what they're doing. The billionaire class are bilking the country for every cent its worth, and when everything finally crumbles they will move to the next country with a stable middle class and start the process all over again. They do not care about these consequences because they have enough resources at their disposal to protect themselves while everyone else suffers.
- rjbwork 1y ago
  Leveraged buying/private equity play at the scale of the nation state.
- consumer451 1y ago
  That is one possibility. Another is that many people truly believe in the religion whose mantra is "all government is bad, and the market always knows best." This was once convenient propaganda for those who wanted lower taxes and less regulation of their businesses. Now the propaganda has been repeated for so long that many have forgotten it was propaganda, and believe that it is actually true. As I grow older, it gets easier for me to accept that most often the world is not a vast organized conspiracy, it's just really stupid. Though in current times, it does appear to be both of those things at once.
  - babypuncher 1y ago
    I know there are people who genuinely believe that, but it would be naive to think that is 100% organic and isn't something corporations and the super-wealthy are holding a megaphone up to because it just so happens to suit their interests.
    - consumer451 1y ago
      I was mostly thinking... the super-wealthy are the ones who forgot that it was just propaganda, and started to really believe it.

_heimdall 1y ago

Aren't the problems you point to just business justification for companies offering this service for a fee rather than subsidizing the fees with federal debt?

joezydeco 1y ago
I've seen this repeated many times but I have yet to see anyone mention, by name, which paid weather service is selling a feed with the same level of service and coverage as the NWS/NOAA. Anyone?
- imglorp 1y ago
  Only NWS has a vast network of sensors: river gauges (with USGS), doppler radars, satellites, airport AOS automated observation systems, etc etc. to support the mission. Most of the privates are just repackaging their feeds and data. So if you kill NOAA they will have to start almost from scratch.
- dingnuts 1y ago
  In my experience, having used several paid weather APIs for hobby crap, the NWS ones are generally the worst in every way. They're slower, harder to query, the documentation is worse, and they have less data available because the others buy data from private weather stations and re bundle it in addition to pre processing and repackaging the Federal data into better formats on your behalf I say this as a NOAA lover; the government just isn't good at building APIs.
- _heimdall 1y ago
  Well you're describing the chicken and egg problem. If there is high demand for this data a company would fill that niche, but they would have no reason to until the free data is gone. I also think this chain of comments is a bit off the rails of my original point (maybe my fault). It honestly doesn't matter if there is pain to be felt by removing government services, we spend entirely too much money and any solution to that will hurt. If we are only willing to remove spending that hurts little to no one we might as well throw in the towel already, we'll never cut spending with that as a gate.

appreciatorBus 1y ago

If weather info is that valuable to so many private interests, wouldn't the public get a better deal by insisting that private interests pay market prices (to the public service provider) for that info? We commonly assume that a publicly owned service serves the public good by giving away the service for free, but this assumes the public's only role is as passive consumer, whose sole interest is seeing the price as low as possible, if not $0 However the public is also the owner and as owners of the service, we are arguably being taking advantage of by private interests who take the free data, only to turn around and create private value with it.

ViscountPenguin 1y ago
I mean, there's a relatively famous mechanism for garnering a portion of all private value produced by such a thing.
- actionfromafar 1y ago
  I know, I know! ... is it tariffs? Because then China and Mexico will pay them!
spankalee 1y ago
Like roads, parks, postal service, police, fire fighting, education, sewers, etc., the government is allowed to provide public goods. We don't have to live in a Libertarian dystopia.
rconti 1y ago
Maybe the public would get a better deal fiscally. Would having to change APIs every 17 months as providers change their terms, constantly having to deal with breaking changes, etc, etc, etc be a "better deal"? There's an advantage in stability, and that's one thing governments typically provide. Yes, you can argue "a private provider could provide stability... for a fee". Which works great until it turns out even the fee isn't enough to keep them around. And you have to switch providers. Again.
Theodores 1y ago

Alupis 1y ago

> It's another attack from within. The amount of fearmongering and scaremongering in this thread is literally off the charts. No, the weather service isn't being shut down... one private organization decides to charge for API access (you know, to make money) and immediately you folks go straight into sabotage and end-of-the-world conspiracy theories. It took me all of 3 seconds to find several mentions to the big ooga-booga, "project 2025". The article is literally about a private organization and you folks go right into the conspiracies... it's exhausting. At this point, I think I have to assume some of you actually enjoy being afraid. Some sort of coping mechanism for losing an election and not getting your way for 4 years...

Spooky23 1y ago
Accuweather spent a lot of money lobbying to charge for NWS data years ago. It’s not exactly a secret or a conspiracy to assume they wouldn’t like to replace free weather data with their own subscriptions.
- Alupis 1y ago
  So what does a private organization deciding to charge for their own API access have to do with the government??? Get your weather data from NWS if you want... serving an API to anyone/everyone costs money, and AccuWeather apparently decided enough was enough. AccuWeather has no obligation to give you free resources. Same as Reddit, same as Twitter, same as so many companies before them. Oh no, that's right. It must be a conspiracy to end the world! Here's the actual NWS API[1], you know... the free one that's not going away nor is charging for access. [1] https://www.weather.gov/documentation/services-web-api https://www.weather.gov/documentation/services-web-api
  - macintux 1y ago
    > the free one that's not going away nor is charging for access. Care to make a wager? I'll gladly/sadly wager $100 with some broker that the NWS weather data will no longer be freely available by July 1 2026.
  - 1y ago