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Lots and lots of states were founded by terrorists. Like, my state (Ireland) was founded by a bunch of them. Our longest standing leader (DeValera) was involved
by disgruntledphd2 1y ago
Lots and lots of states were founded by terrorists. Like, my state (Ireland) was founded by a bunch of them. Our longest standing leader (DeValera) was involved in the 1916 rising and was only not executed because he was a US citizen and the Brits wanted the US to join WW1.
Which is to say, that many many states have been founded by terrorists/freedom fighters. That's the norm, not the exception. Like, from the perspective of the British Crown, George Washington was a terrorist.
- DSingularity 1y agoI’m using the word “terrorism” in exactly the way it should be used. Ireland was founded by people fighting for liberty. South Africa the same. The Israeli founders were terrorists. They used terror to ethnically cleanse the lands of its indigenous population. Anybody that supports this or tries to draw false parallels with genuine liberation movements is disgusting for obvious reasons.
- senderista 1y agoThat’s pretty naive. There are never unambiguously good and bad sides in a civil war. Case in point: the ANC terrorized and massacred Zulu nationalists.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- DSingularity 1y agoOkay that’s fine — call it naive. Way would you call condemning the Gazans for fighting against occupiers while white washing the long history of crime and abuse by Zionists?
- FuriouslyAdrift 1y agoIsrael hadn't 'occupied' Gaza since 2005.
- DSingularity 1y agoThe majority of Gazans are refugees displaced from other parts of Palestine which are indeed presently occupied. If you care to find out how they were displaced you might be shocked at how the living space for Israelis was created.
- FuriouslyAdrift 1y agoI have family in Israel (some of which go back to Roman times) and am quite familiar with the current nations founding. 'Palestine' is a modern convention from 1967. Prior to that, it was a regional term to refer anyone living in the area (including native Jews).
- DSingularity 1y agoNo disagreements there. I have a friend who grew up in Lebanon who told me how his fathers best friend in high school was Jewish who later came back to invade Lebanon and supervise martial law in the same city they grew up in. It’s the way of the colonialists. Outsource the occupation to a local minority and your occupation can last a lot longer because the colonial power will be shielded from the inevitable blowback that will follow from the dirty work of colonization. The minority will always be keen to retain your support so you can retain most of the benefits which attracted you to the colonial project for a lot longer. The world should push for a one state solution. Enough bloodshed already.
- int_19h 1y agoYou seem to be implying that "genuine liberation movements" cannot use terrorist methods, which is rather obviously false.
- disgruntledphd2 1y agoI get that morally it may feel different, but the Irish separatists used identical methods to the Israeli separatists to gain independence (bombs and violence). In fact, the Jewish separatists explicitly used the same approaches against the British post WW1.
- naniwaduni 1y agoAlmost all states can trace their founding to separatists if they so wish, but those are hard to usefully characterize as a subset of terrorists. The "norm" for secession before the 19th century was basically whatever passed for contemporary conventional warfare. Political terrorism only really becomes comparatively "effective" in response to modern era military disparities.
- computerthings 1y ago[dead]