18 ms·

Pirate Bay Founder Arrested in Cambodia

162 points by denzil_correa 14y ago

w1ntermute 14y ago
Well that sucks. The US govt probably bribed the Cambodian govt into arresting him on a trumped up charge.
- briandear 14y ago
  Right. Blame America for Sweeden. Besides the guy's entire MO was distributing stolen files. In the article, the guy's t-shirt says it all. Anyway you slice it, he's no better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers. If you think everything should be free, then please leave your address so I can help myself to your stuff.
  - nobleach 14y ago
    I think the guy's platform was a bit more nuanced than just "steal all da things". He DID help provide a service that overwhelmingly assists pirating of of movies/shows/software/music/etc. But their entire platform is that digital can not be contained. I can't say right or wrong, but I can say copying != stealing. But, if you want my address, fine.... you are welcome to exact copies of my stuff as long as the originals remain.
  - ix_ 14y ago
    Stealing is not the same as duplicating.
  - EliRivers 14y ago
    "Anyway you slice it, he's no better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers." That's incorrect. He is better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers. I have presented as much evidence and analysis for my conclusion as you did, so they must be equally valid. "If you think everything should be free, then please leave your address so I can help myself to your stuff." I am happy to describe to you something I own so that you can make a copy of it. Gosh, it's almost as if copying something isn't actually the same as taking a physical object from someone.
    - archgrove 14y ago
      "I am happy to describe to you something I own so that you can make a copy of it" Fantastic - your comment history indicates you're a programmer of some kind, running a company. I'm sure you've got some interesting insights into this field. If you could just write them up into a decent book, edit it properly so I can understand it, make it pithy, smart and worth reading so I can get the most of your "description", pay someone to draw some decent diagrams, etc, and then ship it over, that'd be great. But because it's just "information", and can be replicated freely, I'm not going to pay you to do any of that. I just want the "information" - the production costs are all up to you. So noone's out anything, any this is a perfectly reasoning thing to expect, right?
      - atlassic 14y ago
        Publishing a book has been on my bucket list for a while. And I have no plans to bitch about it being "stolen". Name recognition and being able to say "I wrote the book on X" is far more valuable than the royalties most authors make these days. So please, steal my book, and ask your friends to steal it too. Your free marketing on my behalf will be most welcome.
        GHFigs 14y ago
        You're confusing your own choice to give away your own work with the choice of many to take work of others not freely given. It's unreasonable to assume that everybody would make the same choice as you, which is why a creator's right to make that choice is important. Would you, for example, feel the same way about publishing a book if you had no right to keep other people from putting their name on it and claiming it as their own? Or would you rather not have that choice at all?
        vidarh 14y ago
        > Would you, for example, feel the same way about publishing a book if you had no right to keep other people from putting their name on it and claiming it as their own? Or would you rather not have that choice at all? I'd like to point out here that in most countries, copyrights and moral rights are legally entirely separate. Moral rights (the right to be recognized as the creator of a work, and in certain circumstances the right to dis-avow your involvement with a work, if it has been modified in certain ways for example) are generally non-transferable, for example. Trying to conflate the two to argue against someone's belief that reproduction / copying a work is ok is thus rather meaningless - we can easily enough have one without the other.
  - Dylan16807 14y ago
    The pirate bay is a directory that helps people get together that are often doing illegal things. The site does not actually know the contents of the files. It does not participate in the behavior. It's better than people that actually deal in credit card numbers. The idea of trumped up charges is still pretty nonsensical.
  - fossuser 14y ago
    There are lots of problems with modern copyright (http://zacharyalberico.com/day/2012/01/24 http://zacharyalberico.com/day/2012/01/24 - specific to US law, but explains some of it) In this case though the pirate bay was a tracker/index site and didn't actually host any infringing materials. At the time it operated in Sweden this wasn't a crime. It's largely speculated that the US involved themselves to pressure Sweden to prosecute, but I don't know how substantiated that opinion is.
denzil_correa 14y ago
Interesting that he seems to be arrested in an apartment where he has stayed in the past.
jws 14y ago
Since visiting Cambodia a few years ago I've always said it is my first choice if I have to leave my home. Looks like I wasn't alone. It's a lovely place with friendly people. I will never be able to distinguish the Khmer consonant sounds enough to understand or speak it, but English is common. Unfortunately for fugitives, they do have extradition treaties.
- beedogs 14y ago
  > While there is no extradition treaty between Cambodia and Sweden the lawyer believes his client could be transferred to his home country eventually.
- netsmashers 14y ago
  I've been to Cambodia too and totally agree with you – people are friendly, helpful and the country is a wonderful place to live.
  - shell0x 14y ago
    Do they have a _real_ health system? I doubt that the life in Cambodia is better than in Sweden. Maybe it's ok if you to go the country as US-American, but the Swedish living standard is much higher ;)
    - joeguilmette 14y ago
      i can tell you i walked into a clinic and saw a doctor within minutes, ran bloodwork, got tested for dengue and yellow fever. in and out in 20 minutes, had my results the next day. that cost $45. everything was clean and sterile, needles came from packages, went into biohazard boxes. also, i walked into a pharmacy and bought a round amoxicillin without the need for a prescription. i had a note from the doctor to make sure i had the right dosage. that cost me $4. also, you can wear a t-shirt and shorts with sandals all year round. you can eat all you can fit inside your body for less than $10 a day ($3 if you eat local food). you can visit some of the world's largest and most amazing ruins as well as some of the world's last undeveloped paradise islands. how many gorgeous beaches are in Sweden? ;)
joering2 14y ago
In my opinion, it is shameful he ran away. C'mon -- it was only 12 months jailtime; most likely he would be let go after 3-4 months for a good behavior. Serving this time he would be, technically, off the LE charts. This way he is just another "criminal on the run" and now sure prosecutor will be looking for more jailtime.
- sp332 14y ago
  He didn't "run away", he was already in Cambodia at the time of the trial & appeal. http://torrentfreak.com/jail-sentence-for-pirate-bay-co-founder-made-final-111014/ http://torrentfreak.com/jail-sentence-for-pirate-bay-co-foun... (edited for correctness)
  - mindjiver 14y ago
    And how is not coming to your trial not running away?
    - tedunangst 14y ago
      The rules are different for people who run web sites we like.
    - batista 14y ago
      Because that would be running TOWARDS the trial. Why should he go back to a country he has left just to have a trial?
      - eli 14y ago
        Because if you don't show up they could send you to jail anyway without you having had a chance to make full defense?
        rhizome 14y ago
        I was taught that trials in absentia are not really a great thing.
benologist 14y ago
It's fascinating the way torrentfreak can play this audience.
- mcantelon 14y ago
  How is reporting news "playing an audience"?
duked 14y ago
I'm really surprised he was on an "international wanted list", I mean come on you don't have to agree/disagree that piirate bay is good/bad but I'm sure that if you kill your neighbor and leave the country you won't be on such list and it would be able real people, here it's about digital good (but it also affects real people) nevertheless I really think it's too much
- dhughes 14y ago
  A farmer from my region had a red notice issued by INTERPOL, it sounds impressive. What did he supposedly do? He is a potato farmer and was accused of selling low quality potatoes to Algeria. He spent more than a year in a jail in Lebanon waiting for the Canadian government to sort it out, they took their sweet time. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2012/06/27/nb-henk-tepper-farmer.html http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2012/06/27...
- ktizo 14y ago
  Things like killing your neighbour and then leaving the country is pretty much what the international wanted list is for. Interpol mostly deals with ordinary crime and very rarely calls on Jackie Chan.
knowaveragejoe 14y ago
He would have had better luck hiding in the US, IMO. A white guy in a largely non-white country sticks out like a sore thumb, especially a fugitive. Rescinding use of his various online accounts, utilizing cash and public transportation as well as altering his appearance and working on his accent, he would've easily blended into the masses here. LE has a hard enough time tracking down some serious domestic offenders as it is.
- datasink 14y ago
  As mentioned in the article, he was living in an apartment above an expat bar, on the very touristy riverside strip in Phnom Penh. It sounds like he wasn't really trying to hide. Perhaps because he was chronically ill, and needed to make frequent hospital visits anyway? I think it's pretty unlikely, even if he did take various measures to hide, that he'd be able to if influential foreign governments were putting pressure on the Cambodian government to find him. Cambodia is a pretty tiny country.
Kiro 14y ago
I'm pretty sure this has nothing to do with The Pirate Bay at all.
- mcantelon 14y ago
  Based on what?
dale-cooper 14y ago
Some more information (or gossip..) http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=25144 http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2...
jusben1369 14y ago
It sounds to me like spending time getting 1st world healthcare and staying put in one location for a while might be a blessing in disguise.
catfish 14y ago
Apple = Big Brother
doktrin 14y ago
Frankly, were I in his shoes I would be very tempted to simply serve my sentence in Sweden. The prison system and amenities are (by American standards) very modern, and I would think the healthcare is superior to that in Cambodia as well. This of course becomes moot if there's any real risk whatsoever of him being extradited to the US as some posters have pointed out. Is there any basis for this claim, or is it purely speculative?
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
ommunist 14y ago
This is just great. Instead of creating service that would be more attractive for users than PB, that greedy cats jail and rob you with giv arms. One should work more on kids minds to make them free from silly wish of watching that movie instead of doing some math for fun, or using MS wares instead of emacs :-) In this case there will be no need for PB, MS and WB alltogether.

162 points by denzil_correa 14y ago

w1ntermute 14y ago

Well that sucks. The US govt probably bribed the Cambodian govt into arresting him on a trumped up charge.

briandear 14y ago
Right. Blame America for Sweeden. Besides the guy's entire MO was distributing stolen files. In the article, the guy's t-shirt says it all. Anyway you slice it, he's no better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers. If you think everything should be free, then please leave your address so I can help myself to your stuff.
- nobleach 14y ago
  I think the guy's platform was a bit more nuanced than just "steal all da things". He DID help provide a service that overwhelmingly assists pirating of of movies/shows/software/music/etc. But their entire platform is that digital can not be contained. I can't say right or wrong, but I can say copying != stealing. But, if you want my address, fine.... you are welcome to exact copies of my stuff as long as the originals remain.
- ix_ 14y ago
  Stealing is not the same as duplicating.
- EliRivers 14y ago
  "Anyway you slice it, he's no better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers." That's incorrect. He is better than the Russian mobsters that steal credit card numbers. I have presented as much evidence and analysis for my conclusion as you did, so they must be equally valid. "If you think everything should be free, then please leave your address so I can help myself to your stuff." I am happy to describe to you something I own so that you can make a copy of it. Gosh, it's almost as if copying something isn't actually the same as taking a physical object from someone.
  - archgrove 14y ago
    "I am happy to describe to you something I own so that you can make a copy of it" Fantastic - your comment history indicates you're a programmer of some kind, running a company. I'm sure you've got some interesting insights into this field. If you could just write them up into a decent book, edit it properly so I can understand it, make it pithy, smart and worth reading so I can get the most of your "description", pay someone to draw some decent diagrams, etc, and then ship it over, that'd be great. But because it's just "information", and can be replicated freely, I'm not going to pay you to do any of that. I just want the "information" - the production costs are all up to you. So noone's out anything, any this is a perfectly reasoning thing to expect, right?
    - atlassic 14y ago
      Publishing a book has been on my bucket list for a while. And I have no plans to bitch about it being "stolen". Name recognition and being able to say "I wrote the book on X" is far more valuable than the royalties most authors make these days. So please, steal my book, and ask your friends to steal it too. Your free marketing on my behalf will be most welcome.
      - GHFigs 14y ago
        You're confusing your own choice to give away your own work with the choice of many to take work of others not freely given. It's unreasonable to assume that everybody would make the same choice as you, which is why a creator's right to make that choice is important. Would you, for example, feel the same way about publishing a book if you had no right to keep other people from putting their name on it and claiming it as their own? Or would you rather not have that choice at all?
        vidarh 14y ago
        > Would you, for example, feel the same way about publishing a book if you had no right to keep other people from putting their name on it and claiming it as their own? Or would you rather not have that choice at all? I'd like to point out here that in most countries, copyrights and moral rights are legally entirely separate. Moral rights (the right to be recognized as the creator of a work, and in certain circumstances the right to dis-avow your involvement with a work, if it has been modified in certain ways for example) are generally non-transferable, for example. Trying to conflate the two to argue against someone's belief that reproduction / copying a work is ok is thus rather meaningless - we can easily enough have one without the other.
- Dylan16807 14y ago
  The pirate bay is a directory that helps people get together that are often doing illegal things. The site does not actually know the contents of the files. It does not participate in the behavior. It's better than people that actually deal in credit card numbers. The idea of trumped up charges is still pretty nonsensical.
- fossuser 14y ago
  There are lots of problems with modern copyright (http://zacharyalberico.com/day/2012/01/24 http://zacharyalberico.com/day/2012/01/24 - specific to US law, but explains some of it) In this case though the pirate bay was a tracker/index site and didn't actually host any infringing materials. At the time it operated in Sweden this wasn't a crime. It's largely speculated that the US involved themselves to pressure Sweden to prosecute, but I don't know how substantiated that opinion is.

denzil_correa 14y ago

Interesting that he seems to be arrested in an apartment where he has stayed in the past.

jws 14y ago

Since visiting Cambodia a few years ago I've always said it is my first choice if I have to leave my home. Looks like I wasn't alone. It's a lovely place with friendly people. I will never be able to distinguish the Khmer consonant sounds enough to understand or speak it, but English is common. Unfortunately for fugitives, they do have extradition treaties.

beedogs 14y ago
> While there is no extradition treaty between Cambodia and Sweden the lawyer believes his client could be transferred to his home country eventually.
netsmashers 14y ago
I've been to Cambodia too and totally agree with you – people are friendly, helpful and the country is a wonderful place to live.
- shell0x 14y ago
  Do they have a _real_ health system? I doubt that the life in Cambodia is better than in Sweden. Maybe it's ok if you to go the country as US-American, but the Swedish living standard is much higher ;)
  - joeguilmette 14y ago
    i can tell you i walked into a clinic and saw a doctor within minutes, ran bloodwork, got tested for dengue and yellow fever. in and out in 20 minutes, had my results the next day. that cost $45. everything was clean and sterile, needles came from packages, went into biohazard boxes. also, i walked into a pharmacy and bought a round amoxicillin without the need for a prescription. i had a note from the doctor to make sure i had the right dosage. that cost me $4. also, you can wear a t-shirt and shorts with sandals all year round. you can eat all you can fit inside your body for less than $10 a day ($3 if you eat local food). you can visit some of the world's largest and most amazing ruins as well as some of the world's last undeveloped paradise islands. how many gorgeous beaches are in Sweden? ;)

joering2 14y ago

In my opinion, it is shameful he ran away. C'mon -- it was only 12 months jailtime; most likely he would be let go after 3-4 months for a good behavior. Serving this time he would be, technically, off the LE charts. This way he is just another "criminal on the run" and now sure prosecutor will be looking for more jailtime.

sp332 14y ago
He didn't "run away", he was already in Cambodia at the time of the trial & appeal. http://torrentfreak.com/jail-sentence-for-pirate-bay-co-founder-made-final-111014/ http://torrentfreak.com/jail-sentence-for-pirate-bay-co-foun... (edited for correctness)
- mindjiver 14y ago
  And how is not coming to your trial not running away?
  - tedunangst 14y ago
    The rules are different for people who run web sites we like.
  - batista 14y ago
    Because that would be running TOWARDS the trial. Why should he go back to a country he has left just to have a trial?
    - eli 14y ago
      Because if you don't show up they could send you to jail anyway without you having had a chance to make full defense?
      - rhizome 14y ago
        I was taught that trials in absentia are not really a great thing.

benologist 14y ago

It's fascinating the way torrentfreak can play this audience.

mcantelon 14y ago
How is reporting news "playing an audience"?

duked 14y ago

I'm really surprised he was on an "international wanted list", I mean come on you don't have to agree/disagree that piirate bay is good/bad but I'm sure that if you kill your neighbor and leave the country you won't be on such list and it would be able real people, here it's about digital good (but it also affects real people) nevertheless I really think it's too much

dhughes 14y ago
A farmer from my region had a red notice issued by INTERPOL, it sounds impressive. What did he supposedly do? He is a potato farmer and was accused of selling low quality potatoes to Algeria. He spent more than a year in a jail in Lebanon waiting for the Canadian government to sort it out, they took their sweet time. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2012/06/27/nb-henk-tepper-farmer.html http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/story/2012/06/27...
ktizo 14y ago
Things like killing your neighbour and then leaving the country is pretty much what the international wanted list is for. Interpol mostly deals with ordinary crime and very rarely calls on Jackie Chan.

knowaveragejoe 14y ago

He would have had better luck hiding in the US, IMO. A white guy in a largely non-white country sticks out like a sore thumb, especially a fugitive. Rescinding use of his various online accounts, utilizing cash and public transportation as well as altering his appearance and working on his accent, he would've easily blended into the masses here. LE has a hard enough time tracking down some serious domestic offenders as it is.

datasink 14y ago
As mentioned in the article, he was living in an apartment above an expat bar, on the very touristy riverside strip in Phnom Penh. It sounds like he wasn't really trying to hide. Perhaps because he was chronically ill, and needed to make frequent hospital visits anyway? I think it's pretty unlikely, even if he did take various measures to hide, that he'd be able to if influential foreign governments were putting pressure on the Cambodian government to find him. Cambodia is a pretty tiny country.

Kiro 14y ago

I'm pretty sure this has nothing to do with The Pirate Bay at all.

mcantelon 14y ago
Based on what?

dale-cooper 14y ago

Some more information (or gossip..) http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=25144 http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2...

jusben1369 14y ago

It sounds to me like spending time getting 1st world healthcare and staying put in one location for a while might be a blessing in disguise.

catfish 14y ago

Apple = Big Brother

doktrin 14y ago

Frankly, were I in his shoes I would be very tempted to simply serve my sentence in Sweden. The prison system and amenities are (by American standards) very modern, and I would think the healthcare is superior to that in Cambodia as well. This of course becomes moot if there's any real risk whatsoever of him being extradited to the US as some posters have pointed out. Is there any basis for this claim, or is it purely speculative?

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

ommunist 14y ago

This is just great. Instead of creating service that would be more attractive for users than PB, that greedy cats jail and rob you with giv arms. One should work more on kids minds to make them free from silly wish of watching that movie instead of doing some math for fun, or using MS wares instead of emacs :-) In this case there will be no need for PB, MS and WB alltogether.