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>Existing asset owners will be angry at losing (illusory/on-paper-only) money I wouldn't be. I bought my house to live in it, not as a financial vehicle. I wou

>Existing asset owners will be angry at losing (illusory/on-paper-only) money I wouldn't be. I bought my house to live in it, not as a financial vehicle. I would be thrilled if prices came down and others in my generation could afford a house because I had the dumb luck of purchasing one in 2018 before the shit hit the fan. I couldn't even afford my own house now.

itake 1y ago
On the surface, I feel the same as you but as someone that bought a house three years ago at 5.5% interest and has only lost money on the property due to significant home repairs it really doesn’t feel great that my capital is just evaporating. I spent $50,000 replacing the pipes and removing asbestos 1 year after I bought the house. While I don’t expect the down payment and regular mortgage payments to grow and value, it’s very painful when there’s an unexpected repair that requires additional capital that isn’t recaptured in the home value growth. It’s like driving a new car off the dealership parking lot and immediately getting your doors dinged. I’d feel a lot less about it if the car went up in value…
- thinkingtoilet 1y ago
  But even if your house was worth more in value, you would still have to make those repairs and it would still come out of pocket. It only matters if you bought your house to sell it at a profit. Of course, if you hadn't bought it, you'd be paying someone else's mortgage.
stego-tech 1y ago
You and I are in a growing minority on this, I find. When I started my homebuying journey four years ago, I did so expecting to eat an on-paper devaluation of up to 50% during my lifetime - and was fine with that, because I wanted stability, not profit.
- s1artibartfast 1y ago
  That makes sense if people have more and more of their assets tied up in home value. It's a positive feedback loop. I assume that 50% markdown wouldn't be a 50% loss on your assets or retirement.
epistasis 1y ago
Same for me, but that's not how most people view the housing market, especially those who take the time to influence local politicians.
lordnacho 1y ago
I think the same. I have a house, but the mortgage is not massive. If I can just live in it with no appreciation, that's fine with me. I even want to encourage building in the area, since we have a train station that seems underutilized. There's a more selfish reason for wanting prices to not rise. I have kids. In a few years, they will be adults. If prices keep rising, how will they launch their own lives? I'll get asked to buy another house again.
tracker1 1y ago
Largely the same boat here, I refinanced in early 2020 near the lowest interest rates and eliminating the mortgage insurance payment. Of course since then, property taxes have gone up significantly. All said, I'm living here at a cost that I can sustain. I'd have trouble paying close to 2x the amount for a new loan of even the same total. Way too many people got sold on the idea you could just flip a property every other year and move on/up... that kind of growth/inflation has never been sustainable in any industry ever for more than a couple years. The closest, recent example I can think of is the cost of junk food. I no longer have it much at all, but even for calorie free soda options, the pricing seems to have more than doubled the past few years. More so than most food in general. They've maximized their profit margins and I don't think they'll be able to sustain it. People are cutting back on spending as a result. I think the amount of mortgage defaults are as much about credit use in general as it is about the housing market. I've been unemployed 11 of the past 24 months, and currently working for about 60% of what I used to make. During that unpaid time, I built up a lot of credit card debt. Right now, it's not my mortgage that's killing me, it's the credit cart interest combined with a job that doesn't quite cover it all. I was working two jobs for a while and just couldn't keep it up. A LOT of people are in a similar boat. Right now, I could sell my house, and just about start and 0 debt all over... but then I'm paying 2x as much for rent and not getting ahead without moving... and even with remote work, places try to pay "market" for where you live. The options are kind of crappy.
richonpaper 1y ago
We bought a house 17 years ago. We could barely afford it and struggled to keep it for years. The house more than doubled in value in that time. Great right? Well the kids grew up, and we sold it and bought a smaller place. Just the tax (GST on a new build) and the realtors commission amounted to two years worth of my gross pay. We sold our old place that had a $400,000 balance on the mortgage for $1.7 million, bought the new place for $1.2 million and now have a 175,000 mortgage. Just the costs of the transaction are greater than what my parents paid for the last home they bought. These sky high prices are not good for the middle class. I would be much better off if my mortgage payments for all those years were small enough to allow for retirement saving. I'm basically fucked if I want to live indoors in my town after I can't work anymore.

itake 1y ago

On the surface, I feel the same as you but as someone that bought a house three years ago at 5.5% interest and has only lost money on the property due to significant home repairs it really doesn’t feel great that my capital is just evaporating. I spent $50,000 replacing the pipes and removing asbestos 1 year after I bought the house. While I don’t expect the down payment and regular mortgage payments to grow and value, it’s very painful when there’s an unexpected repair that requires additional capital that isn’t recaptured in the home value growth. It’s like driving a new car off the dealership parking lot and immediately getting your doors dinged. I’d feel a lot less about it if the car went up in value…

thinkingtoilet 1y ago
But even if your house was worth more in value, you would still have to make those repairs and it would still come out of pocket. It only matters if you bought your house to sell it at a profit. Of course, if you hadn't bought it, you'd be paying someone else's mortgage.

stego-tech 1y ago

You and I are in a growing minority on this, I find. When I started my homebuying journey four years ago, I did so expecting to eat an on-paper devaluation of up to 50% during my lifetime - and was fine with that, because I wanted stability, not profit.

s1artibartfast 1y ago
That makes sense if people have more and more of their assets tied up in home value. It's a positive feedback loop. I assume that 50% markdown wouldn't be a 50% loss on your assets or retirement.

epistasis 1y ago

Same for me, but that's not how most people view the housing market, especially those who take the time to influence local politicians.

lordnacho 1y ago

I think the same. I have a house, but the mortgage is not massive. If I can just live in it with no appreciation, that's fine with me. I even want to encourage building in the area, since we have a train station that seems underutilized. There's a more selfish reason for wanting prices to not rise. I have kids. In a few years, they will be adults. If prices keep rising, how will they launch their own lives? I'll get asked to buy another house again.

tracker1 1y ago

Largely the same boat here, I refinanced in early 2020 near the lowest interest rates and eliminating the mortgage insurance payment. Of course since then, property taxes have gone up significantly. All said, I'm living here at a cost that I can sustain. I'd have trouble paying close to 2x the amount for a new loan of even the same total. Way too many people got sold on the idea you could just flip a property every other year and move on/up... that kind of growth/inflation has never been sustainable in any industry ever for more than a couple years. The closest, recent example I can think of is the cost of junk food. I no longer have it much at all, but even for calorie free soda options, the pricing seems to have more than doubled the past few years. More so than most food in general. They've maximized their profit margins and I don't think they'll be able to sustain it. People are cutting back on spending as a result. I think the amount of mortgage defaults are as much about credit use in general as it is about the housing market. I've been unemployed 11 of the past 24 months, and currently working for about 60% of what I used to make. During that unpaid time, I built up a lot of credit card debt. Right now, it's not my mortgage that's killing me, it's the credit cart interest combined with a job that doesn't quite cover it all. I was working two jobs for a while and just couldn't keep it up. A LOT of people are in a similar boat. Right now, I could sell my house, and just about start and 0 debt all over... but then I'm paying 2x as much for rent and not getting ahead without moving... and even with remote work, places try to pay "market" for where you live. The options are kind of crappy.

richonpaper 1y ago

We bought a house 17 years ago. We could barely afford it and struggled to keep it for years. The house more than doubled in value in that time. Great right? Well the kids grew up, and we sold it and bought a smaller place. Just the tax (GST on a new build) and the realtors commission amounted to two years worth of my gross pay. We sold our old place that had a $400,000 balance on the mortgage for $1.7 million, bought the new place for $1.2 million and now have a 175,000 mortgage. Just the costs of the transaction are greater than what my parents paid for the last home they bought. These sky high prices are not good for the middle class. I would be much better off if my mortgage payments for all those years were small enough to allow for retirement saving. I'm basically fucked if I want to live indoors in my town after I can't work anymore.