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Many families have private ceremonies for miscarriages

Terr_ 1y ago
I am personally aware. Yet why do you believe people declaring chanting "life begins at conception" do not make preventing miscarriages into a part of their national political platform the same way as criminalizing abortion? That's like someone who says "cows are people" and wants the death penalty for hamburgers, but they're a-OK with dairy farms and leather. It shows that even the proponents of the slogan don't actually believe it.
- throwpoaster 1y ago
  Miscarriages are a personal tragedy. There is no way to prevent them.
  - CamperBob2 1y ago
    "Does God have the ability to prevent miscarriages, but will not? Then why call him God?" Or something like that... can't remember how it goes exactly.
    - throwpoaster 1y ago
      Where do you get this expectation that biological processes should have a zero percent failure rate?
  - imtringued 1y ago
    Embryo selection is the easiest way to minimize the risk of miscarriage. The only reason why you would say that there is no way to prevent them is that I infer from your posts that you are most likely against embryo selection.
    - throwpoaster 1y ago
      The comment I was responding to suggested eliminating miscarriage as a policy objective. I said that was impossible. Your response with a suggestion to minimize risk while increasing the amount of total human death does not address the point, regardless of my comment history (ad hom.?).
- achierius 1y ago
  > why do you believe people declaring chanting "life begins at conception" do not make preventing miscarriages into a part of their national political platform Because it's already a national political consensus? National health organizations go to serious lengths to make sure women are not unknowingly consuming things which would cause them to miscarry. Assaulting a woman and causing her to miscarry is penalized with charges above and beyond what would be assigned if not for the miscarriage. Societally, we try to encourage people to be gentle, careful, and accommodating towards/with pregnant women, and to encourage mothers to not drink or smoke while they're carrying. What strawman world are you living in where this isn't the case?
  - Terr_ 1y ago
    You're right that there is a consensus of "miscarriages are unfortunate, let's try to minimize how often it happens." What does not exist is a consensus that a blastocyst is (consistently) equal in personhood to a newborn, with equal levels of loss and tragedy. I trust that this is obvious without the need for lurid comparisons. So while the two vectors may share a direction, the amplitudes are very different. Kind of like how it's important to floss your teeth, it's not so important that failure becomes a crime.
    - achierius 1y ago
      You would be surprised. Plenty of (sufficiently religious) people will indeed hold funerals for and bury miscarriages, if they're at all identifiable. What you seem to expect is that they attempt to force other people to do so -- but unlike killing an organism, "failing to mourn" an organism is not really a crime under any moral framework, so the impetus just isn't there in the same way.

I am personally aware. Yet why do you believe people declaring chanting "life begins at conception" do not make preventing miscarriages into a part of their national political platform the same way as criminalizing abortion? That's like someone who says "cows are people" and wants the death penalty for hamburgers, but they're a-OK with dairy farms and leather. It shows that even the proponents of the slogan don't actually believe it.

throwpoaster 1y ago
Miscarriages are a personal tragedy. There is no way to prevent them.
- CamperBob2 1y ago
  "Does God have the ability to prevent miscarriages, but will not? Then why call him God?" Or something like that... can't remember how it goes exactly.
  - throwpoaster 1y ago
    Where do you get this expectation that biological processes should have a zero percent failure rate?
- imtringued 1y ago
  Embryo selection is the easiest way to minimize the risk of miscarriage. The only reason why you would say that there is no way to prevent them is that I infer from your posts that you are most likely against embryo selection.
  - throwpoaster 1y ago
    The comment I was responding to suggested eliminating miscarriage as a policy objective. I said that was impossible. Your response with a suggestion to minimize risk while increasing the amount of total human death does not address the point, regardless of my comment history (ad hom.?).
achierius 1y ago
> why do you believe people declaring chanting "life begins at conception" do not make preventing miscarriages into a part of their national political platform Because it's already a national political consensus? National health organizations go to serious lengths to make sure women are not unknowingly consuming things which would cause them to miscarry. Assaulting a woman and causing her to miscarry is penalized with charges above and beyond what would be assigned if not for the miscarriage. Societally, we try to encourage people to be gentle, careful, and accommodating towards/with pregnant women, and to encourage mothers to not drink or smoke while they're carrying. What strawman world are you living in where this isn't the case?
- Terr_ 1y ago
  You're right that there is a consensus of "miscarriages are unfortunate, let's try to minimize how often it happens." What does not exist is a consensus that a blastocyst is (consistently) equal in personhood to a newborn, with equal levels of loss and tragedy. I trust that this is obvious without the need for lurid comparisons. So while the two vectors may share a direction, the amplitudes are very different. Kind of like how it's important to floss your teeth, it's not so important that failure becomes a crime.
  - achierius 1y ago
    You would be surprised. Plenty of (sufficiently religious) people will indeed hold funerals for and bury miscarriages, if they're at all identifiable. What you seem to expect is that they attempt to force other people to do so -- but unlike killing an organism, "failing to mourn" an organism is not really a crime under any moral framework, so the impetus just isn't there in the same way.