5 ms·

Hello Mr. Roberts, Thank you for doing this, as you know we've probably have seen some crazy news articles and segments of ICE agents arresting people all over

Hello Mr. Roberts, Thank you for doing this, as you know we've probably have seen some crazy news articles and segments of ICE agents arresting people all over the U.S. with some for good and some for wrong reasons. What is your advice or best practice for someone who is "wrongfully" approached by ICE agents but has legal status to be in the U.S.? (whether work visa or green card) I've read that someone should carry their green card with them or if they have some sort of REAL ID mark on their drivers license it may help. Thank you again for doing this!

proberts 1y ago
The best defense so to speak is to carry evidence of your status whether that's a green card or foreign passport and I-94 admission record, to have the number of a local immigration attorney whom you can call if you need to, and to be aware of one's rights. The ACLU has a good discussion of these rights: https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/immigrants-rights https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/immigrants-rights.
- kjellsbells 1y ago
  What would you recommend for foreign born US citizens worried about being approached by ICE? What are the basic ground rules for interacting? For example, some of us here look very much like we didnt grow up in an Iowa cornfield and have genuine concern that one negative interaction is going to result in being roughed up by untrained ICE agents at best and tossed into jail or worse. Do we just get used to the idea of carrying our passport at all times? Is an ICE agent authorized to demand it and take it from us "for checking", say? Bar two pieces of fragile paper - a passport and a naturalization certificate - it's not obvious that a citizen is a citizen.
  - somanyphotons 1y ago
    (I'm not Peter) I'd suggest also applying for a Passport Card, you can keep it in your wallet.
  - smsm42 1y ago
    Carry a REAL-ID enabled state ID? Those are not available to illegals in any state. All newer state IDs AFAIK are REAL-ID enabled by default. And you probably will need to use some form of ID anyway pretty frequently.
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
    - kjellsbells 1y ago
      Thats a good idea, although it is not completely robust. REAL-ID only proves that the holder had legal presence at the time of issue, not that the holder maintains legal presence at the point of presenting it to the ICE officer. For example, holders of Temporary Protected Status would have been here perfectly legally and been able to get and hold a REAL ID. But their status has just been revoked. So an ICE officer could still refuse to accept it as proof of legal status.
bc569a80a344f9c 1y ago
It’s a legal requirement to carry your green card with you at all times. INA 264(e) has required this for as long as I’ve been in the US (which is since 2004). To be more specific: >> (e) Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him pursuant to subsection (d). Any alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both. Where evidence of registration is an I94 or a green card or whatever. I’m constantly surprised how many permanent residents don’t do this.
- smsm42 1y ago
  Many don't do this because they don't feel the need. I've spent about a decade in the US as a green card holder, and the only cases I ever been asked for it is either crossing the border or being hired. And I never heard about anyone being fined (let alone going to prison) for failure to carry the green card on them. Yes, the law says that, but I don't think anybody paid much attention to that, at least until now.
  - TechDebtDevin 1y ago
    You act as if the last 6 months are a continuation of the the last 9.5 years, and there is some status quo that hasn't changed. Maybe for an affluent SWE in his Tesla, but this isn't the case for many on their way to work in a construction work van.
    - smsm42 1y ago
      > this isn't the case for many on their way to work in a construction work van. How many of those van-traveling green card holding construction workers have been fined or imprisoned for failure to carry the green card lately? I don't mean brief detention - anybody can be detained by the police, especially when not having any identification - I mean actual conviction under 1304(e) and court-assigned fine or jail time. How many such cases do you know?

proberts 1y ago

The best defense so to speak is to carry evidence of your status whether that's a green card or foreign passport and I-94 admission record, to have the number of a local immigration attorney whom you can call if you need to, and to be aware of one's rights. The ACLU has a good discussion of these rights: https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/immigrants-rights https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/immigrants-rights.

kjellsbells 1y ago
What would you recommend for foreign born US citizens worried about being approached by ICE? What are the basic ground rules for interacting? For example, some of us here look very much like we didnt grow up in an Iowa cornfield and have genuine concern that one negative interaction is going to result in being roughed up by untrained ICE agents at best and tossed into jail or worse. Do we just get used to the idea of carrying our passport at all times? Is an ICE agent authorized to demand it and take it from us "for checking", say? Bar two pieces of fragile paper - a passport and a naturalization certificate - it's not obvious that a citizen is a citizen.
- somanyphotons 1y ago
  (I'm not Peter) I'd suggest also applying for a Passport Card, you can keep it in your wallet.
- smsm42 1y ago
  Carry a REAL-ID enabled state ID? Those are not available to illegals in any state. All newer state IDs AFAIK are REAL-ID enabled by default. And you probably will need to use some form of ID anyway pretty frequently.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - kjellsbells 1y ago
    Thats a good idea, although it is not completely robust. REAL-ID only proves that the holder had legal presence at the time of issue, not that the holder maintains legal presence at the point of presenting it to the ICE officer. For example, holders of Temporary Protected Status would have been here perfectly legally and been able to get and hold a REAL ID. But their status has just been revoked. So an ICE officer could still refuse to accept it as proof of legal status.

bc569a80a344f9c 1y ago

It’s a legal requirement to carry your green card with you at all times. INA 264(e) has required this for as long as I’ve been in the US (which is since 2004). To be more specific: >> (e) Every alien, eighteen years of age and over, shall at all times carry with him and have in his personal possession any certificate of alien registration or alien registration receipt card issued to him pursuant to subsection (d). Any alien who fails to comply with the provisions of this subsection shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and shall upon conviction for each offense be fined not to exceed $100 or be imprisoned not more than thirty days, or both. Where evidence of registration is an I94 or a green card or whatever. I’m constantly surprised how many permanent residents don’t do this.

smsm42 1y ago
Many don't do this because they don't feel the need. I've spent about a decade in the US as a green card holder, and the only cases I ever been asked for it is either crossing the border or being hired. And I never heard about anyone being fined (let alone going to prison) for failure to carry the green card on them. Yes, the law says that, but I don't think anybody paid much attention to that, at least until now.
- TechDebtDevin 1y ago
  You act as if the last 6 months are a continuation of the the last 9.5 years, and there is some status quo that hasn't changed. Maybe for an affluent SWE in his Tesla, but this isn't the case for many on their way to work in a construction work van.
  - smsm42 1y ago
    > this isn't the case for many on their way to work in a construction work van. How many of those van-traveling green card holding construction workers have been fined or imprisoned for failure to carry the green card lately? I don't mean brief detention - anybody can be detained by the police, especially when not having any identification - I mean actual conviction under 1304(e) and court-assigned fine or jail time. How many such cases do you know?