4 ms·

I Never Cared Much for Swords. Then I Had to Fight with One

47 points by pseudolus 1y ago

failrate 1y ago
I recommend @robinswords on YouTube for historical fencing.
cjs_ac 1y ago
The thing about martial arts is that they work: if you do them properly, you're going to kill someone (or be killed). Every group that does stuff with swords, therefore, has to sacrifice something to ensure that everyone can have fun again next week. In HEMA, it's the aesthetic that's sacrificed: we (I'm one of them) wear gear that makes us look like modern riot police, but the weapons are (at the very least) historically weighted, and the techniques are from historical fencing manuals. There's a lot of arguing over the interpretation of medieval manuscripts in the community. Re-enactment groups wear historical clothing, so they have to reduce the scope of their combat: they typically disallow strikes to the head, for example. The Society for Creative Anachronism dispense with everything but the aesthetic of history, and consequently have the most fun.
- eviks 1y ago
  Maybe in the future you could have no sacrifices by fighting a android that is programmed not to hit strongly enough to inflict harm, and is too tough to be "killed" itself even in regular armor...
  - cjs_ac 1y ago
    All of these things are inherently social activities. The fact that you're up against another human being is what makes it fun.
    - eviks 1y ago
      It will still be a social activity! Nothing here forces lonely 1-1 battles, it's just that you'll only be able to fight full force with a selected android subgroup from the other side if it's some historic battle reenactment
      - cjs_ac 1y ago
        HEMA is about recreating what's described in the historical manuscripts, which is almost always 1v1 stuff. Examples here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91IIARM5lVs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91IIARM5lVs
  - echelon 1y ago
    Or by being part of the brain upload simulation and unable to die.
    - eviks 1y ago
      Nah, that's pure fiction...
  - latexr 1y ago
    That would be equivalent to only being able to play chess against a computer, so plenty of people would be left unsatisfied. That said, I like the direction you’re going. Since we’re going the science fiction route of letting imagination run wild, perhaps the solution could lay in the sword itself. Picture something superficially indistinguishable from the real thing made from an equivalent to nanobots which remain tight and hard against each other but immediately let go and “shatter” when struck against something else. You could bang and clash swords in fierce battle, but as soon as you would deal a severe blow against your opponent your weapon would break and deal no real damage (but still count as a win). That could be intensely satisfying and lead to great moments.
  - yencabulator 1y ago
    > that is programmed not to hit strongly enough to inflict harm The difference between an attack that is hard to defend and an attack that will hurt if it succeeds is very slim.
    - eviks 1y ago
      ... for a human A robot has more strength and reaction to stop / reroute a successful attack
      - yencabulator 1y ago
        It's a tough sensory problem. In the world of non-weapons (which I'm more familiar with), say a kick needs to go into the space my body was occupying a moment ago, or avoiding it is not realistic.
      - kbelder 1y ago
        A hypothetical future robot may. Right now, anything with the strength to wave a heavy stick is a threat to be around.
- amelius 1y ago
  More generally, someone who plays with swords is more likely to die by a sword than any random person. Therefore, maybe better to stay away from them.
  - some_random 1y ago
    Yeah and someone who swims at the beach is more likely to drown than any random person.
    - vkou 1y ago
      There's an old Soviet proverb. Those who don't know how to swim don't drown.
      - falcor84 1y ago
        I suppose the average person in Soviet Russia didn't go sailing that much.
  - falcor84 1y ago
    As with any physical activity, a person who plays with swords every week likely significantly reduces their all-cause mortality compared to spending that time sedentary. So if that's your jam and gets you active, enjoy it.
- SAI_Peregrinus 1y ago
  Of course some people participate in multiple groups. It's more expensive: modern HEMA gear isn't cheap, period-accurate armor & clothing isn't cheap, getting both is thus a lot of added expense.
- bryanlarsen 1y ago
  Keep going, please. Olympic fencing obviously sacrifices something, but as a layman I'd have trouble describing it. Kendo uses wooden swords, does it sacrifice anything else? Would practitioners be proficient in HEMA and vice versa? Another widely practiced sword art is stage combat. Obviously it has a different focus, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone well trained in stage combat could perform well against the average poorly trained swordsman.
  - djtango 1y ago
    Kendo and Fencing are both sports. For starters a shinai is way lighter than a real sword, even an iaito is usually lighter than a real sword. The "meta" then evolves around a might faster and lighter style. Slicing with a katana is also very technical, if you've ever watched tameshigiri being able to properly cut is much more than just scoring a point. Kendo tries to simulate that in its subjective judging parameters, but having your attacks properly cut will be a different technique than sport Kendo. In real life warfare knowing how to not get your weapon jammed in an opponent is important for survival but is very hard to practice in modern day life... Edit: as an analogue: if you learn boxing or muay thai, first you learn how to hit a bag properly. Then you spend 10-100x longer figuring out how to execute those techniques in an actual fight. Then you watch a master like Canelo or Tawanchai work their beautiful art and feel depressed
  - cjs_ac 1y ago
    Olympic fencing has very well-defined rules, and so is a poor reflection of actual combat. You can lose a point in fencing just because it wasn't your turn to attack. Kendo is highly ritualised, and therefore has the same problems. The shinai (bamboo swords) also behave very differently to actual swords. I forgot to mention bohurt/buhurt, which, as far as I can tell, is just Eastern European chaps donning plate armour and giving each other concussions with pollaxes.
    - gadders 1y ago
      Just googled it. Buhurt looks pretty close to what I imagine the Melee was like at a medieval tournament. https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2023-07-10/medieval-combat-sport-buhurt-is-a-human-demolition-derby-with-full-armor-swords-axes https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2023-07-10/mediev...
- hermitcrab 1y ago
  There is also the madness that is armoured MMA or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Medieval_Combat_Federation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Medieval_Combat_... . They don't seem to sacrifice much, apart from points and sharp edges. But they seem to have a fair few concussions and broken bones, as a result. If you have never seen it, have a look on YouTube. It's pretty mad. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq4vADoT9pQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq4vADoT9pQ
- djtango 1y ago
  HEMA is great but I always find myself wondering what it would be like if there was no tennis and Federer, Nadal and Djokovic were all born into HEMA - like what would combat look like if we put weapons into the hands of the greatest 1vs1 athletes of all time.
pseudolus 1y ago
"One of Farley Chevrier’s go-to books is a 1736 treatise by Pierre Jacques François Girard, a former French navy officer, which includes twelve essential tips on how to save one’s life. The book is part of seventy documents that were digitized and shared online by the French HEMA federation". Link to a scan of 1736 treatise: https://www.ffamhe.fr/collectionpalas/nouveau-traite-girard.pdf https://www.ffamhe.fr/collectionpalas/nouveau-traite-girard.... (even if you don't read French, the text includes numerous diagrams) Link to a directory listing the various texts digitized by the French HEMA federation: https://www.ffamhe.fr/collection_palas/ https://www.ffamhe.fr/collection_palas/ (clicking on any of the links will take you to a page with more detail. To download the document click on the link beside the text that says "Pour télécharger la numérisation, cliquez sur ce lien").
- hermitcrab 1y ago
  Illustration 81 is quite strange, with it's behind the back thrust. Slightly reminiscent of the awkward shots pool players sometimes do!
KaiserPro 1y ago
If you want to try sword fighting there are a bunch of ways to do it. HEMA people are generally very welcoming and probably slightly mad. quite expensive to get into, but great fun. Fencing is more common, but start out with epee, foil is a big weird as you have right of way, its a training system and it shows, its harder to learn and not as fun. Sabre is for people who like shouting lots, more one hit wonder. For the eastern styles: A good Aikido class should start out with weapons, you wont be going full speed as even with wooden sticks, stuff gets dangerous pretty quick. Korean sword work is going through somewhat of a renaissance, I don't know that much about it though. If you're doing eastern style sword work, don't be tempted to get a metal sword, you'll never be able to train with it, and they are almost always poor quality. (unless you know what you're doing)
- yial 1y ago
  I would disagree about starting with epee. But that may be a bias about form. I fenced 4-5 times a week for about 10 years, even teaching and was at one point ranked. Our policy was to start people on foil with a strong focus on form for usually about a year before moving to Sabre or epee. Of course, we also usually started people with a French grip, and wrist up vs sideways. One goal for example would be in lunge practice to have a penny or dime a few inches in front of your shoe, and have that go flying without your shoe hitting the floor. I agree with you though that epee is the most fun, and also the most realistic. The right of way in foil is not realistic. Furthermore, I always disliked Sabre as it is very showy but not nearly as enjoyable. In short, foil to learn initial form and practice, and then move to epee. (I realize the arm position difference can create a challenge for some there ) “Foil is art, Sabre is theater, epee is truth”.
  - blackguardx 1y ago
    In Epee, if you poke someone in the toe, it "kills" them. Not sure it is any more realistic than foil.
    - some_random 1y ago
      It's a duel to first blood.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
bilsbie 1y ago
I remember reading that swords were more the weapon of choice for portability but spears were more effective in a fight?
- krapp 1y ago
  Yes. All else being equal, reach and leverage win every time. Even the samurai considered their swords to be secondary to spears and bows, and preferred to fight on horseback rather than in the trenches (because they weren't stupid,) and then picked up guns as soon as they were viable.
- some_random 1y ago
  There are a whole lot of different types of swords, but in general spears and polearms are more effective combat tools. I like to use the modern analogy of pistols and rifles, rifles are objectively superior combat arms in pretty much every way but anyone who can get away with not carrying one carries a handgun instead.
- gadders 1y ago
  Lindy Beige did an interesting video on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLLv8E2pWdk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLLv8E2pWdk But the gist is it seemed spears won more of the simulated combats.
- hermitcrab 1y ago
  You probably don't want to be standing between 2 people swinging swords on a battlefield. A spear (or polearm) is a better choice for massed infantry. The extra range of the spear is also useful. Spears are also much quicker, easier and cheaper to make than swords. Some of the allure of swords perhaps comes from the fact that they are the shape of a Christian cross.
sgt101 1y ago
A guy called Steve Paul coached me for a few years, the connection is that he was Peirce Brosnans double in Die another Day. He got motor neuron disease just before covid and the poor old sod fell down some stairs when he was on holiday and died. Irony can sometimes be a bit harsh. Fencing was such a big part of my life for so long, but when I got to my late 30's the power went out of my body. It was shocking, but just true, I couldn't do what I used to be able to do when I was young and I had to come to terms with it. A lot of people go into coaching, or make their peace and fence as a veteran, but I couldn't do that. It took me a long time to grasp why because I used to coach when I was competitive, so why could I not abide it when I knew I could not compete. The answer was not attractive. I envy the young. I cannot stand to watch them and know I am not one of them. If you are young then take up swords, or racquets, or gloves and revel in your sinuous power. Soon it will be gone, and all you will have is memory, until something comes sliding and slipping and takes even that, and you find yourself tumbling into the night.
- hermitcrab 1y ago
  >when I got to my late 30's the power went out of my body Do you mean strength? Obviously everyone is different. But from my experience in martial arts, men in their 40s, 50s and even 60s are still plenty strong. But you do lose a bit of flexibility and speed as you get older.
  - sgt101 1y ago
    Maybe it's different for other people, but I just couldn't move the way I used to, I had less gas, less snap, my reactions were poorer. There's a thing of power coming from your gut/core... that's what lets you really move and use leverage, and that really faded. Competing with guys in their mid twenties was the shocker. I guess that there's a think where experience and training builds advantage but then you go over a cliff where the physical difference just overwhelms that. Look, we don't see professional athletes in their 40's much if at all. Mike Tyson was the best fighter (ever?) and looked in shocking good shape - but he still lost to that goon.
    - 1y ago
javier_e06 1y ago
In Tai Chi one should master the hand form before taking the sword. Done right, all threats are met with minimum or no harm.
- gadders 1y ago
  I think we can all agree you're not at much risk of harm against a Tai Chi practioner.
- rasz 1y ago
  Why would Bullshido carry any weight in this conversation?
hermitcrab 1y ago
"In order to have a competition, you need rules. So you’re getting further and further from a true martial art, and you’re getting into a sport" Which is all too clear, if you watch the pitiful and embarrassing spectacle that is an Olympic Taekwondo match.
hermitcrab 1y ago
It's a shame that the west lost much of it's martial heritage, and is now having to reconstruct it from old manuals. Whereas some Asian arts have been handed down from generation to generation, in an unbroken tradition, for hundreds of years (e.g. Japanese Jui-Jitsu).

47 points by pseudolus 1y ago

I recommend @robinswords on YouTube for historical fencing.

The thing about martial arts is that they work: if you do them properly, you're going to kill someone (or be killed). Every group that does stuff with swords, therefore, has to sacrifice something to ensure that everyone can have fun again next week. In HEMA, it's the aesthetic that's sacrificed: we (I'm one of them) wear gear that makes us look like modern riot police, but the weapons are (at the very least) historically weighted, and the techniques are from historical fencing manuals. There's a lot of arguing over the interpretation of medieval manuscripts in the community. Re-enactment groups wear historical clothing, so they have to reduce the scope of their combat: they typically disallow strikes to the head, for example. The Society for Creative Anachronism dispense with everything but the aesthetic of history, and consequently have the most fun.

eviks 1y ago
Maybe in the future you could have no sacrifices by fighting a android that is programmed not to hit strongly enough to inflict harm, and is too tough to be "killed" itself even in regular armor...
- cjs_ac 1y ago
  All of these things are inherently social activities. The fact that you're up against another human being is what makes it fun.
  - eviks 1y ago
    It will still be a social activity! Nothing here forces lonely 1-1 battles, it's just that you'll only be able to fight full force with a selected android subgroup from the other side if it's some historic battle reenactment
    - cjs_ac 1y ago
      HEMA is about recreating what's described in the historical manuscripts, which is almost always 1v1 stuff. Examples here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91IIARM5lVs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=91IIARM5lVs
- echelon 1y ago
  Or by being part of the brain upload simulation and unable to die.
  - eviks 1y ago
    Nah, that's pure fiction...
- latexr 1y ago
  That would be equivalent to only being able to play chess against a computer, so plenty of people would be left unsatisfied. That said, I like the direction you’re going. Since we’re going the science fiction route of letting imagination run wild, perhaps the solution could lay in the sword itself. Picture something superficially indistinguishable from the real thing made from an equivalent to nanobots which remain tight and hard against each other but immediately let go and “shatter” when struck against something else. You could bang and clash swords in fierce battle, but as soon as you would deal a severe blow against your opponent your weapon would break and deal no real damage (but still count as a win). That could be intensely satisfying and lead to great moments.
- yencabulator 1y ago
  > that is programmed not to hit strongly enough to inflict harm The difference between an attack that is hard to defend and an attack that will hurt if it succeeds is very slim.
  - eviks 1y ago
    ... for a human A robot has more strength and reaction to stop / reroute a successful attack
    - yencabulator 1y ago
      It's a tough sensory problem. In the world of non-weapons (which I'm more familiar with), say a kick needs to go into the space my body was occupying a moment ago, or avoiding it is not realistic.
    - kbelder 1y ago
      A hypothetical future robot may. Right now, anything with the strength to wave a heavy stick is a threat to be around.
amelius 1y ago
More generally, someone who plays with swords is more likely to die by a sword than any random person. Therefore, maybe better to stay away from them.
- some_random 1y ago
  Yeah and someone who swims at the beach is more likely to drown than any random person.
  - vkou 1y ago
    There's an old Soviet proverb. Those who don't know how to swim don't drown.
    - falcor84 1y ago
      I suppose the average person in Soviet Russia didn't go sailing that much.
- falcor84 1y ago
  As with any physical activity, a person who plays with swords every week likely significantly reduces their all-cause mortality compared to spending that time sedentary. So if that's your jam and gets you active, enjoy it.
SAI_Peregrinus 1y ago
Of course some people participate in multiple groups. It's more expensive: modern HEMA gear isn't cheap, period-accurate armor & clothing isn't cheap, getting both is thus a lot of added expense.
bryanlarsen 1y ago
Keep going, please. Olympic fencing obviously sacrifices something, but as a layman I'd have trouble describing it. Kendo uses wooden swords, does it sacrifice anything else? Would practitioners be proficient in HEMA and vice versa? Another widely practiced sword art is stage combat. Obviously it has a different focus, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone well trained in stage combat could perform well against the average poorly trained swordsman.
- djtango 1y ago
  Kendo and Fencing are both sports. For starters a shinai is way lighter than a real sword, even an iaito is usually lighter than a real sword. The "meta" then evolves around a might faster and lighter style. Slicing with a katana is also very technical, if you've ever watched tameshigiri being able to properly cut is much more than just scoring a point. Kendo tries to simulate that in its subjective judging parameters, but having your attacks properly cut will be a different technique than sport Kendo. In real life warfare knowing how to not get your weapon jammed in an opponent is important for survival but is very hard to practice in modern day life... Edit: as an analogue: if you learn boxing or muay thai, first you learn how to hit a bag properly. Then you spend 10-100x longer figuring out how to execute those techniques in an actual fight. Then you watch a master like Canelo or Tawanchai work their beautiful art and feel depressed
- cjs_ac 1y ago
  Olympic fencing has very well-defined rules, and so is a poor reflection of actual combat. You can lose a point in fencing just because it wasn't your turn to attack. Kendo is highly ritualised, and therefore has the same problems. The shinai (bamboo swords) also behave very differently to actual swords. I forgot to mention bohurt/buhurt, which, as far as I can tell, is just Eastern European chaps donning plate armour and giving each other concussions with pollaxes.
  - gadders 1y ago
    Just googled it. Buhurt looks pretty close to what I imagine the Melee was like at a medieval tournament. https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2023-07-10/medieval-combat-sport-buhurt-is-a-human-demolition-derby-with-full-armor-swords-axes https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2023-07-10/mediev...
hermitcrab 1y ago
There is also the madness that is armoured MMA or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Medieval_Combat_Federation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Medieval_Combat_... . They don't seem to sacrifice much, apart from points and sharp edges. But they seem to have a fair few concussions and broken bones, as a result. If you have never seen it, have a look on YouTube. It's pretty mad. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq4vADoT9pQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq4vADoT9pQ
djtango 1y ago
HEMA is great but I always find myself wondering what it would be like if there was no tennis and Federer, Nadal and Djokovic were all born into HEMA - like what would combat look like if we put weapons into the hands of the greatest 1vs1 athletes of all time.

pseudolus 1y ago

"One of Farley Chevrier’s go-to books is a 1736 treatise by Pierre Jacques François Girard, a former French navy officer, which includes twelve essential tips on how to save one’s life. The book is part of seventy documents that were digitized and shared online by the French HEMA federation". Link to a scan of 1736 treatise: https://www.ffamhe.fr/collectionpalas/nouveau-traite-girard.pdf https://www.ffamhe.fr/collectionpalas/nouveau-traite-girard.... (even if you don't read French, the text includes numerous diagrams) Link to a directory listing the various texts digitized by the French HEMA federation: https://www.ffamhe.fr/collection_palas/ https://www.ffamhe.fr/collection_palas/ (clicking on any of the links will take you to a page with more detail. To download the document click on the link beside the text that says "Pour télécharger la numérisation, cliquez sur ce lien").

hermitcrab 1y ago
Illustration 81 is quite strange, with it's behind the back thrust. Slightly reminiscent of the awkward shots pool players sometimes do!

KaiserPro 1y ago

If you want to try sword fighting there are a bunch of ways to do it. HEMA people are generally very welcoming and probably slightly mad. quite expensive to get into, but great fun. Fencing is more common, but start out with epee, foil is a big weird as you have right of way, its a training system and it shows, its harder to learn and not as fun. Sabre is for people who like shouting lots, more one hit wonder. For the eastern styles: A good Aikido class should start out with weapons, you wont be going full speed as even with wooden sticks, stuff gets dangerous pretty quick. Korean sword work is going through somewhat of a renaissance, I don't know that much about it though. If you're doing eastern style sword work, don't be tempted to get a metal sword, you'll never be able to train with it, and they are almost always poor quality. (unless you know what you're doing)

yial 1y ago
I would disagree about starting with epee. But that may be a bias about form. I fenced 4-5 times a week for about 10 years, even teaching and was at one point ranked. Our policy was to start people on foil with a strong focus on form for usually about a year before moving to Sabre or epee. Of course, we also usually started people with a French grip, and wrist up vs sideways. One goal for example would be in lunge practice to have a penny or dime a few inches in front of your shoe, and have that go flying without your shoe hitting the floor. I agree with you though that epee is the most fun, and also the most realistic. The right of way in foil is not realistic. Furthermore, I always disliked Sabre as it is very showy but not nearly as enjoyable. In short, foil to learn initial form and practice, and then move to epee. (I realize the arm position difference can create a challenge for some there ) “Foil is art, Sabre is theater, epee is truth”.
- blackguardx 1y ago
  In Epee, if you poke someone in the toe, it "kills" them. Not sure it is any more realistic than foil.
  - some_random 1y ago
    It's a duel to first blood.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

bilsbie 1y ago

I remember reading that swords were more the weapon of choice for portability but spears were more effective in a fight?

krapp 1y ago
Yes. All else being equal, reach and leverage win every time. Even the samurai considered their swords to be secondary to spears and bows, and preferred to fight on horseback rather than in the trenches (because they weren't stupid,) and then picked up guns as soon as they were viable.
some_random 1y ago
There are a whole lot of different types of swords, but in general spears and polearms are more effective combat tools. I like to use the modern analogy of pistols and rifles, rifles are objectively superior combat arms in pretty much every way but anyone who can get away with not carrying one carries a handgun instead.
gadders 1y ago
Lindy Beige did an interesting video on this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLLv8E2pWdk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLLv8E2pWdk But the gist is it seemed spears won more of the simulated combats.
hermitcrab 1y ago
You probably don't want to be standing between 2 people swinging swords on a battlefield. A spear (or polearm) is a better choice for massed infantry. The extra range of the spear is also useful. Spears are also much quicker, easier and cheaper to make than swords. Some of the allure of swords perhaps comes from the fact that they are the shape of a Christian cross.

sgt101 1y ago

A guy called Steve Paul coached me for a few years, the connection is that he was Peirce Brosnans double in Die another Day. He got motor neuron disease just before covid and the poor old sod fell down some stairs when he was on holiday and died. Irony can sometimes be a bit harsh. Fencing was such a big part of my life for so long, but when I got to my late 30's the power went out of my body. It was shocking, but just true, I couldn't do what I used to be able to do when I was young and I had to come to terms with it. A lot of people go into coaching, or make their peace and fence as a veteran, but I couldn't do that. It took me a long time to grasp why because I used to coach when I was competitive, so why could I not abide it when I knew I could not compete. The answer was not attractive. I envy the young. I cannot stand to watch them and know I am not one of them. If you are young then take up swords, or racquets, or gloves and revel in your sinuous power. Soon it will be gone, and all you will have is memory, until something comes sliding and slipping and takes even that, and you find yourself tumbling into the night.

hermitcrab 1y ago
>when I got to my late 30's the power went out of my body Do you mean strength? Obviously everyone is different. But from my experience in martial arts, men in their 40s, 50s and even 60s are still plenty strong. But you do lose a bit of flexibility and speed as you get older.
- sgt101 1y ago
  Maybe it's different for other people, but I just couldn't move the way I used to, I had less gas, less snap, my reactions were poorer. There's a thing of power coming from your gut/core... that's what lets you really move and use leverage, and that really faded. Competing with guys in their mid twenties was the shocker. I guess that there's a think where experience and training builds advantage but then you go over a cliff where the physical difference just overwhelms that. Look, we don't see professional athletes in their 40's much if at all. Mike Tyson was the best fighter (ever?) and looked in shocking good shape - but he still lost to that goon.
  - 1y ago

javier_e06 1y ago

In Tai Chi one should master the hand form before taking the sword. Done right, all threats are met with minimum or no harm.

gadders 1y ago
I think we can all agree you're not at much risk of harm against a Tai Chi practioner.
rasz 1y ago
Why would Bullshido carry any weight in this conversation?

hermitcrab 1y ago

"In order to have a competition, you need rules. So you’re getting further and further from a true martial art, and you’re getting into a sport" Which is all too clear, if you watch the pitiful and embarrassing spectacle that is an Olympic Taekwondo match.

hermitcrab 1y ago

It's a shame that the west lost much of it's martial heritage, and is now having to reconstruct it from old manuals. Whereas some Asian arts have been handed down from generation to generation, in an unbroken tradition, for hundreds of years (e.g. Japanese Jui-Jitsu).