8 ms·

related post from few months ago: https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/21819-impact-of-ongoing-war-on-grapheneos-development https://discuss.grapheneos.org/d/21819-

• bawolff 1y ago
  I mean, afaik there is only one country in the world that is at war and is using conscription (as opposed to reserve forces or voluntary paid contracts)
  • defrost 1y ago
    At least five .. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Israel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Israel https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Ukraine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Ukraine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Russia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Russia https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/4/11/myanmars-military-drafts-thousands-in-first-year-of-conscription-drive https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/4/11/myanmars-military-d... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Sudan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Sudan
    • longfingers 1y ago
      I thought the existential question was the level of doublespeak. Does the country call it war?
      • strcat 1y ago
        See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
    • wiseowise 1y ago
      Only one of those is fighting existential war.
      • bawolff 1y ago
        All of those countries describe the wars in question to their own citizens as existential. It might be bullshit, but that doesn't really change the fact that people within each and every one of those countries may very well view them as existential. That's basically war propaganda 101 - the war is defensive and existential.
        • deleted 1y ago
          [deleted]
        • RandomThoughts3 1y ago
          [dead]
        • wiseowise 1y ago
          Supposedly we’re talking about an actual existential threat, e.g. Russia occupying Ukraine.
          • dontleakkeys 1y ago
            What we're talking about is the GrapheneOS account claiming someone was conscripted, and claiming that it's an "existential and defensive" war. I assume this is basically true and that it's probably Ukraine or maybe Israel, but the way they're talking about how everyone is against them and sabotaging them makes me think we may not be dealing with a reliable narrator. I assume that there's truth to what they're saying and that they probably were swatted, and that's awful. But it doesn't feel right to me. Being betrayed seems to be a consistent part of the narrative GrapheneOS presents about itself. It's even in the history section on their website.
            • strcat 1y ago
              > What we're talking about is the GrapheneOS account claiming someone was conscripted, and claiming that it's an "existential and defensive" war. Our lead developer was conscripted. > I assume this is basically true and that it's probably Ukraine or maybe Israel We made it clear enough it was Ukraine and later publicly confirmed it multiple times once it wasn't going to cause any issues. > but the way they're talking about how everyone is against them and sabotaging them makes me think we may not be dealing with a reliable narrator. We've never said everyone is against us. You're misrepresenting our statements. You appear to be alluding to ongoing harassment which baselessly claims that I'm insane, delusional, schizophrenic, etc. Phrasing it the way you did doesn't absolve you of responsibility for participating in it. > I assume that there's truth to what they're saying and that they probably were swatted, and that's awful. What we've said about these topics is completely accurate and your attempt at misconstruing it and sowing doubt is wrong. > But it doesn't feel right to me. Okay, so you have unfounded theories based on vibes. > Being betrayed seems to be a consistent part of the narrative GrapheneOS presents about itself. It's even in the history section on their website. The information we've provided about these topics including about Copperhead's takeover attempt on the project in 2018 is accurate. Our lead developer being a Ukrainian man is easy enough to see from GitHub. They went from by far the most active developer to completely inactive after being forcibly conscripted at the start of April. They're now able to contribute a little bit in their free time again.
    • bawolff 1y ago
      As far as i know, Russia mostly stopped using conscription for the ukraine war effort after popular discontent, and now mostly only uses conscripts internally, with most of the russian soldiers fighting in Ukraine being offered large sums of money to "volunteer". I was initially assuming Israel was relying on reserves for the current war, which seems to be true, but it also sounds like being in the reserves is mandatory so i guess that is conscription with extra steps. Anyways, i guess your broad point is right.
      • throwaway290 1y ago
        > Russia mostly stopped using conscription Some draftees are made sign the contract not just with large sums of money but also force/torture. I am told it happens almost dsily and knowing a bit what russian army is like I think it is likely. Probably more likely if you are non-slavic guy from the regions and not a big city This story is about a guy who was arrested for theft or something and was "offered" contract. Apparently cops get 100000 rub reward for one guy who they "convince". https://meduza.io/feature/2025/07/13/dozhd-18-letnego-dagestantsa-saida-murtazalieva-pod-pytkami-zastavili-podpisat-kontrakt-na-fronte-on-propal https://meduza.io/feature/2025/07/13/dozhd-18-letnego-dagest...
        • strcat 1y ago
          See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
          • throwaway290 1y ago
            Sorry how is it related to russia forcing draftees into contract to be sent to frontlines again?
            • strcat 1y ago
              Our lead developer wasn't conscripted by Russia and I wanted to make sure that was clear to everyone.
    • Ekaros 1y ago
      I think both Koreas technically qualify. Even if it is cold war at this point.
    • strcat 1y ago
      See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
  • pyuser583 1y ago
    There are two that come two mind, but one has fairly short terms of duty of to balance these kinds of obligations.
    • strcat 1y ago
      See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
  • strcat 1y ago
    See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
• tonyhart7 1y ago
  why they don't just said outright??? is that controversial??
  • adastra22 1y ago
    There is no upside for them and their users, and lots of potential downside.
  • wiseowise 1y ago
    Afraid to trigger Russian bots? Afraid of backlash in Ukraine? Afraid to “pick a side” in the conflict? Even though the guy is obviously on the right side of history, it might be problematic for project like Graphene to acknowledge it.
    • strcat 1y ago
      See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
  • spankibalt 1y ago
    It also opens the door to possibly inconvenient discussions with speculations about Graphene's security (referring to both products and org) in relation to, say, Israel, its military, as well as its associated espionage and sabotage efforts (e. g. Pegasus). The same swings the other way around, i. e. Graphene protecting its devs against any outside threats. Etc.
    • Hizonner 1y ago
      Are you OK? You don't sound OK.
    • strcat 1y ago
      It has nothing to do with Israel. See the response at https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44583672.
• colordrops 1y ago
  Could be the Israeli army, considering the graphene logo may be a nod to the Star of David.
  • ThePowerOfFuet 1y ago
    The logo is a nod to graphene.
    • dontleakkeys 1y ago
      And it was founded by a Canadian.
    • colordrops 1y ago
      No, it's exactly graphene, which could (I didn't say is) be a nod to the Star of David.
      • dontleakkeys 1y ago
        If you have a clear and satisfying explanation in your mind about why a logo has 6-fold symmetry, and still suggest that it is secretly a star of David, I start to get worried about the direction the conversation will go. Even if that isn't how you meant it, there's an audience very willing to receive it that way and they make poor company. Let's keep things on the rails and not get the story flagged.
        • colordrops 1y ago
          Thats absurd. There is no inherently positive or negative connotation to religious symbolism. It happens everywhere, in paintings, books, movies, logos. It's fine, and there's nothing wrong with it. If your mind goes to dark places then that's your problem. I prefer to cut off dialog when problems actually arise, rather than in anticipation of hallucinated problems, Mr. Green Name.
  • bugtodiffer 1y ago
    it said "defensive"
• strcat 1y ago
  > I will follow their wishes and not specify the specific war or side, but this comment gives me all the information to figure it out. The primary goal of making it public was getting him diverted away from infantry to a role related to software engineering and/or security research. It makes little to send the lead developer of a security research and engineering project to launch grenades from a trench. We got in contact with high level people who were able to intervene after he completed 45 days of basic training. He had to do several weeks of menial tasks and was just recently transferred to a more sensible tech related role. We're still down our most important developer. We deliberately made it obvious which country we were talking about without directly specifying it. A Russian opposition paper did the basic investigative journalism required to confirm what we implied: https://meduza.io/feature/2025/04/22/veduschego-razrabotchika-grapheneos-samoy-bezopasnoy-v-mire-operatsionnoy-sistemy-dlya-smartfonov-prinuditelno-mobilizovali-i-otpravili-na-voynu https://meduza.io/feature/2025/04/22/veduschego-razrabotchik... The way we approached it worked out well. It was an appeal to their military leadership based on it not being in their interest to use him as infantry, not a political statement. Ukraine forcibly conscripting men aged 25 through 60 to defend against an invader trying to wipe out their nationality is a messy topic. We had to publicly post about it to get help, that's all.