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The LCOE of solar/wind is the cheapest but it does not seem to be common knowledge. The lack of common knowledge often is some kind of polarised political belie

The LCOE of solar/wind is the cheapest but it does not seem to be common knowledge. The lack of common knowledge often is some kind of polarised political beliefs, from what I've seen Marginal pricing seems to be a large part of the problem when the general public do not see the benefit of this green revolution that's been going a long time. In the UK part of the payment is for social/environmental factors. It's about time the state awarded people that have already done that instead of paying marginal prices.

phtrivier 1y ago
LCOE is only fair with storage taken into account, which is hard because storage does not necessarily exist in capacities to make a comparison with non intermittent sources relevant. The joke is that the LCOE of solar is "Infinity / kWh" at night if the battery is empty, "-Infinity / kWh" at noon if the reservoir is full, and "NaN / kWh" when there is not enough câbles. That being said, the answer to "which carbon -light electricity source should we build ?" is "YES". I, too, long for the days where we have batteries massive enough to not even care any more.
- gpm 1y ago
  This was true a couple of years ago. This is no longer true. Storage has become a lot cheaper very rapidly. The LCOE of solar with storage covering the night is now competitive.
  - phtrivier 1y ago
    Not entirely sure: everywhere I read about solar + storage, there are huge errors bars. Eg : https://www.lazard.com/media/eijnqja3/lazards-lcoeplus-june-2025.pdf https://www.lazard.com/media/eijnqja3/lazards-lcoeplus-june-... Solar+storage : from 50$/MWh to... 131$/MWh ! Go make a decision with something like that. The trend is clear, for sure, and it will make sense to extrapolate... Up to a point, as usual. (baring one of the "breakthroughs" that make it to the HN top page on e in a while and never materialize... Sigh)
  - IshKebab 1y ago
    Night, sure. Doesn't work in winter though. (Not that that means we should stop building solar - we're still far from the point where it wouldn't make sense to build any more solar because we can't store the energy.)
    - gpm 1y ago
      If you're bordering on the article circle, yes. Otherwise you just have to overbuild a bit more.
      - IshKebab 1y ago
        I live in the UK. The ratio between solar output on a typically sunny summer day and a typical cloudy winter day is about 20. So your "a bit" is doing a hell of a lot of work there.
        nasmorn 1y ago
        Globally seen the Uk is close to the arctic circle. It is one of the worst cases
        IshKebab 1y ago
        Right but it's not exactly the latitude that's the issue. On sunny days in winter I get plenty of power. The issue is the weather - only about 1/3 of the days in winter are sunny.
        gpm 1y ago
        Yeah, my comment was a simplification - like most things trying to describe local effects globally are. The UK doubles as unusually cloudy weather and relatively short days.

phtrivier 1y ago

LCOE is only fair with storage taken into account, which is hard because storage does not necessarily exist in capacities to make a comparison with non intermittent sources relevant. The joke is that the LCOE of solar is "Infinity / kWh" at night if the battery is empty, "-Infinity / kWh" at noon if the reservoir is full, and "NaN / kWh" when there is not enough câbles. That being said, the answer to "which carbon -light electricity source should we build ?" is "YES". I, too, long for the days where we have batteries massive enough to not even care any more.

gpm 1y ago
This was true a couple of years ago. This is no longer true. Storage has become a lot cheaper very rapidly. The LCOE of solar with storage covering the night is now competitive.
- phtrivier 1y ago
  Not entirely sure: everywhere I read about solar + storage, there are huge errors bars. Eg : https://www.lazard.com/media/eijnqja3/lazards-lcoeplus-june-2025.pdf https://www.lazard.com/media/eijnqja3/lazards-lcoeplus-june-... Solar+storage : from 50$/MWh to... 131$/MWh ! Go make a decision with something like that. The trend is clear, for sure, and it will make sense to extrapolate... Up to a point, as usual. (baring one of the "breakthroughs" that make it to the HN top page on e in a while and never materialize... Sigh)
- IshKebab 1y ago
  Night, sure. Doesn't work in winter though. (Not that that means we should stop building solar - we're still far from the point where it wouldn't make sense to build any more solar because we can't store the energy.)
  - gpm 1y ago
    If you're bordering on the article circle, yes. Otherwise you just have to overbuild a bit more.
    - IshKebab 1y ago
      I live in the UK. The ratio between solar output on a typically sunny summer day and a typical cloudy winter day is about 20. So your "a bit" is doing a hell of a lot of work there.
      - nasmorn 1y ago
        Globally seen the Uk is close to the arctic circle. It is one of the worst cases
        IshKebab 1y ago
        Right but it's not exactly the latitude that's the issue. On sunny days in winter I get plenty of power. The issue is the weather - only about 1/3 of the days in winter are sunny.
        gpm 1y ago
        Yeah, my comment was a simplification - like most things trying to describe local effects globally are. The UK doubles as unusually cloudy weather and relatively short days.