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I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs, but retaliatory violence is (1) still immoral and (2) self-defeating. You aren’t re

by newAccount2025 1y ago

I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs, but retaliatory violence is (1) still immoral and (2) self-defeating. You aren’t realistically going to overpower them, so any violent resistance just helps them DARVO harder and excuse escalating their brutality. That’s why they’re always so eager to find or create violent one-offs within non-violent mass protests.

esseph 1y ago
There's more than 340 million people in the US and only a handful are ICE. All it would take is one bad day for anybody in ICE to be afraid to show up to work.
- aspenmayer 1y ago
  Deportation is a kind of draft, in that deportees are treated similarly to draft dodgers. ICE aren’t MPs, but in this analogy, they largely are folks who have already been drafted themselves, and who have reported for duty. A bad day at work is just more contact with the “enemy” and is desired by some to separate the weekend warriors from the true believers. The fog of war is obscuring the reality of the outbreak of conflict which has been brewing under the surface for many years. The revolution will not be televised because it won’t look like a revolution. It’ll look like C-SPAN. Whatever ICE is doing isn’t a revolution, it’s administrative. People voted for this, and they got it. If people want change, make it happen the way that other changes happen that stick. The lesson of Arab Spring is that even with the military on your side, revolution breaks the status quo, and once broken, norms change because the power structure has changed. Most folks don’t want revolution, they just want a vacation from reality. No one wants to put in the work to make revolutions happen because it’s a lot of paperwork, rehearsals, and standing around. It feels like work because it is. All that effort makes it look natural and inevitable, but that’s the magic of make believe. A bad day at work as you suggest would be a magic act, but who’s gonna put in the work to pull that rabbit out of that hat? And who benefits from such an obvious misdirection? I was at Occupy San Francisco, so I am not just asking questions, but asking you to re-examine what you believe is possible, and why you think a mock pitched battle with tin soldiers has tactical value, so I don’t know what your motive is, but I doubt you would be honest about your motives given the circumstances.
SpicyLemonZest 1y ago
As the source article covers, the Trump regime believes that merely reporting the location of an ICE officer constitutes violence against them. I don't think it's a good idea to punch your local ICE officer, and if anyone's considering it I would definitely advise them not to, but issuing a blanket condemnation of hypothetical violence is just terribly naive at this point. I'm extremely confident that, at some point before 2028, someone is going to end up in federal custody for shooting masked home invaders they had no way to know were ICE.
- AnimalMuppet 1y ago
  Hmm. So the right has come around to "speech is violence"? I guess I shouldn't be surprised.
anonfordays 1y ago
>I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs 50% of Border Patrol agents are Latino. Believing the delusion that they're racist White rednecks is buying into propaganda.
- newAccount2025 1y ago
  Are you suggesting all racists are White rednecks? Racist systems are capable of absorbing contributions from all kinds of people. Whiteness has repeatedly expanded over time.
  - anonfordays 1y ago
    >Are you suggesting all racists are White rednecks? Leftist have suggested and stated that only White people can be racist. >Whiteness has repeatedly expanded over time. Unscientific term. https://www.nas.org/blogs/article/where_did_we_get_the_idea_that_only_white_people_can_be_racist https://www.nas.org/blogs/article/where_did_we_get_the_idea_...
- dragonwriter 1y ago
  > >I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs > 50% of Border Patrol agents are Latino. Even if that was true, and relevant to their capacity to be racist thugs, Border Patrol is a unit of Customs and Border Protection (CBP)—and CBP is a different entity from ICE, at the same organizational level within the Department of Homeland Security—so it would still be a non-sequitur.
  - anonfordays 1y ago
    [flagged]
  - anonfordays 1y ago
    >Even if that was true It is true. >Border Patrol is a unit of Customs and Border Protection (CBP)—and CBP is a different entity from ICE, at the same organizational level within the Department of Homeland Security—so it would still be a non-sequitur. Not at all, 30% of ICE agents are Latino, and we were told Border Patrol and ICE are White redneck neo-Nazi racist thugs. Surprise, that delusion is objectively false given these figures. QED.

esseph 1y ago

There's more than 340 million people in the US and only a handful are ICE. All it would take is one bad day for anybody in ICE to be afraid to show up to work.

aspenmayer 1y ago
Deportation is a kind of draft, in that deportees are treated similarly to draft dodgers. ICE aren’t MPs, but in this analogy, they largely are folks who have already been drafted themselves, and who have reported for duty. A bad day at work is just more contact with the “enemy” and is desired by some to separate the weekend warriors from the true believers. The fog of war is obscuring the reality of the outbreak of conflict which has been brewing under the surface for many years. The revolution will not be televised because it won’t look like a revolution. It’ll look like C-SPAN. Whatever ICE is doing isn’t a revolution, it’s administrative. People voted for this, and they got it. If people want change, make it happen the way that other changes happen that stick. The lesson of Arab Spring is that even with the military on your side, revolution breaks the status quo, and once broken, norms change because the power structure has changed. Most folks don’t want revolution, they just want a vacation from reality. No one wants to put in the work to make revolutions happen because it’s a lot of paperwork, rehearsals, and standing around. It feels like work because it is. All that effort makes it look natural and inevitable, but that’s the magic of make believe. A bad day at work as you suggest would be a magic act, but who’s gonna put in the work to pull that rabbit out of that hat? And who benefits from such an obvious misdirection? I was at Occupy San Francisco, so I am not just asking questions, but asking you to re-examine what you believe is possible, and why you think a mock pitched battle with tin soldiers has tactical value, so I don’t know what your motive is, but I doubt you would be honest about your motives given the circumstances.

SpicyLemonZest 1y ago

As the source article covers, the Trump regime believes that merely reporting the location of an ICE officer constitutes violence against them. I don't think it's a good idea to punch your local ICE officer, and if anyone's considering it I would definitely advise them not to, but issuing a blanket condemnation of hypothetical violence is just terribly naive at this point. I'm extremely confident that, at some point before 2028, someone is going to end up in federal custody for shooting masked home invaders they had no way to know were ICE.

AnimalMuppet 1y ago
Hmm. So the right has come around to "speech is violence"? I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

anonfordays 1y ago

>I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs 50% of Border Patrol agents are Latino. Believing the delusion that they're racist White rednecks is buying into propaganda.

newAccount2025 1y ago
Are you suggesting all racists are White rednecks? Racist systems are capable of absorbing contributions from all kinds of people. Whiteness has repeatedly expanded over time.
- anonfordays 1y ago
  >Are you suggesting all racists are White rednecks? Leftist have suggested and stated that only White people can be racist. >Whiteness has repeatedly expanded over time. Unscientific term. https://www.nas.org/blogs/article/where_did_we_get_the_idea_that_only_white_people_can_be_racist https://www.nas.org/blogs/article/where_did_we_get_the_idea_...
dragonwriter 1y ago
> >I don’t disagree with the characterization of ICE officers as racist thugs > 50% of Border Patrol agents are Latino. Even if that was true, and relevant to their capacity to be racist thugs, Border Patrol is a unit of Customs and Border Protection (CBP)—and CBP is a different entity from ICE, at the same organizational level within the Department of Homeland Security—so it would still be a non-sequitur.
- anonfordays 1y ago
  [flagged]
- anonfordays 1y ago
  >Even if that was true It is true. >Border Patrol is a unit of Customs and Border Protection (CBP)—and CBP is a different entity from ICE, at the same organizational level within the Department of Homeland Security—so it would still be a non-sequitur. Not at all, 30% of ICE agents are Latino, and we were told Border Patrol and ICE are White redneck neo-Nazi racist thugs. Surprise, that delusion is objectively false given these figures. QED.