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First of all, that statement is entirely untrue. These cars aren‘t 10k in most (all?) of the EU for example. As far as I know, these 10k cars are really only a

First of all, that statement is entirely untrue. These cars aren‘t 10k in most (all?) of the EU for example. As far as I know, these 10k cars are really only a thing in china and some SEA markets (I am not sure if these cars are really that cheap adjusted to purchasing power in these markets). Beyond that, the chinese EV brands are in market capture mode right now. The competition is cut throat and the margins are extremely thin. It‘s a market skimming strategy that will presumably be a last man standing scenario. If the winner(s) are decided, prices will definitely not remain as low as they are right now in some places.

sillystu04 1y ago
> Beyond that, the chinese EV brands are in market capture mode right now. The competition is cut throat and the margins are extremely thin. BYD is profitable. Admittedly that's more of an exception than a rule for Chinese EV brands, but BYD is also the most important. > It‘s a market skimming strategy that will presumably be a last man standing scenario. If the winner(s) are decided, prices will definitely not remain as low as they are right now in some places. Even if most of the brands disappear we're very unlikely to get to an n=1 monopoly scenario. Even a couple dozen or so companies competing in the EV space should prevent margins from getting too high. In the olden days the ICE industry was at times run by fewer than 10 companies per country, that was enough competition to prevent consumers getting too screwed by pricing.
- tpm 1y ago
  > BYD is profitable. Yes but also heavily indebted: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-19/byd-s-supply-chain-financing-masks-ballooning-debt-gmt-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-19/byd-s-sup...
WiSaGaN 1y ago
Can you name one example of a consumer product that China initially sold affordably to gain market share and then later raised prices?
- b112 1y ago
  It would be easier to mention the inverse, I'd imagine.
- moooo99 1y ago
  One recent category I just had to buy a new one: Robot Vacuums
safety1st 1y ago
American expat living in Thailand reporting in. I think the cheapest car in Thailand is the 2025 Suzuki Celerio which is a 5 seater hatchback. At the current exchange rate it's $9,800 brand new. Of course this figure is not adjusted for purchasing power (so what?). We have BYDs here and I haven't really looked at them but pretty sure a few are under $25K. If Americans can't get a new car for under $25,000 but Southeast Asia can get them for under $10K, something is wrong. If the entry level car is 2.5x more expensive in America it means Americans are getting fleeced. I haven't lived in America for a long time and I feel like this makes it very obvious to me when the BS machine over there is in full spew. Free markets drive consumer prices down to the cost of production. I don't know the auto industry in detail but it is an extensively documented fact that America has few free markets left, and they've been replaced by cartels - each industry has a couple of crooks at the top who rotate between private and public jobs. On the public side they come up with excuses to not enforce the anti-trust laws that are on the books, and they add regulations that raise the cost of business. On the private side they come up with ways to improve margins which usually involve fucking consumers. Let's not make excuses for the criminals. America needs free markets and cheaper cars. Elite lawlessness is the cause of increased costs in America.
- mlinhares 1y ago
  There are market dynamics here as well, Americans don’t want to buy a car like the Celerio, most brands have equivalent cars selling in developing countries and Europe but they don’t bring them here because Americans mostly want to buy SUVs.
  - slt2021 1y ago
    the cost to produce SUV is not significantly higher than sedan, but prices and margins are higher. so the American customer is getting fleeced on SUVs much worse than on sedan, because SUV margins are higher (and thats why OEMs are switching to SUVs)
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - 1y ago

sillystu04 1y ago

> Beyond that, the chinese EV brands are in market capture mode right now. The competition is cut throat and the margins are extremely thin. BYD is profitable. Admittedly that's more of an exception than a rule for Chinese EV brands, but BYD is also the most important. > It‘s a market skimming strategy that will presumably be a last man standing scenario. If the winner(s) are decided, prices will definitely not remain as low as they are right now in some places. Even if most of the brands disappear we're very unlikely to get to an n=1 monopoly scenario. Even a couple dozen or so companies competing in the EV space should prevent margins from getting too high. In the olden days the ICE industry was at times run by fewer than 10 companies per country, that was enough competition to prevent consumers getting too screwed by pricing.

tpm 1y ago
> BYD is profitable. Yes but also heavily indebted: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-19/byd-s-supply-chain-financing-masks-ballooning-debt-gmt-says https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-19/byd-s-sup...

WiSaGaN 1y ago

Can you name one example of a consumer product that China initially sold affordably to gain market share and then later raised prices?

b112 1y ago
It would be easier to mention the inverse, I'd imagine.
moooo99 1y ago
One recent category I just had to buy a new one: Robot Vacuums

safety1st 1y ago

American expat living in Thailand reporting in. I think the cheapest car in Thailand is the 2025 Suzuki Celerio which is a 5 seater hatchback. At the current exchange rate it's $9,800 brand new. Of course this figure is not adjusted for purchasing power (so what?). We have BYDs here and I haven't really looked at them but pretty sure a few are under $25K. If Americans can't get a new car for under $25,000 but Southeast Asia can get them for under $10K, something is wrong. If the entry level car is 2.5x more expensive in America it means Americans are getting fleeced. I haven't lived in America for a long time and I feel like this makes it very obvious to me when the BS machine over there is in full spew. Free markets drive consumer prices down to the cost of production. I don't know the auto industry in detail but it is an extensively documented fact that America has few free markets left, and they've been replaced by cartels - each industry has a couple of crooks at the top who rotate between private and public jobs. On the public side they come up with excuses to not enforce the anti-trust laws that are on the books, and they add regulations that raise the cost of business. On the private side they come up with ways to improve margins which usually involve fucking consumers. Let's not make excuses for the criminals. America needs free markets and cheaper cars. Elite lawlessness is the cause of increased costs in America.

mlinhares 1y ago
There are market dynamics here as well, Americans don’t want to buy a car like the Celerio, most brands have equivalent cars selling in developing countries and Europe but they don’t bring them here because Americans mostly want to buy SUVs.
- slt2021 1y ago
  the cost to produce SUV is not significantly higher than sedan, but prices and margins are higher. so the American customer is getting fleeced on SUVs much worse than on sedan, because SUV margins are higher (and thats why OEMs are switching to SUVs)
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- 1y ago