4 ms·

And if the parents are on valid non-resident visas? Suddenly the child has no status? Moreover, there is literally no mechanism to prove that your parents are

And if the parents are on valid non-resident visas? Suddenly the child has no status? Moreover, there is literally no mechanism to prove that your parents are citizens. Millions of citizens will be at the whim of whatever racist thug decides to hurt them that day. Welcome to Fascist America.

NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
[flagged]
themaninthedark 1y ago
I would assume that the child would be registered with the embassy that the parents are citizens of and there would be an application for a non-resident visa that would be fast tracked. Greenland, Finland, Norway and Sweden all have no concept of Jus Soli and as far as I know, kids born to non-residents aren't being deported from the hospital. >Moreover, there is literally no mechanism to prove that your parents are citizens. I would think a birth certificate would work....
- 20after4 1y ago
  > I would think a birth certificate would work Without birthright citizenship, a birth certificate no longer implies citizenship.
- slater 1y ago
  >I would think a birth certificate would work.... Remember when the whole entirety of the US right-wing lost their goddamned minds for a year or so re: a sitting president's birth certificate?
  - paulryanrogers 1y ago
    Well, having a POC as president was a pretty shocking circumstance in their minds. A means to quickly deport him was too exciting to overlook.
- ceejayoz 1y ago
  > I would think a birth certificate would work.... You'd probably be wrong. > Still, Immigration and Customs Enforcement kept Watson imprisoned as a deportable alien for nearly 3 1/2 years… Watson was correct all along: He was a U.S. citizen. https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/01/540903038/u-s-citizen-held-by-immigration-for-3-years-denied-compensation-by-appeals-court https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/01/540903038... Bonus: They held him long enough the statute of limitations to sue expired. > On Monday, an appeals court ruled that Watson, now 32, is not eligible for any of that money — because while his case is "disturbing," the statute of limitations actually expired while he was still in ICE custody without a lawyer. Even a passport isn't enough: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/hamedaleaziz/us-born-marine-ice-detained-passport https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/hamedaleaziz/us-born-ma... > A US-born Marine veteran who served in Afghanistan had his US passport, a REAL ID driver’s license, a military ID card, and his US Marine Corps dog tags with him when he was arrested by police in Grand Rapids, Michigan, and turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement, which held him for three days before his lawyer demanded his release, according to the ACLU of Michigan. https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-ice-detained-citizenship-proof.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-ice-detained-c... > In her study, she found that, on average, U.S. citizens detained by ICE spent 180 days behind bars.
- jandrewrogers 1y ago
  > I would think a birth certificate would work.... Many Americans have no birth certificate. My mother, for example.
- EasyMark 1y ago
  Right but those countries also don't have a 14th amendment either
bluecalm 1y ago
Most of the world doesn't have unconditional birth right citizenship. It somehow functions and is not fascist.
- cjk 1y ago
  The bit that’s fascist is that birthright citizenship is guaranteed in the US Constitution, and the current administration is openly flouting it.
  - Amezarak 1y ago
    The debate is over what "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" means, it's misleading to simply announce it's guaranteed - the whole legal argument is over whether it is guaranteed.
    - magicalist 1y ago
      > it's misleading to simply announce it's guaranteed. Let's not pretend all assertions are equally worth entertaining. Maybe it's "misleading" if you're Stephen Miller, but every court case where it's ever been heard and the legislative record at the time of adopting the 14th amendment show that citizenship is guaranteed. The Trump administration hasn't even raised it in appeals!
      - Amezarak 1y ago
        The author of the clause didn't think it applied to the children of aliens, so it doesn't seem crazy to me. > Howard said that the clause "is simply declaratory of what I regard as the law of the land already, that every person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States."[30] He added that citizenship "will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons"[30]—a comment which would later raise questions as to whether Congress had originally intended that U.S.-born children of foreign parents were to be included as citizens.[32]

NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago

[flagged]

themaninthedark 1y ago

I would assume that the child would be registered with the embassy that the parents are citizens of and there would be an application for a non-resident visa that would be fast tracked. Greenland, Finland, Norway and Sweden all have no concept of Jus Soli and as far as I know, kids born to non-residents aren't being deported from the hospital. >Moreover, there is literally no mechanism to prove that your parents are citizens. I would think a birth certificate would work....

20after4 1y ago
> I would think a birth certificate would work Without birthright citizenship, a birth certificate no longer implies citizenship.
slater 1y ago
>I would think a birth certificate would work.... Remember when the whole entirety of the US right-wing lost their goddamned minds for a year or so re: a sitting president's birth certificate?
- paulryanrogers 1y ago
  Well, having a POC as president was a pretty shocking circumstance in their minds. A means to quickly deport him was too exciting to overlook.
ceejayoz 1y ago
> I would think a birth certificate would work.... You'd probably be wrong. > Still, Immigration and Customs Enforcement kept Watson imprisoned as a deportable alien for nearly 3 1/2 years… Watson was correct all along: He was a U.S. citizen. https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/01/540903038/u-s-citizen-held-by-immigration-for-3-years-denied-compensation-by-appeals-court https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/01/540903038... Bonus: They held him long enough the statute of limitations to sue expired. > On Monday, an appeals court ruled that Watson, now 32, is not eligible for any of that money — because while his case is "disturbing," the statute of limitations actually expired while he was still in ICE custody without a lawyer. Even a passport isn't enough: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/hamedaleaziz/us-born-marine-ice-detained-passport https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/hamedaleaziz/us-born-ma... > A US-born Marine veteran who served in Afghanistan had his US passport, a REAL ID driver’s license, a military ID card, and his US Marine Corps dog tags with him when he was arrested by police in Grand Rapids, Michigan, and turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement, which held him for three days before his lawyer demanded his release, according to the ACLU of Michigan. https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-ice-detained-citizenship-proof.html https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/trump-ice-detained-c... > In her study, she found that, on average, U.S. citizens detained by ICE spent 180 days behind bars.
jandrewrogers 1y ago
> I would think a birth certificate would work.... Many Americans have no birth certificate. My mother, for example.
EasyMark 1y ago
Right but those countries also don't have a 14th amendment either

bluecalm 1y ago

Most of the world doesn't have unconditional birth right citizenship. It somehow functions and is not fascist.

cjk 1y ago
The bit that’s fascist is that birthright citizenship is guaranteed in the US Constitution, and the current administration is openly flouting it.
- Amezarak 1y ago
  The debate is over what "subject to the jurisdiction thereof" means, it's misleading to simply announce it's guaranteed - the whole legal argument is over whether it is guaranteed.
  - magicalist 1y ago
    > it's misleading to simply announce it's guaranteed. Let's not pretend all assertions are equally worth entertaining. Maybe it's "misleading" if you're Stephen Miller, but every court case where it's ever been heard and the legislative record at the time of adopting the 14th amendment show that citizenship is guaranteed. The Trump administration hasn't even raised it in appeals!
    - Amezarak 1y ago
      The author of the clause didn't think it applied to the children of aliens, so it doesn't seem crazy to me. > Howard said that the clause "is simply declaratory of what I regard as the law of the land already, that every person born within the limits of the United States, and subject to their jurisdiction, is by virtue of natural law and national law a citizen of the United States."[30] He added that citizenship "will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens, who belong to the families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States, but will include every other class of persons"[30]—a comment which would later raise questions as to whether Congress had originally intended that U.S.-born children of foreign parents were to be included as citizens.[32]