7 ms·

Facebook Designing New Campus

37 points by michael_fine 14y ago

fourspace 14y ago
This will most certainly be interesting to watch. My visceral reaction to the idea of one giant room was, "Wow. No thanks." I'm not personally the biggest fan of Frank Gehry's work, either. That said, I'm always a little bit excited when people push architectural boundaries, especially when it comes to workspaces. Hopefully my friends at Facebook will still be around when this is completed.
- holman 14y ago
  My visceral reaction to the idea of one giant room was "Rad". Love open floor plans. I'm really curious what the final interior plan will look like; presumably it's not some huge airplane hanger of openness but some clever way of staying open-while-interesting. Like you, though, I'm just excited at the prospect of larger companies doing something different. Should be fun to watch.
  - drgath 14y ago
    I appreciate open floor plans too, but it seems like a little too much for me. Here's a hi-res photo of the model's floorplan (which I'm sure is just a sample). http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/facebook-west-campus-smaller.png?w=4000 http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/facebook... I'll reserve final judgement until it's built and we can see pictures/video.
  - troymc 14y ago
    They (Facebook) should really look at what research has found before they jump feet-first into having an open floor plan. It's not like they've just invented it! Open floor plans were invented as a way to cram more people into less space, thereby minimizing cost of office space per employee. They were not invented to improve productivity.
    - underwater 14y ago
      Facebook offices have always been open plan. I personally like it. It can occasionally been frustrating, but overall the benefits outweigh the negatives for the way we work. I don't believe that it has ever been about minimizing costs. Many people work from home or camp out in a small meeting room if they want privacy. There are also over ear head phones available for free all around the campus.
      - troymc 14y ago
        Wikipedia has an article that links to a lot of the research on open plan offices (and other configurations): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_plan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_plan
        deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
      - drgath 14y ago
        > I don't believe that it has ever been about minimizing costs. At Facebook, no, it hasn't been. What parent is saying is that he hopes FB did some research on whether this will actually help or hurt productivity before risking the lifeblood of the company (engineer productivity).
    - coecoventures 14y ago
      37 Signals has a great approach where they have open office space, phone booths for private calls, and meeting rooms of varying sizes. Speaking of research, they should also find out how much it costs to maintain a Ghery building. If you think Facebook stock is bad now wait until you see how a Ghery building affects their bottom line.
ricardonunez 14y ago
Some of Frank Gehry's designs definitely look like the Facebook stock.
dsr_ 14y ago
I wouldn't say that this is the worst possibly use of Facebook's money, but I would rank it up there. Building a new HQ is largely an exercise in vanity and boasting. There is almost always an existing building that would serve just fine, otherwise. "The largest open floor plan in the world"? Oy. I hope they hire some good acoustics folks before they finish the planning stages.
- robryan 14y ago
  Would you say the same thing about Apple's building or is that different as they have more money to spend? I think it may be worth it, a big part of hiring the best talent now is creating an environment that they enjoy rather than dread being in. Not that the open plan office is for everyone.
  - coecoventures 14y ago
    The new Apple mothership and the Ghery Facebook HQ share an affection for poor planning. Neither will be able to accommodate future growth and renovating existing facilities will be difficult logistically. Being able to afford it today doesn't mean they'll be able to afford it in the future. Hopefully they'll be using recyclable materials since neither facility has been designed for permanence.
- kabdib 14y ago
  It's amusing to correlate "new campus" with "stock drop" in the history of Silly Valley. Atari, Apple, Sun, Cisco . . . these companies all had significant hard times about the time they started large new sets of buildings.
  - cpeterso 14y ago
    SGI built a new campus (now the Googleplex) in 1998, the same year they announced they were switching from their own MIPS processors to Itanium and shipping Windows NT workstations. In 2005, SGI was delisted from the NYSE.
  - vlad 14y ago
suyash 14y ago
Old Sun campus too small for these guys already?
- heretohelp 14y ago
  My impression was that they were only using half of that campus and that was when I visited somewhat recently. I'm not sure what the objective is here.
sudonim 14y ago
Having worked with smaller teams in open plans, and now being in a coworking space, I have to say, I don't like it. It's really easy to get distracted by the smallest movement around you, or someone having a phone call, or two people laughing. I don't think cube farms are necessarily the answer either, but without serious consideration for noise dampening, the "one giant room" will be a pretty big distraction.
staunch 14y ago
Every time I'm reminded of just how many programmers Facebook has it bothers me that he missed such a cool opportunity. He gets programming better than probably any BigCo tech CEO and yet he made the same damn mistake of hiring thousands upon thousands of programmers instead of just getting the 10X Programmers and having 1/10th as many while paying them 2x as much. Imagine if the budget for this 5000 person building was spent to house 500 people. It could make Google's campuses look downright spartan. It would make everything else a distant second choice for most people.
- nostrademons 14y ago
  I've wondered what it'd be like to have a company that capped its growth at around 500 people, but made damn sure that those 500 were among the brightest in the world. Would it be an innovation think tank? Or would they find that those 500 brilliant people spend so much time doing drudge work that they can't get any actual work done? Or would they just automate all the drudge work away? I imagine it might be a little like RenTech in the financial world, which according to Wikipedia has only 275 employees and $23B in assets under management, for roughly $100M/employee. Wonder how that would translate to an organization focused around building actual products for people.
  - evoxed 14y ago
    > Or would they find that those 500 brilliant people spend so much time doing drudge work that they can't get any actual work done? [Maybe] Not if a couple of those brightest 500 have enough respect for and include amongst them a couple of the world's most dedicated and efficient administrative assistants.
  - carterschonwald 14y ago
    Theres also Valve Software (read their lovely handbook! http://newcdn.flamehaus.com/Valve_Handbook_LowRes.pdf http://newcdn.flamehaus.com/Valve_Handbook_LowRes.pdf). They (to my knowledge) only hire folks who're at senior grade in terms of their skills. Also Valve software just generally sounds like an amazing work environment. aside/caveat: I'm aiming to create just such an organization (operationally structured a la Valve) in terms of caliber of folks in NYC with WellPosed. I'm settling for nothing less than having an organization dedicated to building tools/products meant to make innovation happen faster on our wee world. I'm starting with fixing machine learning / numerical computation, BUT done right, rather than automagic bullshit everyone in "big data" keeps jerking off to the press :) It looks like I'll be able to get things off the ground sans investors too (which is kinda key for what I want to do forever). Any NYC area senior grade awesome folks who like work broadly deep across math, cs, engineering things nicely and sane work expectations etc a la the organization referenced above, shoot me an email and chat, Please I'm working to create something special that I want to last forever, and I need the most amazing people on the planet to make it happen :) (pardon my reply turning self promoting, but I'm deadly serious about what i'm doing, and its exactly that sort of place i'm aiming to create) (also: your hypothetical lots of smart people not getting anything done is called a circle jerk, not a business that could successfully recruit amazing people and retain them.)
jacques_chester 14y ago
Honestly? It looks like a vision of hell. If there's one thing Microsoft got right, it's that they read Peopleware and took it at least half seriously.
- lovskogen 14y ago
  Could you elaborate on the design?
bengl3rt 14y ago
Where is this thing supposed to go? Are they designing to a particular site?
FaceKicker 14y ago
I think I understand the reasoning behind open floor plans, but what's the point of having everyone in a single mega-room? It's not like the two people in opposite corners of the hangar will be able to communicate seamlessly just because they're in the same "room"; they'll have to walk over to one another just the same as they would if they had walls separating them. (Of course being in the same room doesn't hurt in that respect either, but partitions have other advantages as well, e.g., aesthetics and noise.)
- thinkingisfun 14y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon
brandoncapecci 14y ago
Reminds me a lot of this: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gAOnHhen4zY/S9r-pZcS6bI/AAAAAAAAAA0/zvIvuyTfkZM/s1600/cafo.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gAOnHhen4zY/S9r-pZcS6bI/AAAAAAAAAA... Open floor plans don't make collaboration any easier. You still have to walk over to the other person just now, you must also try and hear yourself think over the hundreds of other people inside a hanger. This is the epitome the of a cog in the machine work environment to maximize people per square foot. It's degrading but in a way that's quite fitting for the way Facebook is going right now.
blancarro 14y ago
when a tech company builds a new campus, that's it. All downhill (further downhill).
caycep 14y ago
Hope it holds up better than the MIT Strata Center...
spitfire 14y ago
Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment! Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment! Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment!
nickm12 14y ago
I worked for a number of years in the MIT Stata Center, an office building designed by Gehry. It was a trainwreck on so many levels. This article (http://www.fastcompany.com/641146/lost-funhouse http://www.fastcompany.com/641146/lost-funhouse ) details the some of the construction issues, but even if the building had been watertight, on budget, and on time, the design itself made it difficult to work in.
- coecoventures 14y ago
  Indeed. The quality of design affects the quality of construction. The cost per square foot is typically shocking and the Ghery definitely places form over function. After visiting many buildings by Ghery, Hadid, Holl, and Libeskind I've found them all to be lacking. If you prefer modern design with refinement seek out Ando or Meier. There are plenty of others, as well, who have much more talent.
  - rdl 14y ago
    The Norman Foster buildings I've been in have been pretty good. Apple made the right choice. I wonder if there will be some amazing Chinese architects in the next decades, given their pace of construction.
    - coecoventures 14y ago
      Foster as well as Piano have some very refined work. Foster is at his best when doing renovations and additions. He has a very delicate approach which is handsome and actually celebrates and enhances the existing structure. I'm still waiting for some great Chinese architects to step up. They aren't given much room to flex their talents, however, due to the very brand conscious nature of the consumer. For instance there is a recently completed Ghery building here in Hong Kong with a flat on the 8th floor listed for $400 million Hong Kong Dollars, or roughly $51.5 million USD. Insane. But that's what the market is after.
- rdl 14y ago
  Yeah, Gehry made I.M. Pei look practical and user-driven, which is probably his greatest achievement to date. (Some of the Pei buildings were decent, but really none of the newer MIT buildings were all that great. Building 20 actually exceeded most of the new buildings in functionality, and it was a wooden shack. Even the "core" buildings around the IC are kind of defective in a lot of ways. Sad for a university with an architecture school.)
zerostar07 14y ago
What's with the high voltage lines right next to the building? Or is it something else?
dredmorbius 14y ago
Here's the design which would truly reflect the vision and dynamism of the company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon http://thesocietypages.org/cyborgology/2011/01/05/surveillance-entertainment-a-panopticon-in-the-clouds/ http://thesocietypages.org/cyborgology/2011/01/05/surveillan...

37 points by michael_fine 14y ago

This will most certainly be interesting to watch. My visceral reaction to the idea of one giant room was, "Wow. No thanks." I'm not personally the biggest fan of Frank Gehry's work, either. That said, I'm always a little bit excited when people push architectural boundaries, especially when it comes to workspaces. Hopefully my friends at Facebook will still be around when this is completed.

holman 14y ago
My visceral reaction to the idea of one giant room was "Rad". Love open floor plans. I'm really curious what the final interior plan will look like; presumably it's not some huge airplane hanger of openness but some clever way of staying open-while-interesting. Like you, though, I'm just excited at the prospect of larger companies doing something different. Should be fun to watch.
- drgath 14y ago
  I appreciate open floor plans too, but it seems like a little too much for me. Here's a hi-res photo of the model's floorplan (which I'm sure is just a sample). http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/facebook-west-campus-smaller.png?w=4000 http://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/facebook... I'll reserve final judgement until it's built and we can see pictures/video.
- troymc 14y ago
  They (Facebook) should really look at what research has found before they jump feet-first into having an open floor plan. It's not like they've just invented it! Open floor plans were invented as a way to cram more people into less space, thereby minimizing cost of office space per employee. They were not invented to improve productivity.
  - underwater 14y ago
    Facebook offices have always been open plan. I personally like it. It can occasionally been frustrating, but overall the benefits outweigh the negatives for the way we work. I don't believe that it has ever been about minimizing costs. Many people work from home or camp out in a small meeting room if they want privacy. There are also over ear head phones available for free all around the campus.
    - troymc 14y ago
      Wikipedia has an article that links to a lot of the research on open plan offices (and other configurations): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_plan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_plan
      - deleted 14y ago
        [deleted]
    - drgath 14y ago
      > I don't believe that it has ever been about minimizing costs. At Facebook, no, it hasn't been. What parent is saying is that he hopes FB did some research on whether this will actually help or hurt productivity before risking the lifeblood of the company (engineer productivity).
  - coecoventures 14y ago
    37 Signals has a great approach where they have open office space, phone booths for private calls, and meeting rooms of varying sizes. Speaking of research, they should also find out how much it costs to maintain a Ghery building. If you think Facebook stock is bad now wait until you see how a Ghery building affects their bottom line.

ricardonunez 14y ago

Some of Frank Gehry's designs definitely look like the Facebook stock.

dsr_ 14y ago

I wouldn't say that this is the worst possibly use of Facebook's money, but I would rank it up there. Building a new HQ is largely an exercise in vanity and boasting. There is almost always an existing building that would serve just fine, otherwise. "The largest open floor plan in the world"? Oy. I hope they hire some good acoustics folks before they finish the planning stages.

robryan 14y ago
Would you say the same thing about Apple's building or is that different as they have more money to spend? I think it may be worth it, a big part of hiring the best talent now is creating an environment that they enjoy rather than dread being in. Not that the open plan office is for everyone.
- coecoventures 14y ago
  The new Apple mothership and the Ghery Facebook HQ share an affection for poor planning. Neither will be able to accommodate future growth and renovating existing facilities will be difficult logistically. Being able to afford it today doesn't mean they'll be able to afford it in the future. Hopefully they'll be using recyclable materials since neither facility has been designed for permanence.
kabdib 14y ago
It's amusing to correlate "new campus" with "stock drop" in the history of Silly Valley. Atari, Apple, Sun, Cisco . . . these companies all had significant hard times about the time they started large new sets of buildings.
- cpeterso 14y ago
  SGI built a new campus (now the Googleplex) in 1998, the same year they announced they were switching from their own MIPS processors to Itanium and shipping Windows NT workstations. In 2005, SGI was delisted from the NYSE.
- vlad 14y ago

suyash 14y ago

Old Sun campus too small for these guys already?

heretohelp 14y ago
My impression was that they were only using half of that campus and that was when I visited somewhat recently. I'm not sure what the objective is here.

sudonim 14y ago

Having worked with smaller teams in open plans, and now being in a coworking space, I have to say, I don't like it. It's really easy to get distracted by the smallest movement around you, or someone having a phone call, or two people laughing. I don't think cube farms are necessarily the answer either, but without serious consideration for noise dampening, the "one giant room" will be a pretty big distraction.

staunch 14y ago

Every time I'm reminded of just how many programmers Facebook has it bothers me that he missed such a cool opportunity. He gets programming better than probably any BigCo tech CEO and yet he made the same damn mistake of hiring thousands upon thousands of programmers instead of just getting the 10X Programmers and having 1/10th as many while paying them 2x as much. Imagine if the budget for this 5000 person building was spent to house 500 people. It could make Google's campuses look downright spartan. It would make everything else a distant second choice for most people.

nostrademons 14y ago
I've wondered what it'd be like to have a company that capped its growth at around 500 people, but made damn sure that those 500 were among the brightest in the world. Would it be an innovation think tank? Or would they find that those 500 brilliant people spend so much time doing drudge work that they can't get any actual work done? Or would they just automate all the drudge work away? I imagine it might be a little like RenTech in the financial world, which according to Wikipedia has only 275 employees and $23B in assets under management, for roughly $100M/employee. Wonder how that would translate to an organization focused around building actual products for people.
- evoxed 14y ago
  > Or would they find that those 500 brilliant people spend so much time doing drudge work that they can't get any actual work done? [Maybe] Not if a couple of those brightest 500 have enough respect for and include amongst them a couple of the world's most dedicated and efficient administrative assistants.
- carterschonwald 14y ago
  Theres also Valve Software (read their lovely handbook! http://newcdn.flamehaus.com/Valve_Handbook_LowRes.pdf http://newcdn.flamehaus.com/Valve_Handbook_LowRes.pdf). They (to my knowledge) only hire folks who're at senior grade in terms of their skills. Also Valve software just generally sounds like an amazing work environment. aside/caveat: I'm aiming to create just such an organization (operationally structured a la Valve) in terms of caliber of folks in NYC with WellPosed. I'm settling for nothing less than having an organization dedicated to building tools/products meant to make innovation happen faster on our wee world. I'm starting with fixing machine learning / numerical computation, BUT done right, rather than automagic bullshit everyone in "big data" keeps jerking off to the press :) It looks like I'll be able to get things off the ground sans investors too (which is kinda key for what I want to do forever). Any NYC area senior grade awesome folks who like work broadly deep across math, cs, engineering things nicely and sane work expectations etc a la the organization referenced above, shoot me an email and chat, Please I'm working to create something special that I want to last forever, and I need the most amazing people on the planet to make it happen :) (pardon my reply turning self promoting, but I'm deadly serious about what i'm doing, and its exactly that sort of place i'm aiming to create) (also: your hypothetical lots of smart people not getting anything done is called a circle jerk, not a business that could successfully recruit amazing people and retain them.)

jacques_chester 14y ago

Honestly? It looks like a vision of hell. If there's one thing Microsoft got right, it's that they read Peopleware and took it at least half seriously.

lovskogen 14y ago
Could you elaborate on the design?

bengl3rt 14y ago

Where is this thing supposed to go? Are they designing to a particular site?

FaceKicker 14y ago

I think I understand the reasoning behind open floor plans, but what's the point of having everyone in a single mega-room? It's not like the two people in opposite corners of the hangar will be able to communicate seamlessly just because they're in the same "room"; they'll have to walk over to one another just the same as they would if they had walls separating them. (Of course being in the same room doesn't hurt in that respect either, but partitions have other advantages as well, e.g., aesthetics and noise.)

thinkingisfun 14y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon

brandoncapecci 14y ago

Reminds me a lot of this: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gAOnHhen4zY/S9r-pZcS6bI/AAAAAAAAAA0/zvIvuyTfkZM/s1600/cafo.jpg http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gAOnHhen4zY/S9r-pZcS6bI/AAAAAAAAAA... Open floor plans don't make collaboration any easier. You still have to walk over to the other person just now, you must also try and hear yourself think over the hundreds of other people inside a hanger. This is the epitome the of a cog in the machine work environment to maximize people per square foot. It's degrading but in a way that's quite fitting for the way Facebook is going right now.

blancarro 14y ago

when a tech company builds a new campus, that's it. All downhill (further downhill).

caycep 14y ago

Hope it holds up better than the MIT Strata Center...

spitfire 14y ago

Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment! Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment! Corporate accounts payable Nina speaking... Just a moment!

nickm12 14y ago

I worked for a number of years in the MIT Stata Center, an office building designed by Gehry. It was a trainwreck on so many levels. This article (http://www.fastcompany.com/641146/lost-funhouse http://www.fastcompany.com/641146/lost-funhouse ) details the some of the construction issues, but even if the building had been watertight, on budget, and on time, the design itself made it difficult to work in.

coecoventures 14y ago
Indeed. The quality of design affects the quality of construction. The cost per square foot is typically shocking and the Ghery definitely places form over function. After visiting many buildings by Ghery, Hadid, Holl, and Libeskind I've found them all to be lacking. If you prefer modern design with refinement seek out Ando or Meier. There are plenty of others, as well, who have much more talent.
- rdl 14y ago
  The Norman Foster buildings I've been in have been pretty good. Apple made the right choice. I wonder if there will be some amazing Chinese architects in the next decades, given their pace of construction.
  - coecoventures 14y ago
    Foster as well as Piano have some very refined work. Foster is at his best when doing renovations and additions. He has a very delicate approach which is handsome and actually celebrates and enhances the existing structure. I'm still waiting for some great Chinese architects to step up. They aren't given much room to flex their talents, however, due to the very brand conscious nature of the consumer. For instance there is a recently completed Ghery building here in Hong Kong with a flat on the 8th floor listed for $400 million Hong Kong Dollars, or roughly $51.5 million USD. Insane. But that's what the market is after.
rdl 14y ago
Yeah, Gehry made I.M. Pei look practical and user-driven, which is probably his greatest achievement to date. (Some of the Pei buildings were decent, but really none of the newer MIT buildings were all that great. Building 20 actually exceeded most of the new buildings in functionality, and it was a wooden shack. Even the "core" buildings around the IC are kind of defective in a lot of ways. Sad for a university with an architecture school.)

zerostar07 14y ago

What's with the high voltage lines right next to the building? Or is it something else?

dredmorbius 14y ago

Here's the design which would truly reflect the vision and dynamism of the company: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panopticon http://thesocietypages.org/cyborgology/2011/01/05/surveillance-entertainment-a-panopticon-in-the-clouds/ http://thesocietypages.org/cyborgology/2011/01/05/surveillan...